XCR and cratering
- Thread starter Bare
- Start date
I'm going to have to agree with Beltfed, poor quality control.
How dare they let a rifle leave the factory with flaws like this.
Norinco for a few hundred bucks, OK, but when the weapon is priced in the $2000 range
(or more) it's unacceptable.
I happen to like XCR's but will not attempt to defend them when this happens.
Rich
How dare they let a rifle leave the factory with flaws like this.
Norinco for a few hundred bucks, OK, but when the weapon is priced in the $2000 range
(or more) it's unacceptable.
I happen to like XCR's but will not attempt to defend them when this happens.
Rich
I got my rifle back today. These rifles do crater and it is very normal from what I have been told. Took it to the range today to break it in. Right out of the box I was hitting the 200 yard gong freehand with open sights. I dont care about the cratering now that I know its normal for these rifles. I am very pleased and can not wait to wack some yoties with it when the season opens. I have wanted this rifle for quite some time and so far it was well worth the price for a non restriced black rifle. And my first tactical rifle.
I think once again people are taking what I type far too personal.
My post wasn't meant to be a personal attack against any one person; if you read that into it, I apologize.
I think it is fair to say that I have been in quite a few of the XCR threads, and its also true I have little in the way of positive comments on the platform.
However, this is a forum for the transfer of information about firearms, and where alot of information is continuously regurgitated over and over. In most threads on the XCR that I read (and stick my nose into), there is an overture of XCR fans that go to lengths to talk them up and defend the system and company that produces them.
If you think it is ok for a company to charge a premium for a product that effects quality control after the items leave the manufacturing process and are in the hands of the consumer, then maybe this rifle is for you.
Sure, every item that is made by man has the potential for flaws or descrepencies in manufacturing - but why all the hype to defend this one system?
I can honestly say I know of no other firearms manufacturer that would recommend:
- Taking a file to a trigger sear because it left the factory flawed,
- Removing material on a bolt because it left the factory flawed,
- Suggesting a potentially unsafe condition on fired primers due to a flaw in manufacturing is 'normal for our product'
If I read a little less biased b/s in half of these threads it is likely I wouldn't bother posting in them....
My post wasn't meant to be a personal attack against any one person; if you read that into it, I apologize.
I think it is fair to say that I have been in quite a few of the XCR threads, and its also true I have little in the way of positive comments on the platform.
However, this is a forum for the transfer of information about firearms, and where alot of information is continuously regurgitated over and over. In most threads on the XCR that I read (and stick my nose into), there is an overture of XCR fans that go to lengths to talk them up and defend the system and company that produces them.
If you think it is ok for a company to charge a premium for a product that effects quality control after the items leave the manufacturing process and are in the hands of the consumer, then maybe this rifle is for you.
Sure, every item that is made by man has the potential for flaws or descrepencies in manufacturing - but why all the hype to defend this one system?
I can honestly say I know of no other firearms manufacturer that would recommend:
- Taking a file to a trigger sear because it left the factory flawed,
- Removing material on a bolt because it left the factory flawed,
- Suggesting a potentially unsafe condition on fired primers due to a flaw in manufacturing is 'normal for our product'
If I read a little less biased b/s in half of these threads it is likely I wouldn't bother posting in them....
I think once again people are taking what I type far too personal.
My post wasn't meant to be a personal attack against any one person; if you read that into it, I apologize.
I think it is fair to say that I have been in quite a few of the XCR threads, and its also true I have little in the way of positive comments on the platform.
However, this is a forum for the transfer of information about firearms, and where alot of information is continuously regurgitated over and over. In most threads on the XCR that I read (and stick my nose into), there is an overture of XCR fans that go to lengths to talk them up and defend the system and company that produces them.
If you think it is ok for a company to charge a premium for a product that effects quality control after the items leave the manufacturing process and are in the hands of the consumer, then maybe this rifle is for you.
That's hardly a fair comparison. We don't charge $2300 for them here. They start at $1500 here. Should people have issues out of the box? No. We just let out shop manager go a couple weeks ago because QC processes were slipping under his control, and have tightened up all our processes since then. I'm not saying there have never been QC issues, but you, being an expert, should be able to understand that all companies have an expected failure rate, and that one employee can really screw things up on his own.
Sure, every item that is made by man has the potential for flaws or descrepencies in manufacturing - but why all the hype to defend this one system?
Because they, like I do, know that this platform is a damn good one. When built right, the XCR will run flawlessly.
I can honestly say I know of no other firearms manufacturer that would recommend:
- Taking a file to a trigger sear because it left the factory flawed,
- Removing material on a bolt because it left the factory flawed,
- Suggesting a potentially unsafe condition on fired primers due to a flaw in manufacturing is 'normal for our product'
It's not our typical recommendation. We always offer to replace the part, or offer the alternate solution of advice on how to fix it rather than have the part spend a month in transit back and forth.
In addition, our rifle is NOT an AR, or an AK, or an M4. The bolt design is not the same, and our rifle craters primers. This is neither dangerous nor abnormal, and in the five years the XCR has been *successfully* shipping, cratering has never caused a single problem.
If I read a little less biased b/s in half of these threads it is likely I wouldn't bother posting in them....
My post wasn't meant to be a personal attack against any one person; if you read that into it, I apologize.
I think it is fair to say that I have been in quite a few of the XCR threads, and its also true I have little in the way of positive comments on the platform.
However, this is a forum for the transfer of information about firearms, and where alot of information is continuously regurgitated over and over. In most threads on the XCR that I read (and stick my nose into), there is an overture of XCR fans that go to lengths to talk them up and defend the system and company that produces them.
If you think it is ok for a company to charge a premium for a product that effects quality control after the items leave the manufacturing process and are in the hands of the consumer, then maybe this rifle is for you.
That's hardly a fair comparison. We don't charge $2300 for them here. They start at $1500 here. Should people have issues out of the box? No. We just let out shop manager go a couple weeks ago because QC processes were slipping under his control, and have tightened up all our processes since then. I'm not saying there have never been QC issues, but you, being an expert, should be able to understand that all companies have an expected failure rate, and that one employee can really screw things up on his own.
Sure, every item that is made by man has the potential for flaws or descrepencies in manufacturing - but why all the hype to defend this one system?
Because they, like I do, know that this platform is a damn good one. When built right, the XCR will run flawlessly.
I can honestly say I know of no other firearms manufacturer that would recommend:
- Taking a file to a trigger sear because it left the factory flawed,
- Removing material on a bolt because it left the factory flawed,
- Suggesting a potentially unsafe condition on fired primers due to a flaw in manufacturing is 'normal for our product'
It's not our typical recommendation. We always offer to replace the part, or offer the alternate solution of advice on how to fix it rather than have the part spend a month in transit back and forth.
In addition, our rifle is NOT an AR, or an AK, or an M4. The bolt design is not the same, and our rifle craters primers. This is neither dangerous nor abnormal, and in the five years the XCR has been *successfully* shipping, cratering has never caused a single problem.
If I read a little less biased b/s in half of these threads it is likely I wouldn't bother posting in them....
- Location
- 54°52'56"N 112°10'7"W Alpha Bravo
I am curious, why cant the manufacturer set an MSRP on their product and try to insure that the retailers stick to that set MSRP. If you say they go for 1500 down state side why cant they go for something similar here not 2400. If our Canadian dealers are making that much profit, (assuming that you give them a wholesale discount off your set price) that is just plain gouging... [flame suit on] Now I know that everyone is going to pipe up and say, "our dealers don't make any money and its brought in all for us, "the Gunnutz", blah, blah blah" those margins don't lie... I know if I had my name on a product, I would make sure my end users were getting a fair price and not gouged.... ???? Basically if you don't control your end pricing then it doesn't mean #### if you charge only 1500 there, because here it is 2400 and as beltfed suggests the quality should be flawless for that price...
- Location
- California (formerly from BC)
A fair question - my guess is that these have something to do with it...
1) Import costs
2) Government red tape / hassles
3) Shipping
4) Differences in exchange rate
- Location
- 54°52'56"N 112°10'7"W Alpha Bravo
- Location
- California (formerly from BC)
I am not ruling out other explanations, and am not naive. I was just guessing as to some of the reasons.
Mr Wolverine
CGN Regular
- Location
- Manitoba. Canada
Time for me to step in regards the pricing of the XCR in Canada.
XCRmonger is MISLEADING, the XCR rifle we sell in Canada has a US retail of $2,050.99 NOT $1,500.00 as she implies. Any one can go to their web site and calculate the recommended US retail for the rifle that we supply. Our Canadian price includes over $500 of extras! And the new improved fire control parts and ambi safety.
When you factor in all the importation and shipping costs the Canadian retail is very reasonable. Considering the supply and demand we could increase the retail price but we have not. We give Canadian dealers a modest discount, they are not gouging any retail customer, with their discount it is hardly worth their while stocking the XCR.
Now take the US retail and add the exchange rate that we are charged when we pay for the rifles and you are getting a very fair deal. We paid for the current shipment in mid July and they haven’t left the US yet, another added expense to us.
Price for the next shipment will be $2,399.00.
The bottom line is if you do not like the product or the price don’t buy it!
XCRmonger is MISLEADING, the XCR rifle we sell in Canada has a US retail of $2,050.99 NOT $1,500.00 as she implies. Any one can go to their web site and calculate the recommended US retail for the rifle that we supply. Our Canadian price includes over $500 of extras! And the new improved fire control parts and ambi safety.
When you factor in all the importation and shipping costs the Canadian retail is very reasonable. Considering the supply and demand we could increase the retail price but we have not. We give Canadian dealers a modest discount, they are not gouging any retail customer, with their discount it is hardly worth their while stocking the XCR.
Now take the US retail and add the exchange rate that we are charged when we pay for the rifles and you are getting a very fair deal. We paid for the current shipment in mid July and they haven’t left the US yet, another added expense to us.
Price for the next shipment will be $2,399.00.
The bottom line is if you do not like the product or the price don’t buy it!
- Location
- 54°52'56"N 112°10'7"W Alpha Bravo
OK so now that we have relevant and accurate info on the table, the XCR is fairly priced and it is a $2000+ rifle as beltfed said, which I agree the quality should be there for that kind of doe.....
This is the problem with any and all forums, like all products and manufacturer a few XCR had slip past the expected QC stanards or teething problems in the intial batch, unfortunately those kind of the story soon becomes manifesto for I can only described as "holy internet crusaders" more often than not they had no first hand experience with the product, but rather basing their opinion on "This guy I know that own one those once....".
We all know how easy it is to mis-quote or taking things out of context on the internet, simply because I don't feel like typing the whole long drawn out story. perfect examples of that can be found in just this thread, like the bit about RA offer to replaced the bolt, but I opted for a DIY solution or take a file to the trigger suggeted in another thread, as I far I can recall that suggestion was given because someone griped about the trigger pull and didn't want to wait until the inital breaking in to smooth out the trigger action.
I have been around enough forums to know that you have to take evrything with a grain of salt, there are always more to the story to it than just the two lines that is posted in a thread and no matter what there will always be "holy internet crusaders" dying to take up the cause both sides.
I PM'ed Beltfed on my thoughts on the subject and he was more than gracious enough to reply, for that I am very grateful and have a lot of respect for him.
We all know how easy it is to mis-quote or taking things out of context on the internet, simply because I don't feel like typing the whole long drawn out story. perfect examples of that can be found in just this thread, like the bit about RA offer to replaced the bolt, but I opted for a DIY solution or take a file to the trigger suggeted in another thread, as I far I can recall that suggestion was given because someone griped about the trigger pull and didn't want to wait until the inital breaking in to smooth out the trigger action.
I have been around enough forums to know that you have to take evrything with a grain of salt, there are always more to the story to it than just the two lines that is posted in a thread and no matter what there will always be "holy internet crusaders" dying to take up the cause both sides.
I PM'ed Beltfed on my thoughts on the subject and he was more than gracious enough to reply, for that I am very grateful and have a lot of respect for him.
My XCR is shooting well and everyone who tries it likes it. I know a few shooters who are now gathering the funds to buy one of their own... I'm a bit jealous because theirs will have all the new improvements!
My XCR is of the first generation and had the old style gas system which I replaced with a new style one direct from Robinson Armament. Also, RA is great when it comes to customer service and support... I lost one of my ejector screw and RA sent me 4 brand spanking new ones free of charge. They even sent them Express at a cost of nearly 15$ to them. That's service... Thanks XCRMonger!
I will buy the .308 version when it comes out and I wish I could buy the .30 Russian short conversion kit!
My XCR is of the first generation and had the old style gas system which I replaced with a new style one direct from Robinson Armament. Also, RA is great when it comes to customer service and support... I lost one of my ejector screw and RA sent me 4 brand spanking new ones free of charge. They even sent them Express at a cost of nearly 15$ to them. That's service... Thanks XCRMonger!
I will buy the .308 version when it comes out and I wish I could buy the .30 Russian short conversion kit!
