Maccabee Defense SLR information and updates

[QuickDraw16]

I had a primer blow out similar to what was described above. It was very convenient to be able to separate the receiver easily without tools.
While it’s not a deal breaker for me it’s certialy something that I will consider when I decide between an SLR and an ATRS receiver.

The great thing about either option is that the rifle is what you build it to be. It can be a go to competition rifle, low budget build, gopher blaster, long range precision rig, 6.5 Grendel, 458 socom, whatever!

 

[jiffx2781]

Just a couple shots from MacDef's Instagram page with a little discussion about the takedown pin kit.

Also if you notice there is something else mentioned regarding uppers that some people may be excited about. If they come through with it I'll have to get one so my M16A2 build will look a little better

View attachment 153407 View attachment 153408

Like I said earlier, it's great to see a manufacturer listening to their customers

 

[HeadDamage]

I've had a primer pop out and get in the barrel extension of an AR15 before, major pia if the rifle was not easy to field strip.

 

[r34skyline]

It wasn’t a tear down, just opening up the action.
If this concept and one example isn’t seen as anything but a positive, well what can I say...

I understand and agree with your principles but... the lack of a qd toolless takedown seems to be grossly overblown. For basically something that offers what this offers that's the deal breaker?

 

[kagia]

For basically something that offers what this offers that's the deal breaker?

For me it is.

It's a poor design feature and it bothers me. If it was a cheap gun, I might be able to overlook it, but not something in this price range.

 

[BioPace]

Anyone looking to do a cheaper build in one of these might want to check out the stag A4 in the EE right now. Nothing to do with me, but looks like a good donor.

 

[CobraGT]

Anyone looking to do a cheaper build in one of these might want to check out the stag A4 in the EE right now. Nothing to do with me, but looks like a good donor.

That's more or less what I'm using for my build....

Receiver set ..............................................$999
Stag 20" complete upper with carry handle....$499
Stag LPK already on hand............................$125 +-
A1 rifle tube, buffer and spring.....................$77
Brownells retro brown furniture kit................$100 +-

Total........................ roughly $1800 before taxes. Not too bad for a decent quality gun.

 

[jiffx2781]

If anyone else is looking for cheap parts to do a A2 type build IRG has these;

http://www.irunguns.com/product.delton-rifle-kit-556x45

$487.44 + $25 import fee IRG charges = $512.44 USD
At the current exchange rate that comes to around $650 Canadian dollars.

Not a bad price for a complete rifle kit. Cheaper than my Stag Arms kit.

 

[beltfed]

I understand and agree with your principles but... the lack of a qd toolless takedown seems to be grossly overblown. For basically something that offers what this offers that's the deal breaker?

The bolt together receivers isn’t much of an issue for me - more like a minor annoyance.
For me it’s mostly the price, and I’m also suspect on how the trigger is going to be configured.
I have a half dozen AR-15s and while I’m interested in being able to take them off the range or deal with less B/S respecting storage under transportation, the reality is I do the majority of my shooting at the range anyhow.
For stuff off the range I have another half dozen different semi auto designs that do pretty much the same thing as an AR.

Variety - it’s the spice of life

 

[Uisge]

For me it is.

It's a poor design feature and it bothers me. If it was a cheap gun, I might be able to overlook it, but not something in this price range.

For crying out loud, if you read a bit above there is a takedown pin upgrade in the works. What are we even complaining about anymore? The cost hasn’t changed from day one. ATRS is the same price, NEA is the same price. Noveske for that matter is the same price. I have heard nothing but negativity about this project when I view it as one of the most positive developments for NR rifles, right up there with ATRS and NEA giving us what we were previously complaining we couldn’t have before, now here we are complaining about all the stupid little things it doesn’t have, over in the NEA thread complaining how the charging handle everyone was planning on changing anyway looks, over in the ATRS thread complaining it doesn’t have an FRT yet, and now me complaining my whiskey is empty and I have to go get another one... ok what was I talking about again?

 

[Kidd X]

Well, to play devils advocate...

I’ve been on the firing line in a competition where a guy blew a primer into his trigger group with an AR.

Blowing primers in such a way while not common, it’s not unusual either.
The shooter was able to quickly open the rifle up by popping the rear takedown pin, see the primer screwing up the trigger, turn it upside down and shake it out, load up and keep going.
He blew probably half of that match of 10 rounds for score, but he likely would have blew more than one match if he needed to screw around with an Allen wrench.

There is a reason that good service rifles can be taken down with little more than a round of ammo - it’s to ensure drop dead simple service in the field. If guys are taking these to the field for hunting or whatnot, there are no legitimate reasons not to try and emulate that good engineering and simplicity of use.

First off this is a rare occurrence especially if you use quality manufactured ammo. I highly doubt the shooter in question still pegged a stellar time after cracking his AR to dump the primer. Sorry, it's an anecdotal story that validates nothing. Second, you mentioned SERVICE RIFLE, which the SLR is not. It is a close r
epresentation of a service rifle, there's no free lunch(although the push pin conversion might be the free lunch).

Fill us in?

Nope... ^^^

Your example is why an AR is the rifle of choice for competitors and the SLR is something totally different.

Here's a thinker!

I've been hunting all over BC sometimes in some really crappy conditions, and I've never had a situation where I had to do a speedy teardown of a rifle. Most traditional hunting rifles are held together with screws.

If someone feels they need a rifle with pins to win competitions, they should grab their AR15.....

Agreed!

It wasn’t a tear down, just opening up the action.
If this concept and one example isn’t seen as anything but a positive, well what can I say...

Not disputing the beauty of push pins. I'm simply pointing out that it is far from being an issue to be concerned about.

I had a primer blow out similar to what was described above. It was very convenient to be able to separate the receiver easily without tools.
While it’s not a deal breaker for me it’s certialy something that I will consider when I decide between an SLR and an ATRS receiver.

The great thing about either option is that the rifle is what you build it to be. It can be a go to competition rifle, low budget build, gopher blaster, long range precision rig, 6.5 Grendel, 458 socom, whatever!

HAHA, ok well you hang in their for the ATRS receivers while the rest of us shoo the sh*t out of our SLRs. Very true on the build your own part.

For me it is.

It's a poor design feature and it bothers me. If it was a cheap gun, I might be able to overlook it, but not something in this price range.

I'm interested in all the other non res rifles that share the same attributes as an AR15, do tell??? That's right, there aren't any..

The bolt together receivers isn’t much of an issue for me - more like a minor annoyance.
For me it’s mostly the price, and I’m also suspect on how the trigger is going to be configured.
I have a half dozen AR-15s and while I’m interested in being able to take them off the range or deal with less B/S respecting storage under transportation, the reality is I do the majority of my shooting at the range anyhow.
For stuff off the range I have another half dozen different semi auto designs that do pretty much the same thing as an AR.

Variety - it’s the spice of life

The price has been explained. Odd how no one complained about the $5000 for a Modern Hunter/Varminter that uses proprietary parts...

Your usage makes the SLR less appealing, it does not however make the SLR less valuable on the whole.

I'm curious what other semi auto's you have that are non res wit the same modularity and feature set as an AR15??

ETA: Just a pro tip. If you think the value of your AR15's, Tavors, Swiss Arms, Tavor's, XCR's, MH/MV, VZ/CZ, SL8, Famae, Keltec, etc won't be taking a huge plunge in the toilet. You would be sadly mistaken. The greatly reduced price of the SLR(receiver set) with the ability to build it how you want at a price and timeline you choose has made the current non res offerings even more over priced..

 

[greentips]

ETA: Just a pro tip. If you think the value of your AR15's, Tavors, Swiss Arms, Tavor's, XCR's, MH/MV, VZ/CZ, SL8, Famae, Keltec, etc won't be taking a huge plunge in the toilet. You would be sadly mistaken. The greatly reduced price of the SLR(receiver set) with the ability to build it how you want at a price and timeline you choose has made the current non res offerings even more over priced..

You are offering a "pro tip", so you are explicitly calling yourself a "professional". Who do you work for and what company are you associated with?

 

[Brian46]

ETA: Just a pro tip. If you think the value of your AR15's, Tavors, Swiss Arms, Tavor's, XCR's, MH/MV, VZ/CZ, SL8, Famae, Keltec, etc won't be taking a huge plunge in the toilet. You would be sadly mistaken. The greatly reduced price of the SLR(receiver set) with the ability to build it how you want at a price and timeline you choose has made the current non res offerings even more over priced..

when do you expect to see the SLR drop the price of the rifles you mention?

 

[kagia]

I'm interested in all the other non res rifles that share the same attributes as an AR15, do tell??? That's right, there aren't any.

I don't even know what you're on about anymore.

I never once mentioned AR15s. All I'm talking about is having to remove bolts or screws for a simple field strip. I haven't owned them all, but of the non restricted "tactical" rifles I've owned, none have required the removal of bolts or screws for a field strip.

 

[beltfed]

Ok - the pin/bolt is being addressed with MDI.
I applaud them in taking this seemingly minor for some design feature to task and coming up with a work around.
I didn’t step in to argue with you, but just some more food for thought:

First off this is a rare occurrence especially if you use quality manufactured ammo. I highly doubt the shooter in question still pegged a stellar time after cracking his AR to dump the primer. Sorry, it's an anecdotal story that validates nothing. Second, you mentioned SERVICE RIFLE, which the SLR is not. It is a close r
epresentation of a service rifle, there's no free lunch(although the push pin conversion might be the free lunch).

Well, this is an interesting notion that the SLR is not a ‘Service Rifle’. I suppose no rifle in the hands of sportsmen are, even if they did in fact serve in the service of their countries. So let’s call every firearm out there in civilian hands a sporting rifle, even if in fact it has service lineage, which is true and correct to their use.
So the AR-15 of which this rifle is designed to replicate/replace is in fact a sporting rifle which traces its roots to a service rifle in the M16 fow. The SLR is replicating/replacing the receivers of an AR-15 and re-using all of the components of them why? To use of all of the advantages of the M-16 fow, a Service rifle design, repackaged for sporting use.
While issues with ammunition are rare, they have and do happen. Yes the story I wrote is anecdotal, so what? Does that make it any less valid? No it does not.

I'm interested in all the other non res rifles that share the same attributes as an AR15, do tell??? That's right, there aren't any..

Every firearm that uses STANAG mags for starters...so how many is that?
A few emulate fire control features and ergonomics, while some are designed to take AR internal parts or furniture.
Picatinny rails, while not exclusive to the AR, they are directly attributed to the AR vis-à-vis the M-16 fow, as are many mounts and accessories.

If you think the value of your AR15's, Tavors, Swiss Arms, Tavor's, XCR's, MH/MV, VZ/CZ, SL8, Famae, Keltec, etc won't be taking a huge plunge in the toilet. You would be sadly mistaken. The greatly reduced price of the SLR(receiver set) with the ability to build it how you want at a price and timeline you choose has made the current non res offerings even more over priced..

If these receivers were more affordable and competed directly with more economically priced AR receivers, they would certainly take a sizeable chunk out of that market, and they probably will out of other available non-restricted and restricted rifles as well.
Maybe we will see market corrections on some pricing too. Time will tell.
I remember a time not too long ago when Diamaco / Colt Canada stuff was ‘unobtanium’. You could have sold stripped receivers in limited numbers for a $1000 easy. Now they sell regularly, and they are as affordable as most any other receiver out there.
If MDI want to increase their market, pricing will probably need to come down considerably. Jmho.

 

[Uisge]

Last year prior to the release of this product, the 102 and it’s subsequent competitors modern Hunter’s and varmints seemed to sell pretty fast on the EE. That appears to have slowed down, or maybe there is just more for sale and people seek to try the new platforms. Tavors have already taken quite a plunge in used price’s as have XCR’s. With the 102, SLR, RDB and more awaiting FRT that could be attained for less than 2k anything over that price is probably going to be affected. I can tell you this, I personally would not pay the new prices for a lot of the competition. Why would I pay 3k$ for an XCR or ACR when I could build an excellent rifle for way less, same goes for the tavor/x95, with an RDB for 1500$ they are less appealing to me. I’m sure other opinions differ, but if you laid them all out on the table and said for x dollars you can get 1 of these or 2 id pick the 2, but deep down I’d want them all so there’s that too.

 

[fenceline]

Xcr prices are dropping but the lowest prices are on the oldest rifle types with quad rails and earlier features. The keymod versions are still low to mid 2g range.

I'm into my NR ACR for 1900. Restricted are cheap, barrel swaps available and R barrels sellable.

 

[Savage]

ETA: Just a pro tip. If you think the value of your AR15's, Tavors, Swiss Arms, Tavor's, XCR's, MH/MV, VZ/CZ, SL8, Famae, Keltec, etc won't be taking a huge plunge in the toilet. You would be sadly mistaken. The greatly reduced price of the SLR(receiver set) with the ability to build it how you want at a price and timeline you choose has made the current non res offerings even more over priced..

Well I think your pro trip is full of #### unless you start selling your receiver sets for 600.00 then it will hold some water.

 

[Brian46]

Well I think your pro trip is full of #### unless you start selling your receiver sets for 600.00 then it will hold some water.

Even still, not everyone wants to build, they will pay someone to build what they want and make it function flawless rather than tinker with it themselves, savings will be marginal if any

 

[Kidd X]

You are offering a "pro tip", so you are explicitly calling yourself a "professional". Who do you work for and what company are you associated with?

It's called sarcasm, wow....

when do you expect to see the SLR drop the price of the rifles you mention?

If you are inferring that MDI is in control of pricing then no, you would be wrong. The market dictates the price of products and with the SLR the 102, the wk180c and the (if it happens) ATRS receiver sets, there is little logic in paying several hundred to several thousand more for equal or lesser capable rifles. That being said there is no shortage of people who believe their used guns are worth retail prices or better, just look in the EE!!

I don't even know what you're on about anymore.

I never once mentioned AR15s. All I'm talking about is having to remove bolts or screws for a simple field strip. I haven't owned them all, but of the non restricted "tactical" rifles I've owned, none have required the removal of bolts or screws for a field strip.

Well "tactical" would indicate a service rifle in my mind, maybe it means something else in yours. Again, the issue is minor and not something to get worked up over. Oh and it is apparently being rectified.

Ok - the pin/bolt is being addressed with MDI.
I applaud them in taking this seemingly minor for some design feature to task and coming up with a work around.
I didn’t step in to argue with you, but just some more food for thought:



Well, this is an interesting notion that the SLR is not a ‘Service Rifle’. I suppose no rifle in the hands of sportsmen are, even if they did in fact serve in the service of their countries. So let’s call every firearm out there in civilian hands a sporting rifle, even if in fact it has service lineage, which is true and correct to their use.
So the AR-15 of which this rifle is designed to replicate/replace is in fact a sporting rifle which traces its roots to a service rifle in the M16 fow. The SLR is replicating/replacing the receivers of an AR-15 and re-using all of the components of them why? To use of all of the advantages of the M-16 fow, a Service rifle design, repackaged for sporting use.
While issues with ammunition are rare, they have and do happen. Yes the story I wrote is anecdotal, so what? Does that make it any less valid? No it does not.

I agree with you about the SLR and its lineage. What I'm getting at is because it is based on the AR15 FOW but not a direct copy of it there will be some differences and the lack of a push pin is one. The SLR is mimicking the AR because it's a proven design and parts are cheap and easy to source.
Every firearm that uses STANAG mags for starters...so how many is that?
A few emulate fire control features and ergonomics, while some are designed to take AR internal parts or furniture.
Picatinny rails, while not exclusive to the AR, they are directly attributed to the AR vis-à-vis the M-16 fow, as are many mounts and accessories.
STANAG refers to mag well dimensions as the NATO standard for magazine dimensions was never adopted or ratified. I would still like to hear about the other non res rifles that offer the same advantages the AR does..


If these receivers were more affordable and competed directly with more economically priced AR receivers, they would certainly take a sizeable chunk out of that market, and they probably will out of other available non-restricted and restricted rifles as well.
Maybe we will see market corrections on some pricing too. Time will tell.
I remember a time not too long ago when Diamaco / Colt Canada stuff was ‘unobtanium’. You could have sold stripped receivers in limited numbers for a $1000 easy. Now they sell regularly, and they are as affordable as most any other receiver out there.
If MDI want to increase their market, pricing will probably need to come down considerably. Jmho.
Their market competition isn't any particular make or model. The AR is a restricted rifle regardless of barrel length so there is little benefit of owning one if you don't shoot at a range. The SLR and the other new offerings are attractive because of their status, the SLR more so because it mimics the controls and parts usage of the AR.

Colt Canada was and still is a rip off. It didn't take long for the prices of their rifles to drop dramatically after the fanboy crowd finished paying stupid prices for them. Although no one who has ever willingly paid for a product has ever been ripped off. The price for a CC over any other milspec rifle(yes I said it) did not equate to a superior product.

In the Green

Well I think your pro trip is full of #### unless you start selling your receiver sets for 600.00 then it will hold some water.

I don't manufacture receivers so I'm not sure how "I" can sell them for $600. I will however answer the ignorance. The price of the receiver set has been covered before but I will explain it again. MDI has created a unique receiver design that is similar but not the same as an AR pattern rifle. MDI does not have the means nor finances to have molds made to produce castings of their receivers. A full CNC receiver set is the only option. CNC work costs more as does the billet material. MDI is a small company serving a small market(Canada) as the US have zero interest in the SLR and much the same across the rest of the planet. Cast/forged receivers like the majority if AR rifles are cheaper because they're made in bulk. There are only a handful of forging houses in the US that make ALL receivers regardless of brand. Each brand then selects and finishes them to their specs(either milspec or not). None of the above is possible in Canada as we do not have a large enough population to support large volume casting of receivers and the SLR design is but 6 months old whereas the AR design is nearly 60 years old. Paying $2-300 more than a billet AR receiver set for this unique rifle is a small price to pay for the advantages and options it provides. What other non res rifle is there with the feature set of an AR/SLR that can be built any way you want??

Even still, not everyone wants to build, they will pay someone to build what they want and make it function flawless rather than tinker with it themselves, savings will be marginal if any

I do believe MDI will be offering complete rifles as well(don't quote me on that). Having one "built"(more like assembled) is not expensive, not difficult and will still be cheaper than many of the non res offerings we have now. All while offering you the freedom to choose parts as you see fit and even calibre.