^Hahaha I just worked a really long shift and I was wondering if I was losing it. I see a number one in my near future and that one was calling my name... I just remembered thinking "why would cfbmi sell a gun, if he can't cook up a good load for it I'm ####ed"
Suggestions for a "big and slow" caliber?
- Thread starter Suther
- Start date
- Location
- In the shadows of the Rockies
I sure like my 9.3x74R Ruger No.1-S. Adequate power to break shoulders on heavy game except at longer ranges. Glad I picked mine up new a while back - it has appreciated in value. These aren't getting any cheaper. 
http://store.prophetriver.com/ruger-1-s-9-3x74r-wd-bl-22/
http://store.prophetriver.com/ruger-1-s-9-3x74r-wd-bl-22/
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AHHHHHHHHHH..........that is part of the estate of a good buddy who passed away and I was selling them for the widow. Unfortunately that was in the Yukon and I have been unable to assist further since coming back to B.C. in mid November. If you are really interested in it PM me.........
First off, I want to say wow. I am surprised at how much traction this post got. I must say thank you to all of you for contributing. Dogleg, C-FBMI and Ardent all have me considering the 375 H&H now... Although I'll have to get a heavier rifle than say a 35 rem or a 9.3x57 would be, the capabilities of the cartridge are hard to ignore.
Its not the recoil, per say. I can shoot MOA groups with my friends Browning 300wm from the bench and its not a painful ordeal or anything, I just like spending time at the range. I bought the 243 because it was cheaper to reload for, and the lower amount of recoil allows me for more trigger time. The 243 was bought as a high volume range toy, thats why recoil was a factor.
Not my cup of tea currently. Too much caliber for the energy. You're almost talking big bore revolver energies and trajectories. This is the sort of caliber I would buy as a novelty, and to show off to friends that I introduce to guns, but it wouldn't be on my list of rifles I'm taking hunting over what I have.
Due to the rifle prices, this was my first idea. Seems to fit the bill for what I'm after. I'm not so sure now though. I'm questioning which is more important compared to what I already have - weight or power?
I feel like I need to address a few things. First, recoil. Recoil isn't a big issue, but one of the things I was looking for was a rifle that wasn't particularly heavy, as my hunting usually involves a lot of walking. That said, I'm willing to carry more weight if the capability of the rifle is worth the extra weight. I like lighter rifles, but its not the number one criteria.
Second is money. Yes, I'm a cheap bastard. That said, hunting season just ended and I have at least a few months to save money before I'll feel like I need to buy something. I could buy a cheap rifle for TradeEx now in 9.3x57, and piece together the rest of the setup over the next handful of weeks, but I could also just save my money and buy something more expensive later. I think you guys have convinced me to at least wait, and consider the 375.
Now, as for the "slow" criteria. Everyone has heard the whole "Eat up to the hole" talk with the slow big bore calibers(Specifically the 45/70). My criteria is something like that. I would like to see for myself the differences between what a 270 or 30-06 does vs something that is significantly bigger but slower. That said, I do hand load, so I could download. That might be an option to get me used to the rifle without beating me up with recoil on one of the larger calibers.
Its not the recoil, per say. I can shoot MOA groups with my friends Browning 300wm from the bench and its not a painful ordeal or anything, I just like spending time at the range. I bought the 243 because it was cheaper to reload for, and the lower amount of recoil allows me for more trigger time. The 243 was bought as a high volume range toy, thats why recoil was a factor.
Not my cup of tea currently. Too much caliber for the energy. You're almost talking big bore revolver energies and trajectories. This is the sort of caliber I would buy as a novelty, and to show off to friends that I introduce to guns, but it wouldn't be on my list of rifles I'm taking hunting over what I have.
Due to the rifle prices, this was my first idea. Seems to fit the bill for what I'm after. I'm not so sure now though. I'm questioning which is more important compared to what I already have - weight or power?
I feel like I need to address a few things. First, recoil. Recoil isn't a big issue, but one of the things I was looking for was a rifle that wasn't particularly heavy, as my hunting usually involves a lot of walking. That said, I'm willing to carry more weight if the capability of the rifle is worth the extra weight. I like lighter rifles, but its not the number one criteria.
Second is money. Yes, I'm a cheap bastard. That said, hunting season just ended and I have at least a few months to save money before I'll feel like I need to buy something. I could buy a cheap rifle for TradeEx now in 9.3x57, and piece together the rest of the setup over the next handful of weeks, but I could also just save my money and buy something more expensive later. I think you guys have convinced me to at least wait, and consider the 375.
Now, as for the "slow" criteria. Everyone has heard the whole "Eat up to the hole" talk with the slow big bore calibers(Specifically the 45/70). My criteria is something like that. I would like to see for myself the differences between what a 270 or 30-06 does vs something that is significantly bigger but slower. That said, I do hand load, so I could download. That might be an option to get me used to the rifle without beating me up with recoil on one of the larger calibers.
Hand Skills
CGN Regular
- Location
- In the 'heartland', southern SK
It's been said before, but what you described in your original post was a .358
If you like to reload, it is not going to get any more frugal than cast bullets and 10gr of pistol powder (or 20gr shotgun) in a .358
You already have a 'volume' shooter though, and if you are only going to shoot a few boxes of shells through the big gun every year then go big! Yes, .45-70.
Don't get me wrong, I love the .375 H&H, but not only is it EXPENSIVE to shoot, balistically it's an overgrown 30-06.
If you want something big and slow, get something big and slow, and worry not about copper fouling any mo'!
If you like to reload, it is not going to get any more frugal than cast bullets and 10gr of pistol powder (or 20gr shotgun) in a .358
You already have a 'volume' shooter though, and if you are only going to shoot a few boxes of shells through the big gun every year then go big! Yes, .45-70.
Don't get me wrong, I love the .375 H&H, but not only is it EXPENSIVE to shoot, balistically it's an overgrown 30-06.
If you want something big and slow, get something big and slow, and worry not about copper fouling any mo'!
- Location
- In the shadows of the Rockies
9.3x57 factory load is a 286gr bullet at 2000 fps. A bit light maybe. However the 358 Winchester handloaded can fire a 310gr bullet at 2100 fps which is how I load my BLR, and is an adequate heavy game round because properly loaded and on a broadside shot it has sufficient power to break both shoulders on heavy game for a 1 shot DRT kill but only at close range. As mentioned the 358 advantage over the 9.3 is the wide range of bullets available.
Currently 1 vendor has three lovely 358 rifles available.
http://store.prophetriver.com/ruger-m77-358win-wd-bl-2016-edition-basket-weave-checkering-one-of-150-22-s-n-7120355/
Currently 1 vendor has three lovely 358 rifles available.
http://store.prophetriver.com/ruger-m77-358win-wd-bl-2016-edition-basket-weave-checkering-one-of-150-22-s-n-7120355/
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9.3x57 factory load is a 286gr bullet at 2000 fps. A bit light maybe. However the 358 Winchester handloaded can fire a 310gr bullet at 2100 fps which is how I load my BLR, and is an adequate heavy game round because properly loaded and on a broadside shot it has sufficient power to break both shoulders on heavy game for a 1 shot DRT kill but only at close range. As mentioned the 358 advantage over the 9.3 is the wide range of bullets available.
Currently 1 vendor has three lovely 358 rifles available.
http://store.prophetriver.com/ruger-m77-358win-wd-bl-2016-edition-basket-weave-checkering-one-of-150-22-s-n-7120355/
I have serious doubt that a 9.3x57 loaded to those specs will be too light for north American game when shot at distances appropriate for the original open iron sights.
Yep, have 2 of them from Tradex. I reload with cast NOE gas check 286 grain bullets, but a decent selection of bullets available from various manufacturers.
Dies available, and brass can be the once fired 9.3 or just get 8x57 Mauser and expand the necks.
Quality light weight rifles with a caliber that's a proven game getter.
A good selection of them on the Tradex (T.E.C Trade Ex Canada Inc.) website right now and it won't break the bank.
- Location
- In the shadows of the Rockies
^^
Several under 3 notes but most with cracked stocks. Why buy distressed merchandise?
https://www.tradeexcanada.com/produits/95
Several under 3 notes but most with cracked stocks. Why buy distressed merchandise?
https://www.tradeexcanada.com/produits/95
As do I
Only takes a few threads and it is easy to see how some are stuck in their ways, citing decades of experience as an excuse to not accept experience of others.
But this is the internet,where people are victims of their self perceived notions of a person based on their dreamt up opinions generated by their own minds taking posts out of context, rather than at face value from an equally experienced person
I should have read further into your post to see what calibers you were considering, as it appears you have no issue with recoil as posted initially......
I see tradex rifles being brought up and I do not consider that to be light, "light" to me is under 7lbs. I have shot many of the calibers being suggested, many of them in a rifle under 7 lbs and I do not consider them to be obnoxious, but with your initial post In regards to recoil, I believed they were not on the "table"
Now I see this was not about a truly light rifle with low recoil, just a rifle that meets your criteria as you perceive it.
^^
Several under 3 notes but most with cracked stocks. Why buy distressed merchandise?
https://www.tradeexcanada.com/produits/95
For around $400 I got an uncracked early model in factory form.
For the same dollars a guy could buy a beat up 3030 or a disposable savage axis. Hard to find much fault in the purchase.
9.3x57 factory load is a 286gr bullet at 2000 fps. A bit light maybe. However the 358 Winchester handloaded can fire a 310gr bullet at 2100 fps which is how I load my BLR, and is an adequate heavy game round because properly loaded and on a broadside shot it has sufficient power to break both shoulders on heavy game for a 1 shot DRT kill but only at close range. As mentioned the 358 advantage over the 9.3 is the wide range of bullets available.
Currently 1 vendor has three lovely 358 rifles available.
http://store.prophetriver.com/ruger-m77-358win-wd-bl-2016-edition-basket-weave-checkering-one-of-150-22-s-n-7120355/
With any bullet weight the 9.3x57 will be able to outpace the 358 having both a larger bore and more case capacity. And there is no doubt that an older Mauser is a nicer rifle than a BLR.
I decided to go to big and slow this year as well.
416 Ruger in a Alaskan.
Wanted to be different. Had lots of the fast and flat, but the majority of my hunting is in the bush where 200 yards if the farthest. I also wanted a bear stopper when I am out on my horse in Sheep country. My brother and I sheep hunt together and bought a Kimber Andronidak in 308 as our main sheep rifle, so he will carry this and I will carry the 416. We will see how it turns out this coming year.
I got this as I missed a few available deer this year in the bush because I could not find them quick enough in the scope of my 338ultra.
So I am glad to have ordered in the 416.
416 Ruger in a Alaskan.
Wanted to be different. Had lots of the fast and flat, but the majority of my hunting is in the bush where 200 yards if the farthest. I also wanted a bear stopper when I am out on my horse in Sheep country. My brother and I sheep hunt together and bought a Kimber Andronidak in 308 as our main sheep rifle, so he will carry this and I will carry the 416. We will see how it turns out this coming year.
I got this as I missed a few available deer this year in the bush because I could not find them quick enough in the scope of my 338ultra.
So I am glad to have ordered in the 416.
Big and slow...200 yards max...
As much as I love some of the cartridges being suggested here (.375H&H, 9.3x62, .358Win are all favourites), none of them even occurred to me when I read the OP's post. He's got a .270 now; an extremely versatile and capable cartridge, a do-it-all number for sure. All those other suggestions are pretty much just like that. Sure, they're a bit bigger, and maybe a bit more range-limited than a .270, but they are options I would consider if I were looking for a (or another...) general purpose rifle.
The only thing that really jumped to my mind when I read the post was the .45-70, in a lever or single-shot action. Somebody also mentioned 9.3x74, another nice choice, but tends to be more expensive.
Suther, you sound like you want something different...so get something different. Only you can decide if another bolt-action rifle with a slightly bigger hole in the barrel fits that criterion...but I can guaran-damn-tee you that a .45-70 will definitely be different than what you now have and are accustomed to. They are hard not to love...but if you try it and decide it's not for you, well, that's what the EE is for!
As much as I love some of the cartridges being suggested here (.375H&H, 9.3x62, .358Win are all favourites), none of them even occurred to me when I read the OP's post. He's got a .270 now; an extremely versatile and capable cartridge, a do-it-all number for sure. All those other suggestions are pretty much just like that. Sure, they're a bit bigger, and maybe a bit more range-limited than a .270, but they are options I would consider if I were looking for a (or another...) general purpose rifle.
The only thing that really jumped to my mind when I read the post was the .45-70, in a lever or single-shot action. Somebody also mentioned 9.3x74, another nice choice, but tends to be more expensive.
Suther, you sound like you want something different...so get something different. Only you can decide if another bolt-action rifle with a slightly bigger hole in the barrel fits that criterion...but I can guaran-damn-tee you that a .45-70 will definitely be different than what you now have and are accustomed to. They are hard not to love...but if you try it and decide it's not for you, well, that's what the EE is for!
Big and slow is relative I suppose. I have mostly been shooting a 6.5 Swede or a .250 Savage for deer the past few years so this year, big and slow meant a 7.62x39 in a cz carbine! Based on your .270 and the criteria you list as your standard, I would suggest a 9.3 Husky, likely a 62mm version but sometimes a really lovely 57mm rifle comes available. In either I would choose the 270 grain Speer as a standard load and have recently started to experiment with cast practice loads. My go to rifle now for black bears or moose (should I get a chance to hunt them again) would be my Husky (FN '98) in 9.3x62. Lovely, classic rifles that handle well and generally shoot great. My only concern is the stock shape has a bit more drop at the comb than I would prefer.
I have owned and used most of the Winchester large bore lever guns and I have learned that I don't want to play anymore with a heavy loaded .45-70 '86 carbine as I much prefer black powder level cast loads! I still have a great .338-06 improved on a pre-64 model 70 (that I would sell), as well as a .300 H&H but my main rifle is a custom FN 6.5 Swede. I'm sure its 140 grain, 6.5 partitions could handle any situation I expect to see (like your .270) but I like the 9.2x62 when waiting for bears over bait or if I get to call in a bull moose again. For me, it offers extra thump on target, more range than I have needed in years, and is a comfortable limit for practice and accurate shooting. Plus it is housed in a rifle almost identical to my 6.5.
Others can obviously handle recoil better and I have great respect for both them and their .375 and larger rifles, but they are not for me. Try to get out and shoot a few rifles and calibers to see what works for you as our choices are mostly subjective opinions anyways. Otherwise, we would all be shooting a .30-06 with factory 180 loads for everything. Let us know what you choose.
I have owned and used most of the Winchester large bore lever guns and I have learned that I don't want to play anymore with a heavy loaded .45-70 '86 carbine as I much prefer black powder level cast loads! I still have a great .338-06 improved on a pre-64 model 70 (that I would sell), as well as a .300 H&H but my main rifle is a custom FN 6.5 Swede. I'm sure its 140 grain, 6.5 partitions could handle any situation I expect to see (like your .270) but I like the 9.2x62 when waiting for bears over bait or if I get to call in a bull moose again. For me, it offers extra thump on target, more range than I have needed in years, and is a comfortable limit for practice and accurate shooting. Plus it is housed in a rifle almost identical to my 6.5.
Others can obviously handle recoil better and I have great respect for both them and their .375 and larger rifles, but they are not for me. Try to get out and shoot a few rifles and calibers to see what works for you as our choices are mostly subjective opinions anyways. Otherwise, we would all be shooting a .30-06 with factory 180 loads for everything. Let us know what you choose.
Ardent
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
My struggle with the 9.3x57 et al, and I spent far too much building a Satterlee 9.5x57 (.375 version) so I’m not averse to the concept, is they don’t kill any better than a 7x57 or .30-06. Nor do they truly offer a greater range of responsible shot angles, trajectory and recoil change for the worse mind you. They’re nice if you want to shoot cheap cast however, but that and keeping the loading bench standardized on .375 are the only benefits I’ve found so far. Will of course keep testing.
