Why are Glocks so reliable?
- Thread starter GunGuy34
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Maybe read the whole thread eh. It was brought up.
Dexter Morgan
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Get on a plane to Frankfurt, Germany.
When you step off the plane, you will see police standing there who will be carrying CZ pistols.
Get in your rental car and drive in any direction you like. Stop somewhere for something to eat. You will see police there with CZ pistols.
Keep driving anywhere you like.
Wherever you go, you will see police with CZ pistols.
You don't have the clearance to get through the gate where they work, so it doesn't matter. And needing your 'verification' isn't high on my list of things I need to get any time soon.
Holy crap....maybe I shouldn't have said that. I'll say one thing, Glock fans are sure over the top loyal. After reading the posts I think a few people need some serious help
Holy crap....maybe I shouldn't have said that. I'll say one thing, Glock fans are sure over the top loyal. After reading the posts I think a few people need some serious help
Agreed. Gun owners are very brand loyal, sometimes to a fault. I love my M&P but it ain't perfect.
Isn't the AK considered one of the most reliable firearm EVER? Doesn't it pre-date Glock? Yet it also fails. They must not have had as good a marketing team!
None of the police I was dealing with the last time I landed at FRA (which was recently) had a CZ.
Why is it so hard for you to say you're mistaken?
O.k., let's try it:
British cops working with police in Frankfurt for 2010 World Cup match:
Seen any CZ 75's yet?
They are hard to make out, but the police in the airport at Frankfurt are carrying HK P30 pistols and (of course) MP5 submachineguns.
Edit: I was looking at that last picture of that oldtimer with the pistol... thinking: what is that? Then I thought... two big recessed grip screws with a distinctive looking checkered grip... that has to be a SIG P220 variant. The P6 (SIG P225) is one of the common German police guns of the past 20 years... mostly being phased out now for the P30 and the P99... that has to be what that is: SIG P225.
The rest of them in the pictures seem to be HK P30s. Frankfurt is in Hesse State. From the Wikipedia page on the HK P30:
That is alot of P30s... 59,500 with an option for another 5,000.
From the Wikipedia page on the Walther P99:
That's 69,000 Walther P99s! Those two, the P30 and the P99, seem to be the dominant police guns in Germany these days.
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Here is an idea and if I am wrong I will admit it as I don't want anyone jumping down my throat. Lets assume that there are police dept-Military that use both CZ and Glock. I did the google thing and there appears to be lots of countries that use both throughout Europe, Asia and North America/ USA.
Ok so looking at how Governments think ( and for the most part they don't) would the first requirement not be cheapest ? or best gun for the money ? Not necessarily the "best gun".
If it was just the best gun wouldn't there be more Nighthawks or Wilsons used worldwide ? They seem pretty top of the line.
I am just saying that who uses the gun doesn't make it the best. I like my CZ Shadow but if you saw me shoot you would say....Whoa...I don't want one of those guns
Ok so looking at how Governments think ( and for the most part they don't) would the first requirement not be cheapest ? or best gun for the money ? Not necessarily the "best gun".
If it was just the best gun wouldn't there be more Nighthawks or Wilsons used worldwide ? They seem pretty top of the line.
I am just saying that who uses the gun doesn't make it the best. I like my CZ Shadow but if you saw me shoot you would say....Whoa...I don't want one of those guns
Ar180shooter
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
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- Ottawa, ON
+1
One particular 2nd gen Glock 22 .40 cal that I was well familiar with had thousands [35,000 +] of rounds thru it without one single fail to feed, fire, extract or eject.
Most cases of "jamming issues" with Glocks can be put to "limp wristing", which is a shooter induced failure.
Simply put, Glocks work.
That's why my current 2nd gen Glock 22 .40 cal would be my "go to" if the situation dictated.
My .02....... your mileage may vary.
------------
NAA.
On that note, I tried to get my Gen 2 Glock 22 to have a failure... Mixed about 3 different kinds of factory ammunition in the magazine and limp wristed the he!l out of it... couldn't get it to stop. Definitely one great, reliable pistol.
I know you're being facetious, but custom $4k 1911's are 'best' only in trigger, accuracy, and being pretty. Having a glass rod trigger, being able to put every shot into a quarter at 50 yards, and fashionable are not the most important issues when selecting a duty weapon.Here is an idea and if I am wrong I will admit it as I don't want anyone jumping down my throat. Lets assume that there are police dept-Military that use both CZ and Glock. I did the google thing and there appears to be lots of countries that use both throughout Europe, Asia and North America/ USA.
Ok so looking at how Governments think ( and for the most part they don't) would the first requirement not be cheapest ? or best gun for the money ? Not necessarily the "best gun".
If it was just the best gun wouldn't there be more Nighthawks or Wilsons used worldwide ? They seem pretty top of the line.
I am just saying that who uses the gun doesn't make it the best. I like my CZ Shadow but if you saw me shoot you would say....Whoa...I don't want one of those guns
There's a reason Larry Vickers doesn't recommend 1911's for large scale use; they're expensive, low-capacity, heavy (compared to polymer frames), finicky guns... unless you build them to looser fits, then they lose their accuracy, great trigger, and prettiness... while still being lower-capacity, heavier, and [potentially] less reliable than their plastic-fantastic alternatives.
And the pistol chosen by the Los Angeles Police S.W.A.T. was...wait for it... the Kimber 1911 in .45acp. No budget restraints, no legislated caliber restraints, just the need for the best pistol to do what they wanted the gun to do.
Does that make the Kimber 1911 LA SWAT version the best, most reliable, most accurate gun and the one we all should go out and buy.....nope.
My point being that some guns fit and work well better than others when specific applications dictate the use of one pistol over another. For most recreational shooters who enjoy IDPA and IPSC or just like to go to the range and plink buy what you can afford and enjoy your shooting. Aside from the odd lemon I haven't seen any particular mainstream brand that wasn't capable of more accuracy than the shooter holding the gun and all were dead nuts reliable.
My limited experience relates to:
CZ 85 Combat
CZ SP-01
CZ SP-01 Shadow
CZ 97B
M&P FS 9mm/.40cal
M&P PRO 9MM
Tanfoglio "L" 9mm/.40cal
Norinco FS .45apc/9MM
Norinco Commander
ST Trojan
I have shot an assortment of others, including Glocks, Sigs and Berettas, just haven't owned any....yet.
Not one of these guns has ever failed to fire or feed that wasn't ammo (my reloads) related. None have had either with factory ammo. With the exception of the CZ 97B (It doesn't meet IDPA specs under current rules) I have managed to shoot Sharpshooter scores running the IDPA Classifier. While my ego has been a bit of a drag on reaching some conclusions I have to finally admit it is the archer not the arrow. Too, among mainstream firearms currently on the market there isn't "best gun" nor is one make "more reliable" than another. From a bench some have more mechanical accuracy but for all practical purposes all are accurate enough for their intended use.
As to reliability of other makes my experience is limited to acting as a SO at various IDPA Sanctioned matches. At last years Washington State match for example we had over 90 shooters using every possible gun variant you can imagine that meets IDPA Divisional rules. Remember most of the shooters participating have CCW permits for their State. The stage was an 18 rounder and I witnessed not one failure of any kind from any make. So too the Alberta Provincials with less shooters but with a similar pistol mix. Conclusion, any well maintained mainstream pistol will function reliably. All are mechanical devices and all are capable of failing. They just don't fail very often. Find a pistol you can afford and like and go play. For the LEO's practice the hell out of your duty pistol you are issued and hope you never have to use it.
Take Care
Bob
ps If my recently purchase M&P PRO doesn't make me a Master shooter any suggestions for a gun that will.....
Does that make the Kimber 1911 LA SWAT version the best, most reliable, most accurate gun and the one we all should go out and buy.....nope.
My point being that some guns fit and work well better than others when specific applications dictate the use of one pistol over another. For most recreational shooters who enjoy IDPA and IPSC or just like to go to the range and plink buy what you can afford and enjoy your shooting. Aside from the odd lemon I haven't seen any particular mainstream brand that wasn't capable of more accuracy than the shooter holding the gun and all were dead nuts reliable.
My limited experience relates to:
CZ 85 Combat
CZ SP-01
CZ SP-01 Shadow
CZ 97B
M&P FS 9mm/.40cal
M&P PRO 9MM
Tanfoglio "L" 9mm/.40cal
Norinco FS .45apc/9MM
Norinco Commander
ST Trojan
I have shot an assortment of others, including Glocks, Sigs and Berettas, just haven't owned any....yet.
Not one of these guns has ever failed to fire or feed that wasn't ammo (my reloads) related. None have had either with factory ammo. With the exception of the CZ 97B (It doesn't meet IDPA specs under current rules) I have managed to shoot Sharpshooter scores running the IDPA Classifier. While my ego has been a bit of a drag on reaching some conclusions I have to finally admit it is the archer not the arrow. Too, among mainstream firearms currently on the market there isn't "best gun" nor is one make "more reliable" than another. From a bench some have more mechanical accuracy but for all practical purposes all are accurate enough for their intended use.
As to reliability of other makes my experience is limited to acting as a SO at various IDPA Sanctioned matches. At last years Washington State match for example we had over 90 shooters using every possible gun variant you can imagine that meets IDPA Divisional rules. Remember most of the shooters participating have CCW permits for their State. The stage was an 18 rounder and I witnessed not one failure of any kind from any make. So too the Alberta Provincials with less shooters but with a similar pistol mix. Conclusion, any well maintained mainstream pistol will function reliably. All are mechanical devices and all are capable of failing. They just don't fail very often. Find a pistol you can afford and like and go play. For the LEO's practice the hell out of your duty pistol you are issued and hope you never have to use it.
Take Care
Bob
ps If my recently purchase M&P PRO doesn't make me a Master shooter any suggestions for a gun that will.....
Dirt McGirt
Regular
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Yo strait up Glock be tha best gun. All da illest shottas on tha street use dis gun cuz in neva fail and in tha street u need tha best gun cuz yo life dipens on it. Wu Tang represent
Glocks are good pistols and were made for reliability and put bullet in man between 1-20 yards. Glocks have a lot more tolerance than others guns And with the mix of polymer and tenifered metal, they can run with minimal lube. Minimal lube mean minimum dust attraction.
All is about point of use. A 3500$ wilson is a far better gun for target practice, but when you have to trust your life to a pistol, I'll not take a 1911 wilson combat.
Today all major gun makers do reliable semi auto pistols: Sig, S&W, CZ, Ruger.... All make good semi auto.
All is about point of use. A 3500$ wilson is a far better gun for target practice, but when you have to trust your life to a pistol, I'll not take a 1911 wilson combat.
Today all major gun makers do reliable semi auto pistols: Sig, S&W, CZ, Ruger.... All make good semi auto.
I didn't read all the prior posts; enough to get the rhythm I think...
Personally I don't care who in LEO is packing what.
But I can relate my simple range experiences that I've enjoyed over time...
I've seen multiple pistol brands and models screw up.
Usually its poor ammo or lack of cleaning.
The odd mechanical breakage also happens; anything mechanical can and will break.
Repeated failures of the same part on the same platform tends to illustrate what the design limits were (or what they failed to achieve).
I've only played with 4 Glocks, of the 4;
two had an unknown history, one was not used (new-under 100 rounds) and one was used and at about 5-7 thousand rounds.
Two pistols experienced no failures that I ever saw.
Two pistols (1 unknown & the high round one) experienced the same failures.
Both broke the trigger spring.
Both chipped the extractor (which caused failure to ejects)
Both repairs were simple to diagnose.
Both repairs were easy to do at home.
Both repairs were inexpensive.
So my experiences with the Glock are running a 50% failure rate.
But do I look at that as a bad thing...
It depends your outlook.
Would you prefer a pistol that has known problems that are cheap and easy to fix or a pistol that has unknown problems that you can (or can't) fix?
Perhaps at great expense and time.
That is for you to decide.
No, I do not currently own one but that doesn't mean I wouldn't consider another.
YMMV
Personally I don't care who in LEO is packing what.
But I can relate my simple range experiences that I've enjoyed over time...
I've seen multiple pistol brands and models screw up.
Usually its poor ammo or lack of cleaning.
The odd mechanical breakage also happens; anything mechanical can and will break.
Repeated failures of the same part on the same platform tends to illustrate what the design limits were (or what they failed to achieve).
I've only played with 4 Glocks, of the 4;
two had an unknown history, one was not used (new-under 100 rounds) and one was used and at about 5-7 thousand rounds.
Two pistols experienced no failures that I ever saw.
Two pistols (1 unknown & the high round one) experienced the same failures.
Both broke the trigger spring.
Both chipped the extractor (which caused failure to ejects)
Both repairs were simple to diagnose.
Both repairs were easy to do at home.
Both repairs were inexpensive.
So my experiences with the Glock are running a 50% failure rate.
But do I look at that as a bad thing...
It depends your outlook.
Would you prefer a pistol that has known problems that are cheap and easy to fix or a pistol that has unknown problems that you can (or can't) fix?
Perhaps at great expense and time.
That is for you to decide.
No, I do not currently own one but that doesn't mean I wouldn't consider another.
YMMV
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