another thing about the 338 is the amount of powder it consumes, even with handloads- you only get about 100/rounds /pound, as it's about 70 grains /cartridge- that, and the price of bullets, etc- the 06 runs roughly about 50 grains and you can get bulk or surplus pull downs, or anythig else- it's like the suppliers have said" this here's a MAGNUM- let's screw the consumer over"- and that applies to all magnums- the only ones you can "get away" fairly cheaply is the 7mm and 300 mags, as there are standard cartridges in that bore diameter as well-well, maybe the 338 is going there with the federal, but i haven't seen the bullets in bulk yet
Buying a 30-06 or .338 Win Mag..
- Thread starter cbabes
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Weatherby Vanguard in 30/06 . Ask to look at the targets that come with the rifle . Mine shoots 1/2" @100 yds! It had a 3/4" target, handloading improved it. If you are worried about bigger stuff just shoot 200 gr. Partitions 
Wild_Thing
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- In the thick of it!
Rem 700 SPS DM in .30-06 with a bushnell Elite 3200 3-9x40 comes in at your price point.
- Location
- interior b.c.
Ruger mk 11 stainless in 30-06 sounds like it would fit the bill.
I too have both. The .30-06 is more than adequate for moose and anything else you'll find in Ontario. The .338 does have more thump for downing large game, but if I didn't live in BC and have grizzlies to consider, I doubt I'd have a .338. The '06 is much nicer to shoot with its lesser recoil, easier to shoot accurately, less expensive to shoot, factory or handloaded, and can be housed in a lighter rifle while still having less recoil.
I bought my .338 as a step up from the .30-06 for moose, elk, grizz etc. It is not intended to replace my '06 for deer, and I have no problem shooting anything in BC with my .30-06. Think of the .338 as a compliment to the .30-06, not a replacement for it. While it will do anything an '06 will, it is far more than necessary for most situations.
You could split the difference and buy a .300 mag, which combines more energy than the '06 and a flatter trajectory, but doesn't have the heavy bullets found in the larger .338.
If I were you, I'd buy an '06 now, use it for a while, kill some game with it and see if you really feel the need for anything more powerful. I know I could likely use my .30-06 for all my hunting (in BC, possibly excepting the g-bears) from now till I die and only find it lacking at long shots past 400 yards.
I bought my .338 as a step up from the .30-06 for moose, elk, grizz etc. It is not intended to replace my '06 for deer, and I have no problem shooting anything in BC with my .30-06. Think of the .338 as a compliment to the .30-06, not a replacement for it. While it will do anything an '06 will, it is far more than necessary for most situations.
You could split the difference and buy a .300 mag, which combines more energy than the '06 and a flatter trajectory, but doesn't have the heavy bullets found in the larger .338.
If I were you, I'd buy an '06 now, use it for a while, kill some game with it and see if you really feel the need for anything more powerful. I know I could likely use my .30-06 for all my hunting (in BC, possibly excepting the g-bears) from now till I die and only find it lacking at long shots past 400 yards.
Then go straight pass both and get a 375 H&H. That will do for everything in Canada, inculding if you ever want to get a Polar bear!
Interesting comment.
Most people that use both 338 and 300 mags find little to no difference difference between them in killing ability (with premium heavy weight bullets)?
Did you have some sort of experience leading you to this opinion?
Just curious.
- Location
- Somewhere on the Hudson Bay Coast
My point is that a .30/06 can make 2500 fps with a 220 gr bullet, a .300 magnum can make 2500 with a 240 gr bullet, a .338 can make 2500 with a 250 gr bullet and a .375 can make 2500 with a 300 gr bullet, when each cartridge is loaded to similar pressures. For the sake of comparison, if not actual killing power this results in:
220/.308@2500=3055 ft/lbs
240/.308@2500=3333 ft/lbs
250/.338@2500=3472 ft/lbs
300/.375@2500=4166 ft/lbs
Based on this, we would expect the .300 and the .338 to perform in a similar manner provided their bullets were similar in profile and construction. The .30/06 does lag a little behind, and the .375 would create a wound cavity of greater volume if it's bullet was similar in profile and construction to the .308 and .338 bullets.
I also prefer the .375 to the .338 but neither is my recomendation for beginners. The 30-06 is the cartridge for people who don't know what they want, the .338 and .375 are cartridges for those that know exactly what they want, and have a hardened shoulder to go with it.
I agree the, .30-06 is King.
If it were me I'd check the Hunting Rifle Equipment Exchange and see if there's a good used one in there. Remington M-700, Ruger M-77, Winchester M-70, Browning BAR or A-Bolt, are all good.
Savage makes a good rifle too but some of their cheaper "Tupperware" stocked stuff should be viewed as what it is, bargain stuff IMHO.
Avoid Remington 710's and 770's.
If it were me I'd check the Hunting Rifle Equipment Exchange and see if there's a good used one in there. Remington M-700, Ruger M-77, Winchester M-70, Browning BAR or A-Bolt, are all good.
Savage makes a good rifle too but some of their cheaper "Tupperware" stocked stuff should be viewed as what it is, bargain stuff IMHO.
Avoid Remington 710's and 770's.
Thanks!
I agree the, .30-06 is King.
If it were me I'd check the Hunting Rifle Equipment Exchange and see if there's a good used one in there. Remington M-700, Ruger M-77, Winchester M-70, Browning BAR or A-Bolt, are all good.
Savage makes a good rifle too but some of their cheaper "Tupperware" stocked stuff should be viewed as what it is, bargain stuff IMHO.
Avoid Remington 710's and 770's.
Definately not argueing with facts, other than the 338 will do 2700+ with 250s so energy would be very close to 4000 ft/lbs. I totaly agree bigger is always better.
Back to cbabes...........
OK I am going to take everything you have written as true, and not the musings of some pimple-faced teenager with a rabid imagination, a Daisy Red Ryder, and a chubby in his pants.
You are getting some excellent advice here, more so than in a lot of threads that I have had the pleasure of reading here on Gun Nutz for a number of years. I am going to add some more free advice, worth what you paid for it:
Since you live in Oshawa, according to your screen ID, you are within close driving distance to hundreds of gun owners and a bunch of ranges. If you are not already a member of a gun club (range) I very strongly suggest you join one, as an extremely important first step. Then let your fellow firearms enthusiasts know that you have this dilemma about what gun you should buy. MOST normal gun-lovers will then tell you THEIR opinion, and let you shoot their shootin' irons. Unless you are in a hell of a hurry, you have lots of time before Ontario's big game seasons.
You have not said (or I missed it) what you intend to shoot with your gun. As others have mentioned, there is not much here in Ontario that the .30-06 (or .308) can't handle, with less cost, recoil, etc etc etc. But if you want to shoot PAPER and have a lot of fun doing it, then by golly buy any damn gun you want, shoot it, sell it and buy another, shoot it, sell it and buy another, and so on. I have been doing this for a number of years and it is a fun hobby.
But if you are a pimple-faced young puke just out to waste people's time here, like so many other young people who think nothing of wasting my time to fuel your phallic phantasies, then I suggest you buy a .460 Wby (once you have a PAL), and give yourself a good concussion...................
Doug
OK I am going to take everything you have written as true, and not the musings of some pimple-faced teenager with a rabid imagination, a Daisy Red Ryder, and a chubby in his pants.
You are getting some excellent advice here, more so than in a lot of threads that I have had the pleasure of reading here on Gun Nutz for a number of years. I am going to add some more free advice, worth what you paid for it:
Since you live in Oshawa, according to your screen ID, you are within close driving distance to hundreds of gun owners and a bunch of ranges. If you are not already a member of a gun club (range) I very strongly suggest you join one, as an extremely important first step. Then let your fellow firearms enthusiasts know that you have this dilemma about what gun you should buy. MOST normal gun-lovers will then tell you THEIR opinion, and let you shoot their shootin' irons. Unless you are in a hell of a hurry, you have lots of time before Ontario's big game seasons.
You have not said (or I missed it) what you intend to shoot with your gun. As others have mentioned, there is not much here in Ontario that the .30-06 (or .308) can't handle, with less cost, recoil, etc etc etc. But if you want to shoot PAPER and have a lot of fun doing it, then by golly buy any damn gun you want, shoot it, sell it and buy another, shoot it, sell it and buy another, and so on. I have been doing this for a number of years and it is a fun hobby.
But if you are a pimple-faced young puke just out to waste people's time here, like so many other young people who think nothing of wasting my time to fuel your phallic phantasies, then I suggest you buy a .460 Wby (once you have a PAL), and give yourself a good concussion...................
Doug
- Location
- Saskatchewan
Doug +1
- Location
- The Conservative part of Ontario
cbabes
Muscle mass has very little if anything to do with minimizing felt recoil.
Lots of bigger guys have more recoil sensitivity than some small guys, or even women.
The 338WM can be a handful. That said, I love it.
The 30-06 on the other hand, though quite capable, is simply the most boring cartridge in North America! Every once a year hunter/greenhorn carries one, and a lot of experienced guys too.
The 30-06 will kill anything this side of Alberta just as dead as the magnums. (It will bore them to death)
The 338 kills big game such as moose with a panache that has to be seen to be appreciated.
Neither will do it's job, if you don't do yours. A poorly placed shot is just that. Don't expect a magnum to compensate for your inability to shoot, it won't.
It may in fact introduce you to the world of flinch, something that can be hard to beat.
Get out there, and try some rifles. We are not joking about recoil, there are a lot of differences between makes, models, stock designs etc.
Muscle mass has very little if anything to do with minimizing felt recoil.
Lots of bigger guys have more recoil sensitivity than some small guys, or even women.
The 338WM can be a handful. That said, I love it.
The 30-06 on the other hand, though quite capable, is simply the most boring cartridge in North America! Every once a year hunter/greenhorn carries one, and a lot of experienced guys too.
The 30-06 will kill anything this side of Alberta just as dead as the magnums. (It will bore them to death)
The 338 kills big game such as moose with a panache that has to be seen to be appreciated.
Neither will do it's job, if you don't do yours. A poorly placed shot is just that. Don't expect a magnum to compensate for your inability to shoot, it won't.
It may in fact introduce you to the world of flinch, something that can be hard to beat.
Get out there, and try some rifles. We are not joking about recoil, there are a lot of differences between makes, models, stock designs etc.
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BC Bigbore
CGN frequent flyer
- Location
- BC's Peace Country
Now there is some sound advice. Just because someone likes/recommends a certain model doesn't mean it's right for you. Try several rifles and you'll know very shortly what you like and don't like. For the most part, you can't go wrong with a Joe Average .30-06 in a Remington M700, Ruger M77, Winchester M70 or Browning A-bolt. Top it with a decent Leupold scope and you are good to go pretty much anywhere in Canada.
I have a Ruger stainless in .338 win mag.(with those skeletonized perimeter weighted stocks), I also have a savage 116 stainless in .300 win mag. Neither is a joy to shoot, as recoil is substantial in both.
I own and shoot them because they kill dead all the critters I need dead, and usually in a hurry. I ran into a Grizzly last year up hear (they aren't normally in this neck of the woods and I dont know who was more scared or surprised) And anything less is not in the books for me.
Anyhow, If you pick a magnum rifle that is too light, its gonna hurt, if you pick a magnum that has a stock that doesn't line up with your shoulder/eyes correctly... its gonna hurt, if you think recoil is just a shove backwards like your buddy pushing your shoulder....its gonna hurt.
Get yourself to a range, politely introduce yourself to some shooters, ask if someone will show you what a magnum and non magnum is like to shoot, then make your decision. (I, as well as many of the shooters I know, have NO PROBLEM letting people try my rifles to get a feel for the caliber and what it feels like to shoot , as nobody can own every type of gun and caliber.)
I can say for certain, that SEVERAL of my friends have pulled the trigger on my .338 and for most of them, it was also their last trigger pull. The very last guy to try it got 5 stitches through his eyebrow when the scope came back hard and clipped him (good bloody show too) AND I DID WARN HIM TO HOLD TIGHT!!!!
If you haven't shot any good sized firearms before, then dont make any decisions on what caliber you want to buy. You could end up with a gun you are afraid to shoot correctly due to recoil flinch. Recoil is a beotch if you let it own you, and its easier to happen then you think.
There are lots of smaller calibers out there that will kill efficiently, and promote good marksmanship. Many moose have been taken with a 7x57 mauser, .303 british, 7mm-08, .308 win, .260 , .280, .30-30, 6.5x55 swede, etc, so dont get hung up on size. Try out lots of guns and pick one you can shoot without dreading to pull the trigger on. It means more in the end to pick one you can shoot well, than one that kills well
I own and shoot them because they kill dead all the critters I need dead, and usually in a hurry. I ran into a Grizzly last year up hear (they aren't normally in this neck of the woods and I dont know who was more scared or surprised) And anything less is not in the books for me.
Anyhow, If you pick a magnum rifle that is too light, its gonna hurt, if you pick a magnum that has a stock that doesn't line up with your shoulder/eyes correctly... its gonna hurt, if you think recoil is just a shove backwards like your buddy pushing your shoulder....its gonna hurt.
Get yourself to a range, politely introduce yourself to some shooters, ask if someone will show you what a magnum and non magnum is like to shoot, then make your decision. (I, as well as many of the shooters I know, have NO PROBLEM letting people try my rifles to get a feel for the caliber and what it feels like to shoot , as nobody can own every type of gun and caliber.)
I can say for certain, that SEVERAL of my friends have pulled the trigger on my .338 and for most of them, it was also their last trigger pull. The very last guy to try it got 5 stitches through his eyebrow when the scope came back hard and clipped him (good bloody show too) AND I DID WARN HIM TO HOLD TIGHT!!!!
If you haven't shot any good sized firearms before, then dont make any decisions on what caliber you want to buy. You could end up with a gun you are afraid to shoot correctly due to recoil flinch. Recoil is a beotch if you let it own you, and its easier to happen then you think.
There are lots of smaller calibers out there that will kill efficiently, and promote good marksmanship. Many moose have been taken with a 7x57 mauser, .303 british, 7mm-08, .308 win, .260 , .280, .30-30, 6.5x55 swede, etc, so dont get hung up on size. Try out lots of guns and pick one you can shoot without dreading to pull the trigger on. It means more in the end to pick one you can shoot well, than one that kills well
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