.17 Super Magnum
- Thread starter drache
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hometownhero
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
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- Toon Town, Sk
There was a video of him shooting a bold action rifle. Im guessing thats the save he is talking about
hometownhero
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Toon Town, Sk
ht tp://www.petersenshunting.com/2013/01/02/introducing-the-new-17-winchester-super-magnum/
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When folks are designing a new cartridge and a rifle to go with the new load do you think that they should sit down and find a way that even the cheapest SOG will want to invest in this new rimfire choice, or should they make the best possible product for the large majority of the industry and hope that it is well accepted by those folks that want to spend some more money on a new design? FS
if they can keep the cost of ammo below 17 hmr and accuracy / cleaning requirements the same or better, it will hurt the hmr for first time buyers. I would consider one for sure over the hmr (quite happy with 22 mag/17 HM2 for the moment). I do not reload.
hometownhero
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- Toon Town, Sk
No, its the newest tactical plastic pos around. Makes the tactical mosberg lever action look like a winchester 1886
I don't think that Winchester is trying to fill a gap here between the HMR and the the 17 Hornet, I think they're trying to take the HMR's market. If the price is comparable to HMR then I don't see why they wouldn't, except for maybe the reduced report of the HMR (which happens to be important to me but probably not to most shooters). Winchester claims they've been working on this round for 3 years. If that's true, I wonder if that's not part of the reason Hornady brought out the 17 Hornet - to make the 17 WSM seem less exciting and hedge against potentially diminished HMR sales. Of course it could just as easily be the other way around or simply coincidence. I have mixed emotions about the whole thing: I'm all for advancement but I've grown to love the HMR and just bought a Weatherby chambered in it.
From a manufacturing point of view, the .17HMR seems a safer bet than the new Super Magnum. The HMR uses essentially the same cartridge case blanks as the .22 WMR, uses the same actions as the WMR, and the same bolt face, allowing a wider range of products off the same tooling.
I dunno how this is gonna fly. I'd suggest, in regards to the Hornady Hornet, that the HH is quite more of interest to the reloaders and those willing to go through the trouble tuning up their loads to match their rifles. More about trying to pick up the guys that would be interested in an Ackley Hornet, but are not willing to go custom as they would need to.The Winchester round is more directed towards those that would never reload anyway.
I figure the cost to reload a .17 is about $40/100. If they can come in under that for ammo, Winchester, that is, they may pick up a few sales there, but I see HMR ammo running anywhere from $11 to $22 for 50, so...
I'm pretty underwhelmed, partly with the attempt at "buzz" building (although, here we are talking about the product), and the rest at the production of something that seems the answer to the question nobody seems to have asked.
I see a lot of folks out there that are skeptical just on the basis of having been burned in the recent past, buying calibers they cannot find ammo for any more. Many are just not going to bite on the flavor of the week.
Ask a 5mm Remington owner.
Cheers
Trev
bearkilr
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Rimfires are a bit difficult to reload.
If they can keep ammo prices near the HMR, it'll be a winner. If ammo is considerably more, it'll flop.
At the begining, the price of the .17 HMR was a bit high, and the availBility was'nt good. But more it began popular, the price dropped correctly. So if this cartridge follow the same path, in 2015 it should be a good choice for the serious varmint shooter! But honestly, here in quebec we have'nt a lot of little critters to shoot... And this cartridge ins'nt suitable for coyote.
17HMR ammunition is still way too high compared to 17Mach2 ammunition. Using the exact same bullet, which is the most expensive component, the 17HMR ammunition costs twice as much. If the new rimfire ammunition is close to that of the 17HMR, it is likely the 17HMR sales that will suffer dramatically. If the price of ammunition for the new rimfire is close to that of the 17Hornet, then the new rimfire will likely fail miserably. In order to succed, the new rimfire either needs to offer more performance than the 17HMR for a similar price, or similar performance to the 17Hornet for a lower price. If it doesn't do either, it really has nothing to offer.
Comparing a 17HMR to a 17HM2 is like comparing a 22 short to a 22 LR or a 308 to a 30-06 ... there's just no comparison in ballistics. They only similarity is the "17". Sure the 308 and 30-06 use the same bullet, but ammo cost sure aren't the same. It's my understanding that quality control is the highest production cost for these small calibers, not the component themselves. I still have yet to see a sub .75 MOA 17HM2 at the range. $13 for 50 is still dirt cheap to shoot.
I'm excited any time a new caliber comes to market! I'm betting on $25 / box of 50 and a limited rifle availability in the first 4 years (ie: about double the cost of a 17hm2 / 17hmr rifle).
I'm excited any time a new caliber comes to market! I'm betting on $25 / box of 50 and a limited rifle availability in the first 4 years (ie: about double the cost of a 17hm2 / 17hmr rifle).
Show me a few examples where 30-06 ammunition costs double that of 308win, when loaded with the same bullet, by the same company. I was just checking the Wholesale Sports catalogue, and if you compare the same load with the same bullet, in each chambering, the prices are exactly the same for most Remington, Federal, and Hornady loads.
Given that the ammunition is loaded by the same company, in the same plant, would you care to explain how Hornady or CCI 17Mach2 ammunition sells for half the price of their 17HMR ammunition? Are you insinuating that the quality control for the 17HMR ammunition costs twice as much. As well, I find the Eley 17mach2 loads to be the most accurate in my rifles, and they generally sell for less than the Hornady 17mach2 ammunition.
I happen to currently own one. My Cooper in 17Mach2 is every bit as accurate as my Cooper in 17HMR. I guess that is why Cooper guarantees 1/2 moa for both cartridges. As well,several friends happen to own 17Mach2 rifles, by Cooper, Savage and CZ, and their rifles shoot with the same make/model rifles in 17HMR, that we encounter at the range.
At $25 per 50, I can load either 17Hornet, or 22Hornet for less, and either one is ballistically superior to the new rimfire.
I have owned two 17HMR rifles, and I sold both of them, because my 17Mach2 rifles do just as well to just over 100 yards, and my 22Hornet is far superior to the 17HMR at longer distances, especially on larger game, or when there is a breeze.
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- Location
- New Brunswick
As a die hard predator hunter, this new .17 definitely fills a niche for me. I currently hunt with my .223 and occasionally my 12ga. There have been many instances where I've passed on a fox and even cats because I knew the pelt damage would be excessive. For many, acquiring a fur-friendly centerfire .17 is quite a challenge.....practically no commercial offerings which means re-barreling and other expenses. The .17 WSM will fill that niche of a do-all predator calling rifle with enough energy to anchor a coyote and do little damage to the smaller critters....without having to handload ammo. I definitely will have one in my safe by years end and for the beginning of next season. Time to go hunting.......
