Black Guns, Industry and Ethics.

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Korporal said:
With the size of our firearms industry up here, a little shilling was mostly expected. You could see it coming a mile away what with all the teaser posts, videos and pre-hype.

Not defending it, just not surprised by it.
I'm torn. We need more manufacturers up here and some of the actions of US manufacturers are a tad worse i.e: Sabre, Robinson Arms @ SHOT etc...
Why so much greasyness??
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I knew they'd come up in this thread !...:p
 
I think in the intrests of fairness, those who are questioning Kevinbs integrity should make thier cases publically instead of making vague insinuations.
 
Okay,

I came in with about 12 hours of sleep in the last week and wrote this. It came off a lot more agressive and personal that I had intended.

My frustration was more about this Websites handling of the event, than NEA's actions. As several of you know I resigned as a mod about 6 years ago in another episode of a mod being struck down.


NEA made a mistake - they got caught and admited their action, my point was they have the ability to be the premier firearms company in Canada, IF they go forward from this. My comments where originally designed not to run people of the coals, or highlight anything specific, I was just shocked what had occured here, and after a good week of friendly banter with industry this pissed me off to a point where I should have written Dave personally and said 'Dude you ####ed up', and for that I apoligize to him for doing this publically.

Many folks think I was the biggest SHILL for KAC prior to me coming on board, but I never took a dime from them prior to being employed.

I'm disheartened to learn that USP was fired over this issue -- but that is not NEA's fault, it's GT's.
 
A simple policy change by CGN that all manufacturer and dealer accounts require the use of real names would seem any easy fix.

I have always thought it odd that dealers would use made up names for themselves while selling their products. If I phoned their business I would expect their real names, and I don't see why that should be any different on CGN.

The ability to post anonymously should be forfeited when you choose to sell products as a business. (And yes, that needs to be true even on the great un-policed internet.)

As for whether or not people received quality goods, or fare treatment from any specific dealer or manufacturer, that is another entirely unrelated topic, and deserves to be dealt with seperately.

I don't believe the dealers or manufacturers in question intended to go down this path of 'shilling'. When dealing with conflict of interest issues like this, its often difficult to recognize how far you've crossed a line until you look back and see it behind you.

Regards,

Kirk
 
Chemist said:
Edited to reword a point:

So you are saying it is OK for the part owner to post about how great thier product is with a personal account and then have the other owner reply with his dealer account...if so then I must be in the wrong. To me it is very similar...pumping up your product with one account, replying with the other....similar as what NEA did if the account was fake or not.

As well remember dealers aren't allowed to start post outside of thier forum or the EE to advertise products. We are only allowed to reply to a thread that has already started.
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It is EXACTLY the same thing. Gunbunny = Jeff H and NEA = Dave McFaul. Those accounts were NOT the same person - it's 100% the exact same situation as Farmboy and 556Nato. The difference is that everyone loved to hate NEA because somehow affordable Canadian AR's make some people upset.
 
pbr streetgang said:
lemon would be an understatement on the POS they returned to the customer after they had supposedly serviced the BCG.

and yes...this is what NEA returned as "fixed"
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Yikes! The carrier looks OK, but that gas key should NEVER have left their shop.
 
Claven2 said:
Yikes! The carrier looks OK, but that gas key should NEVER have left their shop.
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As we've explained a few dozen times though, it was never intended to. Somehow though its become the poster child for our gas keys.

I guess when you take a single item out of context and reuse it on every page with NEAs name on it then why would people not think that.
 
KevinB said:
Many folks think I was the biggest SHILL for KAC prior to me coming on board, but I never took a dime from them prior to being employed.

I'm disheartened to learn that USP was fired over this issue -- but that is not NEA's fault, it's GT's.
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I have clarified this already somewhere - USP was told he is difficult to work with because he was just plain rude in the coffee shop. he was only locked out after he demands compensation for his volunteer time while trying to look like a martyr.

This is not about this issue of shilling - it is about me not taking s**t from people who yell and go on angry burst at me, and then demand settlement using some labour law as "weapon". Anyways, enough from me on this. Sorry for the off tracking.
 
I'd buy something from NEA...but I really have no interest in AR platforms anymore...or in restricted long guns for that matter. They effed up a little, got caught and blah blah blah...I've lost track.

I typically form my own opinions based on personal experience and investigation...probably why I still think the P90 and the 5.7x28mm ammo is the best thing since sliced bread... My opinion...my decision... No forum posting - legit, shill or otherwise will sway me...

Now, having put a period at the end of that sentence it's time to move on...if NEA builds up a nice non restricted semi I'll probably buy one.
 
The problem is that - way back in the beginning everyone just pick a name for themselves. Some of these guys have been around here for 8 years. Some accounts are well know personalities, while others are not. People constantly assume everyone knows everyone. For the local people, they probably know 5.56 NATO is a person with a real name. For me I have no clue - and then people send me messages with some first names assuming I know what they are talking about!

I don't know much about this industry beyond administrating CGN. If everyone just stick to the simple path of not commenting on competitors' products, most headache will go away.

At the end of the day, there is no technical ways of "preventing shilling" unless we check ID and do a background check of everyone who is entering the website. Everything should be read with a grain of salt - do your own homework and research. The business people in this community need to respect each other - it should not be counting on us on doing active investigation.

And yes, more stringent terms of use will be coming for business members.


kirkf said:
A simple policy change by CGN that all manufacturer and dealer accounts require the use of real names would seem any easy fix.

I have always thought it odd that dealers would use made up names for themselves while selling their products. If I phoned their business I would expect their real names, and I don't see why that should be any different on CGN.

The ability to post anonymously should be forfeited when you choose to sell products as a business. (And yes, that needs to be true even on the great un-policed internet.)

As for whether or not people received quality goods, or fare treatment from any specific dealer or manufacturer, that is another entirely unrelated topic, and deserves to be dealt with seperately.

I don't believe the dealers or manufacturers in question intended to go down this path of 'shilling'. When dealing with conflict of interest issues like this, its often difficult to recognize how far you've crossed a line until you look back and see it behind you.

Regards,

Kirk
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