90gr Berger VLD and the 223 - 500m Group 1 1/16"X 1/8" see post 357

Will these 90's stabilize in an 8 twist barrel with good accuracy? I have heard some say yes and some say no. Anybody have any experience with this, good or bad?
My chamber is .223 improved 40 so I could probably get 2950 fps or so
I'd love to try berger 90 vld, and possibly even 90 JLK with its even higher BC
 
I wouldn't buy an 8 twist thinking it would work, if I had one laying around I would try it. Depending on conditions at your location it may or may not work but if you were looking at buying a new barrel, there is no reason not to get a 1-7 if you plan to shoot the 90's.
 
flyinlead said:
Will these 90's stabilize in an 8 twist barrel with good accuracy? I have heard some say yes and some say no. Anybody have any experience with this, good or bad?
My chamber is .223 improved 40 so I could probably get 2950 fps or so
I'd love to try berger 90 vld, and possibly even 90 JLK with its even higher BC
Click to expand...

I have shot the 90gr VLD in a mag fed Shilen 8 twist and it flew just fine out to 1200yds. I will spend more time testing this combo now that match season is over.

What did I use for my F TR rifles? 7 twist cause you just never know

Chalk up another win for the 90's. Just completed the Kamloops Farky in some horrendous conditions and here are how the cals worked out:

Sat 1st 90gr BT, 2nd 308 (not sure on bullet), 3rd 90gr VLD, 4th 308 out by 1 V

Sun 1st 90gr VLD, 2nd 90gr BT, 3rd 308 by a few V's, 4th 308

AGG 1st 90gr BT, 2nd 308, 3rd 90gr VLD, 4th 308

1st to 3rd separated by 11 V's

About 1/3 of the field shot 223's with various bullets from 82's to 90's

Under those conditions and shooters, the 223 and 308 were an equal with the results only separated by a gust of wind.

Jerry
 
I thought Caroline was shooting the 82's but Cassidy was shooting the 90's? Pretty sure they were using different bullets.

Yep, a Ruger/Krieger 223 for Greg.

Did anyone get a " V shot" when the targets blew off?

Jerry
 
Pretty sure it was Cassidy shooting the 82's. When I talked to Terry he had mentioned how well she was doing and how well the 82gr bullets shot.

You were correct:
Right from the horses mouth (so to speak :D)

Cassidy shot the 90 VLD and Caroline 82 BT
 
Last edited:
Mystic Precision said:
I have shot the 90gr VLD in a mag fed Shilen 8 twist and it flew just fine out to 1200yds. I will spend more time testing this combo now that match season is over.

What did I use for my F TR rifles? 7 twist cause you just never know

Chalk up another win for the 90's. Just completed the Kamloops Farky in some horrendous conditions and here are how the cals worked out:

Sat 1st 90gr BT, 2nd 308 (not sure on bullet), 3rd 90gr VLD, 4th 308 out by 1 V

Sun 1st 90gr VLD, 2nd 90gr BT, 3rd 308 by a few V's, 4th 308

AGG 1st 90gr BT, 2nd 308, 3rd 90gr VLD, 4th 308

1st to 3rd separated by 11 V's

About 1/3 of the field shot 223's with various bullets from 82's to 90's

Under those conditions and shooters, the 223 and 308 were an equal with the results only separated by a gust of wind.

Jerry
Click to expand...

Don't want to poop in the 223 camp, but lets not forget to mention the .308 that was on the bench that had 5 more points than the FTR winner. just sayin!d:h:
 
It's been about seeing if the 223 can hold its own with the 308 under varied conditions and multiple shooters.

With a range of 22cal bullets and several shooters, the scores for each relay showed that the luck of the conditions played a larger role then cal choice, at least out to 500m.

The 308's also had a range of bullets with nothing really dominating. Scores were very volatile and very close to the 223.

At the end, it was pretty much a wash AND that is the result that excites me.

Awesome to see a 12yrs old girl do so well in challenging conditions. Would she have shot as well with a 308?

Would she have wanted to?

Some of the best scores in FTR for a relay were shot with 223's and not all by the same shooter. That is also a really great thing to see.

So we are growing a list of 22cal options that WILL allow a shooter to play on an equal footing with the 308. Given all the other good things the 223 can offer a shooter, this is a very positive development.

For 2012, more time will be spent competing at longer distances. hopefully, Kamloops will let us play further too.

With side by side shooting with good 308 drivers, we will get a more developed picture of how competitive the 223 can be.

I am very happy to have squeaked a win in FTR but know all to well that 1st to 4th could have easily switched with just a gust of wind.

Jerry
 
Mystic Precision said:
It's been about seeing if the 223 can hold its own with the 308 under varied conditions and multiple shooters.

With a range of 22cal bullets and several shooters, the scores for each relay showed that the luck of the conditions played a larger role then cal choice, at least out to 500m.

The 308's also had a range of bullets with nothing really dominating. Scores were very volatile and very close to the 223.

At the end, it was pretty much a wash AND that is the result that excites me.

Awesome to see a 12yrs old girl do so well in challenging conditions. Would she have shot as well with a 308?

Would she have wanted to?

Some of the best scores in FTR for a relay were shot with 223's and not all by the same shooter. That is also a really great thing to see.

So we are growing a list of 22cal options that WILL allow a shooter to play on an equal footing with the 308. Given all the other good things the 223 can offer a shooter, this is a very positive development.

For 2012, more time will be spent competing at longer distances. hopefully, Kamloops will let us play further too.

With side by side shooting with good 308 drivers, we will get a more developed picture of how competitive the 223 can be.

I am very happy to have squeaked a win in FTR but know all to well that 1st to 4th could have easily switched with just a gust of wind.

Jerry
Click to expand...

Very well said Jerry, but I don't understand why this is surpriseing?? If we are to believe that the game is all about BC, are these bullets not all in the same neighbourhood? hence the FTR class? I think if the 90gr. 22 cal bullet can be made to shoot accurately it probably has a BC advantage on all but the heavyest 30 cals. And I must tell you that I was the score keeper for the 12yr. old and that gun of hers was a laser, I'm sure in better hands for the conditions it would have won hands down. I'm wondering if those 90's are fussy and not so easy to make shoot??? That being said are the 80's less fussy, cause they still have a pretty good BC?? If I was building a 223 I would be surely asking the details on the barrel, smithing and load that Cassidy was shooting??:p
 
shockman said:
Very well said Jerry, but I don't understand why this is surpriseing?? If we are to believe that the game is all about BC, are these bullets not all in the same neighbourhood? hence the FTR class? I think if the 90gr. 22 cal bullet can be made to shoot accurately it probably has a BC advantage on all but the heavyest 30 cals. And I must tell you that I was the score keeper for the 12yr. old and that gun of hers was a laser, I'm sure in better hands for the conditions it would have won hands down. I'm wondering if those 90's are fussy and not so easy to make shoot??? That being said are the 80's less fussy, cause they still have a pretty good BC?? If I was building a 223 I would be surely asking the details on the barrel, smithing and load that Cassidy was shooting??:p
Click to expand...

Despite the obvious 'paper' properties, many FTR shooters have had concerns about the ability of the 223 to deliver the goods. Add in some rocky early development and it has left some with concerns.

But with so much more development done over the last 3yrs, the 22 VLD's are becoming better understood and improvement in results are coming. having a few wins around the world certainly is not hurting its progress:D

That young lady shot the 90gr VLD and she is developing into an excellent shot. A season or two more experience and you better bring your A+ game against her. If not for the crappy conditions she fought on Sunday, she would have been a contender for the podium for sure.

Her mom shot the 82's. Again, she did superbly with one of the highest scores shot in any relay.

Yes, the 80/82's are easier to set up then the 90gr VLD's. A very good BC too. So it will be a combination of what your barrel likes to shoot and how much tuning you want to do.

We are definitely getting a better understanding of how to tune these bullets. Yes, the 90 VLD's can be fussy in some barrels and powder combo's but when you dial them in... well, you saw the results.

The 223 has only had a few short years in serious F class development so much still needs to be confirmed but we sure have some great combos. I am sure that more bullets will be developed as demand grows.

A less fussy Hybrid may just be the answer?????

The 90gr BT is another great option and am enjoying them in my barrel.

And as things get figured out, I hope that shooters not keen on heavy recoil or with deep pockets will consider this as an entry point into F class.

More shooters, more spouses and juniors and that would put a big smile on my face....

Jerry
 
Took #2 out to 960ish yds yesterday in light but gusty air. With about 3/4 min of wind, hitting a MOAish rock in a row was no problem (rock subtended with reticle)

Another shooter took 4 shots on the same rock with initial coaching and hit it 3 times. 4th was just off as the wind let off. There were no flags.

Very happy with how this load is working and 1000yds will be no problem.

Then we took it out to 1500yds to see if the bullet would go subsonic. Again, no problem with excellent accuracy.

Loving this set up.

Jerry
 
Mystic Precision said:
Despite the obvious 'paper' properties, many FTR shooters have had concerns about the ability of the 223 to deliver the goods. Add in some rocky early development and it has left some with concerns.

But with so much more development done over the last 3yrs, the 22 VLD's are becoming better understood and improvement in results are coming. having a few wins around the world certainly is not hurting its progress:D

That young lady shot the 90gr VLD and she is developing into an excellent shot. A season or two more experience and you better bring your A+ game against her. If not for the crappy conditions she fought on Sunday, she would have been a contender for the podium for sure.

Her mom shot the 82's. Again, she did superbly with one of the highest scores shot in any relay.

Yes, the 80/82's are easier to set up then the 90gr VLD's. A very good BC too. So it will be a combination of what your barrel likes to shoot and how much tuning you want to do.

We are definitely getting a better understanding of how to tune these bullets. Yes, the 90 VLD's can be fussy in some barrels and powder combo's but when you dial them in... well, you saw the results.

The 223 has only had a few short years in serious F class development so much still needs to be confirmed but we sure have some great combos. I am sure that more bullets will be developed as demand grows.

A less fussy Hybrid may just be the answer?????

The 90gr BT is another great option and am enjoying them in my barrel.

And as things get figured out, I hope that shooters not keen on heavy recoil or with deep pockets will consider this as an entry point into F class.

More shooters, more spouses and juniors and that would put a big smile on my face....

Jerry
Click to expand...

Well said Jerry if we are going to make FTR and F class grow we need young people getting into the sport, and lady shooters young people shooting .308s will not get us more shooters involved just to much recoil, 223 is the way to go
Remember |The nationals in Ottawa in Aug was won by Alex shooting a 223 with 90gr VLD
Watched 2 fellows shooting a Sierra match on weekend in Ottawa 2 223 shot 40 rounds at 300m I hour, time limit, target Fclass 1/2 min target both shot a perfect score 40 bulls each one with 31 V bulls other 29 V bulls
308win where not even close
 
flyinlead said:
Will these 90's stabilize in an 8 twist barrel with good accuracy? I have heard some say yes and some say no. Anybody have any experience with this, good or bad?
My chamber is .223 improved 40 so I could probably get 2950 fps or so
I'd love to try berger 90 vld, and possibly even 90 JLK with its even higher BC
Click to expand...

They don,t work in a 28" kreiger 1/ 7.8 80gr Bergers are pure dynamite saw my buddy put 5 in .520" at 300y and many groups under .800 at 300y
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom