ammo shortage, primer shortage

scott_r

scott_r

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I was in Yorkton Homehardware the other day and I can't believe the prices this guy had on his powder, primers and .22 LR ammo. He was wanting over $60 plus tax for a box of fed 205M, $40 for a pound of powder and .22 ammo was marked up alot.

After asking the prices and not taking them, the counter idiot told me I should buy em before they are all gone. "Obama is going to take all the ammo, he's attacking gun owners with ammo" is what he told me and nothing can be done. I dont know about the rest of you but Im tired of hearing this B.S and seeing mark ups of 100% in some cases.

Obama hasnt done a thing to make this ammo and primer shortage. It seems to me like its all the fear mongering done by gunstore owners and people on the net. Obama says "boo" and the gun owners run in a massive panic.

Im glad there are some people willing to pay whatever price is on gun-related goods at the shops cause as much as I love to shoot I may be sitting alot more in my 1800 Fisherman with a rod in my hand then shooting.

What are your thoughts?? Are we doomed like the idiot behind the desk at Yorkton Homehardware say????

Cheers!!
 
Nah. Shoot what you can and sit in your boat until the prices come back close to normal. They will. This isn't the first time this has happened, nor the last.
 
I guess you have to ask your self, " How badly do I want to shoot" Powder for $40.00 isn't that much more than what it costs here in Edmonton, primers here are in the $48.00 for 1000, and Small rifle primers are hard to find, and match primers, forget about it. If I was out of reloading supplies I would pay those prices because I like to shoot, and i like to load, and it is a lot less than buying factory ammo. FS
 
Loaded ammo and components shortage is caused by hoarding in the US. Why? There are several theories floating around, pick one. Once the supply catches up with the demand, the price will drop a little, maybe. Companies like Combat Masters (Canadian BDX) are having major problems getting components out of the US.
 
depending on the pouder. $40 isnt much for pouder. some even before obama got in was $38 a pound.
 
Go to the U.S and you will find there is indeed a shortage.Obama is the best thing for sales.
If you do not like the Canadian prices go on the Dixie Gun Works site and look at primers-They only cost $9:50 for a box of 100 and you are limited to one box only.On top of the cost there is the hazmat fee.This make a box of 1000 cost $95.50 U.S.
 
StoneHorse said:
Loaded ammo and components shortage is caused by hoarding in the US. Why? There are several theories floating around, pick one. Once the supply catches up with the demand, the price will drop a little, maybe. Companies like Combat Masters (Canadian BDX) are having major problems getting components out of the US.
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While at the SHOT show one year I aske dthe rep at Federal about the then primer shortage in Canada (I was shooting a LOT of .38 Super) and he explained that Federal and all other manufacturers had to make a special run of components for Canada because of different packaging, english/french etc., so it is done only once a year. He also explained that primer consumption in Texas (the SHOT show was in Houston that year) for one month exceeds all of Canada for a year! Canada is a very small percentage of their production.
When our demand exceeds our production quota we wait for the next
production run.:50cal:
 
Maybe a dealer or importer can comment on why we don't bring in more loaded ammo and components from other sources? Such as Europe, Brazil or Asia? Given the extreme difficulties in getting anything firearm related out of the US, why do we continue to deal with US companies? Or did I just ask a very naive question?
 
StoneHorse said:
Maybe a dealer or importer can comment on why we don't bring in more loaded ammo and components from other sources? Such as Europe, Brazil or Asia? Given the extreme difficulties in getting anything firearm related out of the US, why do we continue to deal with US companies? Or did I just ask a very naive question?
Click to expand...


It is'nt that simple.
All ammunition and components have to be tested by NRCAN, and if it is found to have non spec chemical properties, like excessive mercury, lead or what ever the flavor of the week is, it wont be allowed for import. This testing often takes more than a year or so it seems.

I'm sure some of the distributors and or businesses on here can explain a whole lot more detail than I.
 
I did not think it would be simple. I am sure it takes time and much paperwork to start the ball rolling on importation of ammo from sources other than the US. But once new overseas suppliers are on-line so to speak, our dependence on the US would be greatly reduced.
 
StoneHorse said:
Loaded ammo and components shortage is caused by hoarding in the US. Why? There are several theories floating around, pick one. Once the supply catches up with the demand, the price will drop a little, maybe. Companies like Combat Masters (Canadian BDX) are having major problems getting components out of the US.
Click to expand...

Stone

When do you see the suppy being greater than the demand. There are still hundreds if not thousands of shooters in the USA that did not stock up before last year. We have it good up here right now compared to many US states, there are many places that can't even buy 22 ammo. Guys talk about being in line at Walmart at 6.00 am to see if they have any ammo for sale. FS
 
I hate to get all BSG here, but this has happened before. It will happen again.

Much as gasoline production from crude oil, ammo and component manufacture in the US is pretty well set at fixed levels of production.

Most of the big ammo manufacturers are operating at 100% capacity due to demand. Short of mechanical break down, they will continue to operate at capacity in the forseeable future. Most will not be adding capacity, except through the normal replacement of equipment. It is not in thier interest to boost production capacity. Not because they couldn't sell 150% of todays capacity, but because they don't want to be stuck for a decade with 50% unused capacity.

Wars come and go. Target shooting, hunting, and police practice ammo sales stay relatively constant. Occationally there are peaks, and sometimes there are system wide changes. Still, at the end of the day, there is capacity within the existing system to deal with most of the demand.

When we have a large war, and a simultanious increase in police demand for training ammo, and follow it up with a gun grabbing politician, we have shortages. As much as it's tempting to suggest the ammo companys increase production capacity, it's actually a bad time to do so. By the time most of the new capacity would come on line, demand would likely have waned. The war could slow down or stop. Municipal/State etc ammo budgets may collapse, and half a million recreational shooters may start to reload and shoot thier stock piles.

If I was the big ammo companies, I'd be looking at what to do with the inevitable downturn. If I was them, I'd be thinking about what types of surplus ammo are no longer available cheaply.
 
Fassteel said:
Stone

When do you see the suppy being greater than the demand. There are still hundreds if not thousands of shooters in the USA that did not stock up before last year. We have it good up here right now compared to many US states, there are many places that can't even buy 22 ammo. Guys talk about being in line at Walmart at 6.00 am to see if they have any ammo for sale. FS
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I never said the supply will ever be greater than the demand. Here in Canada, at least in my area, I have been able to find all the 9mm and .22 rimfire ammo that I need. So I guess we have been lucky so far. Gotta suck lining up at Wally World just to see if any ammo has arrived.
 
This has been going on for a while, it's only really getting bad now. Primer shortage has been around for years. CCI and Remington primers are actually easy to find, it's just the Federal primers that aren't, and that's simply because Alliant Techsystems, Federal's parent company, is supplying ammo to the military under contract loaded with Federal primers. They make a lot more money off their fat military contract than they do off of Johnny Hunter, so that's where the focus is. Too bad the Remington and CCI primers aren't nearly as good as the 205/210/215 trio.

Ammo prices are going up as well not because of any shortage, but because there is a "perceived" shortage. Obama hasn't taken anything away yet and a lot of the misinformation floating around is from "sky is falling" conspiracy theorists and right-wing extremists. Ammo manufacturers are quick to realize the market will support increased pricing simply due to panic caused by a Democrat taking office with a Democratic House and Senate supporting him, and thus they're enjoying higher revenues than normal while the pro-gun establishment is busy stocking up on ammo in case TSHTF.

I was just at WSS and Cabelas not two hours ago and their shelves are right stocked with ammo and components, it's just gonna cost you a bit more than before. Also, everyone knows Norma loads the good stuff anyways ;)
 
"If our friends in the USA were shooting even half as much as they are buying, we'd be able to hear it in Edmonton"

It's a really good time to be in the ammo business. There's one segmant of the US economy that Obama has successfully invigorated.
 
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Seems to be hit and miss too. I just picked up 1000 large rifle match primers and 1000 small rifle primers for about $85 here in Vanc and just bought 3 1lb cans of IMR powders new from a GNnr for $75. Then theres Russells and Wholesale. Sure there is that Transport of Dangerous Goods charge but if you get a buddy or 2 that thins out too. A little "creative" goes a long way.
 
mikeyb said:
This has been going on for a while, it's only really getting bad now. Primer shortage has been around for years. CCI and Remington primers are actually easy to find, it's just the Federal primers that aren't, and that's simply because Alliant Techsystems, Federal's parent company, is supplying ammo to the military under contract loaded with Federal primers. They make a lot more money off their fat military contract than they do off of Johnny Hunter, so that's where the focus is. Too bad the Remington and CCI primers aren't nearly as good as the 205/210/215 trio.
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Re: Remington and CCI primers not as good-For what applications? I'm always interested in primer studies. Have you done any testing that you would care to share?
 
I read a press release from ATK (Federal's parent company) that said they were laying off a bunch of workers as they had "caught up" on orders, they were just keeping the regular staff on.

Not so sure on the rumour about Federal's primer supply going to the military...smells fishy---and here's why-- because the majority of small arms ammo that is used by the military uses primers designed to be used in full auto application to prevent slam fires in MGs and full auto rifles. CCI makes an equivalent primer, I think it is no. 34. that duplicates mil spec for Lg. rifle size.mil spec and the civilian specs are different.

I'm sure that the primers used by them in small and large rifle applications are different than the 205, 210, and 215s that are in short supply here.

ATK operates the Lake City Army Ammunition Plant for the army-not their own plant for the army.


anybody add to this? thoughts?
 
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