Firearms reclassification.

[jeffcarr88]

Switzerland isn't full of drug-dealin', gangster refugees, like the U.S. and Canada.

Canada WAS like that a one point...well before I was born tho (1990).

 

[Brian46]

TSE is heading to Switzerland this week in hopes of gathering the required documentation to provide the RCMP with the information they need to settle this. JR has told me they will post information once they get back and have some facts and real information to share. There is no point carrying on with all this speculation until there is something new and factual to talk about.
As stated in the other thread the two rifles were supplied by TSE, I'm not sure if they had been sitting in the basement for years or if they were from their personal collection, or trade-in's. It has been stated though that they were from two separate shipments that were a couple years apart so to me things aren't looking good for us since that means there could be numerous C/A rifles floating around in the hands of unknowing individuals.
My hopes are that they either offer an exchange program for anyone in possession of one of the C/A rifles as a straight trade for a new one or that if they decide to prohibit them that all current owners will be compensated full retail value for the rifle, all magazines and accessories including taxes.

My post was not speculation, I am asking for facts on the two C/A rifles that were found.

From what I know I don't think things are going to go well. If there was a way to collect only the C/A rifles and leave the rest alone it would be better but it doesn't sound like they know how many are out there or who purchased them which will make things very difficult in justifying letting us keep them unless they get rid of the all C/A rifles are prohibited rule.

If TSE would start the process now in finding the C/A rifles that were imported by mistake and taking them back on their own on exchange or refund before the RCMP deadline it would go a long way to show the involved parties are willing to resolve this problem for both our government and the customers who unknowingly bought them.

It won't immediately make us criminals, they will have to give us a time frame to turn them in willingly before we become criminals. If it comes to that I expect compensation otherwise there will be lawsuits and every rifle turned in will probably just be a stripped upper receiver. The parts will be useless but it will be done out of spite and to make sure they don't end up in the hands of the RCMP as their new toys.

Not immediately but there are people in rural areas who will never recieve notice to turn it in or know it has become prohibited that this will make criminals out of

I personally think that if they go prohibited that TSE should buy every rifle and magazine from every owner for full retail and then they can deal with the RCMP themselves.

I agree but I could see this bankrupting a company with that dollar amount not to mention the legal implications if the RCMP imposes a penalty on them.

What the owners of these rifles need are the facts about the C/A rifles and we are not getting them

 

[Brian46]

I have recently received some more accurate info on the rifles. I can't post the documents yet but I will add to my website once I can.
ESF9116 was imported by CSC in late 2012. ESF73096 was imported by TSE about 2008 and has been there since then in my opinion as pictures of the receiver show inventory stickers we used to track guns. ESF74361 was imported by FN Sports in 2012 and subsequently sold to TSE for retail sale.
I am not sure what specific help this provides but hopefully it helps.

It shows a clearer picture of how wide spread of a problem this is with the two C/A guns being from different importers and much different years, It would appear that there may be quite a few C/A rifles here by mistake making this problem far worse for us.

 

[cr5]

My post was not speculation, I am asking for facts on the two C/A rifles that were found.
If TSE would start the process now in finding the C/A rifles that were imported by mistake and taking them back on their own on exchange or refund before the RCMP deadline it would go a long way to show the involved parties are willing to resolve this problem for both our government and the customers who unknowingly bought them.


Not immediately but there are people in rural areas who will never recieve notice to turn it in or know it has become prohibited that this will make criminals out of
I agree but I could see this bankrupting a company with that dollar amount not to mention the legal implications if the RCMP imposes a penalty on them.

What the owners of these rifles need are the facts about the C/A rifles and we are not getting them

That's the problem, they don't know how many were brought in by mistake or who they were sold to.
There are no other facts about the C/A rifles to share, they appear to have been mixed in with the shipments. It's not like they have a list of serial numbers of the C/A rifles and a list of people they were sold to with current contact information so they can call them up and ask them to come in for a replacement.
Those same people in rural areas your worried about becoming criminals because they never received notice probably wouldn't get the facts about them if they were posted here either so it wouldn't matter.
The only known facts available about the C/A rifles have been posted in the form of pictures on how to identify if your rifle is C/A or semi auto only. Nothing more is available yet.
As you can see from the serial numbers posted by CSC they are random and years apart so there isn't a definite range of numbers to share.

Maybe the buyback costs would need to be split between all the importers. Someone other than the customer or taxpayer needs to eat this expense.

Like I said, it doesn't look good for us being able to keep these fine rifles.

 

[Brian46]

That's the problem, they don't know how many were brought in by mistake or who they were sold to.
There are no other facts about the C/A rifles to share, they appear to have been mixed in with the shipments. It's not like they have a list of serial numbers of the C/A rifles and a list of people they were sold to with current contact information so they can call them up and ask them to come in for a replacement.
Those same people in rural areas your worried about becoming criminals because they never received notice probably wouldn't get the facts about them if they were posted here either so it wouldn't matter.
The only known facts available about the C/A rifles have been posted in the form of pictures on how to identify if your rifle is C/A or semi auto only. Nothing more is available yet.
As you can see from the serial numbers posted by CSC they are random and years apart so there isn't a definite range of numbers to share.

Maybe the buyback costs would need to be split between all the importers. Someone other than the customer or taxpayer needs to eat this expense.

Like I said, it doesn't look good for us being able to keep these fine rifles.

Previous to the recent post by CSC on the origin (who imported the two C/A rifles) I (and others) were hopefull that this was contained to only the TSE marked rifles as the importers of said rifles were not named and it was assumed TSE supplied them both from their own imports/stock, now we know it is a much larger problem.

You are right the pics of how to tell are posted, but I am sure nobody wants to publically announce they have one at this present time, maybe the dealers and retailers can post up some info on how they want to handle getting these rifles returned to them or exchanged?

 

[Eric_911]

...

 

[cr5]

Previous to the recent post by CSC on the origin (who imported the two C/A rifles) I (and others) were hopefull that this was contained to only the TSE marked rifles as the importers of said rifles were not named and it was assumed TSE supplied them both from their own imports/stock, now we know it is a much larger problem.

You are right the pics of how to tell are posted, but I am sure nobody wants to publically announce they have one at this present time, maybe the dealers and retailers can post up some info on how they want to handle getting these rifles returned to them or exchanged?

Won't make any difference if you have one that is C/A or a semi auto only. If we can't prove every C/A receiver has been turned in they will all become prohibited. So unless there is a way to prove how many are out there and then account for every one they are all going to be taken from us.

For us to be able to keep them we will need to provide documentation proving how many C/A's were brought in and prove that they have all been collected. Then there is the issue of proving they are of 540 lineage and not 550.

 

[loki_81]

Won't make any difference if you have one that is C/A or a semi auto only. If we can't prove every C/A receiver has been turned in they will all become prohibited. So unless there is a way to prove how many are out there and then account for every one they are all going to be taken from us.

For us to be able to keep them we will need to provide documentation proving how many C/A's were brought in and prove that they have all been collected. Then there is the issue of proving they are of 540 lineage and not 550.

I think some of you have it backward.

Exactly what proof has anyone outside of the firearms lab seen beside the side of an upper receiver? At the moment the C/A is a red herring, what's at question is the lineage. Which is also a load of crap, as apparently the term 'variant' can mean similar appearance (AP-80).

Forest through the trees my friends.

 

[loki_81]

Oh and of course am I right in assuming all of you have written and sent your letters?

 

[KevinB]

Well ya.

Curious, at what point would you consider a magazine high-capacity here in the US? After 30? After 40 (because that is standard for some) or just never?

I maintain that a standard capacity magazine is a magazine that was intended by the OEM to ship with the weapon (or firearm in Canada )

So I would accept that the Surefire 60 and 100rd magazines could be called Hi-Cap for the AR-15 FOW, and the Glock 33rd mag for the 19/17 series being hi-cap.

Maybe even my 14rd M&P45 mags from S&W are hi-cap as the gun ships with 10's.

 

[Not Long]

A few pages ago.

There is no point carrying on with all this speculation until there is something new and factual to talk about.

Oh, I don't know, carrying-on with pure recycled speculation seems pretty popular evidently...

 

[Brian46]

Won't make any difference if you have one that is C/A or a semi auto only. If we can't prove every C/A receiver has been turned in they will all become prohibited. So unless there is a way to prove how many are out there and then account for every one they are all going to be taken from us.

For us to be able to keep them we will need to provide documentation proving how many C/A's were brought in and prove that they have all been collected. Then there is the issue of proving they are of 540 lineage and not 550.

Originally Posted by Brian46
If TSE would start the process now in finding the C/A rifles that were imported by mistake and taking them back on their own on exchange or refund before the RCMP deadline it would go a long way to show the involved parties are willing to resolve this problem for both our government and the customers who unknowingly bought them.

If lineage was supplied once by SAN it can be supplied again

 

[Vimy Ridge]

The problem is, once the ball gets rolling and the rcmp are able to prohib some firearms on their own initiative - are they going to stop? Hell no. They will keep going until they are forced to stop.

qft