Burlington gun club...5 month wait minimum!!

Membership - speed of approval

Apologies to the OP if he found my post about waiting times a bit harsh. I was probably reacting to the collective attitude of subsequent posts on the topic. I was not commenting on your suitability as a member. In fact, I would welcome you if you turned up as a new guy at our club in Saskabush.

You, as an individual, are likely a very nice guy and an asset as a new member to a club. The club does not know that yet - they only know that you have your $100, or whatever the amount, ready to lay down.

Speaking for my club, as I was originally, we are a private club. We want some time to get to know prospective members and ascertain if they fit with our club policies and activities. As a probationary member you are welcome to take part in all club activities. After six months the club executive and board of directors will review your activity in the club to decide on full membership, and will carry over your application another six months if there has not been sufficient opportunity/activity to decide.

Membership dues do not come close to paying the bills to run our club. The annual fee that you would pay is not compelling. It is not a business. The club is a not-for-p[rofit society. Sorry guys if that hurts your feelings. We need members who are active and willing to put something back in to a facility that other volunteer members have built up over the years to be a million dollar facility.
 
Use it or loose it but please don't whine about it . That's the only club in 100 mile radius from Toronto and city elite is catching up , so if the management is tough and you happens to not liking them ---- MOVE ON - Biggs
 
Griffoneur said:
We are our own worst enemies. Burlington is a "safer" gun club I suppose? The stigma and the bull$hit in the firearms community is stifling.

We are Wendy's best allies.
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Couldn't agree more. I have had 6 - count them - 6 new shooters (restricted) in the last year that I have taken shooting and all of them got to the point of asking what they needed to do in order to get into the sport. When I was finished telling them the 1000's of hoops that they would have to jump through both on the government side and on the club side and that they would have to fork out about $500.00 between courses, licenses and club fees before they could even think about getting a gun - they all walked away. Somewhere along the line this insanity has to stop.
 
You already have an ATT, what else would you need? You have taken the course for the ATT already. We take members all the time at my club, if you have an ATT, we do a walk around, show you the facilities, go over the range rules, you pay your dues, and welcome. It boggles my mind at the rules of some the clubs and how long it takes to get into them, that is not promoting the sport.
 
Steve David said:
You already have an ATT, what else would you need? You have taken the course for the ATT already. We take members all the time at my club, if you have an ATT, we do a walk around, show you the facilities, go over the range rules, you pay your dues, and welcome. It boggles my mind at the rules of some the clubs and how long it takes to get into them, that is not promoting the sport.
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We do the same thing at my club.

If you have taken the CSSA handgun course you have taken the course. End of story.

An hour or so tour and you are GTG.

you do not get your own key for 3 months however.
 
saskbooknut said:
Apologies to the OP if he found my post about waiting times a bit harsh. I was probably reacting to the collective attitude of subsequent posts on the topic. I was not commenting on your suitability as a member. In fact, I would welcome you if you turned up as a new guy at our club in Saskabush.

You, as an individual, are likely a very nice guy and an asset as a new member to a club. The club does not know that yet - they only know that you have your $100, or whatever the amount, ready to lay down.

Speaking for my club, as I was originally, we are a private club. We want some time to get to know prospective members and ascertain if they fit with our club policies and activities. As a probationary member you are welcome to take part in all club activities. After six months the club executive and board of directors will review your activity in the club to decide on full membership, and will carry over your application another six months if there has not been sufficient opportunity/activity to decide.

Membership dues do not come close to paying the bills to run our club. The annual fee that you would pay is not compelling. It is not a business. The club is a not-for-p[rofit society. Sorry guys if that hurts your feelings. We need members who are active and willing to put something back in to a facility that other volunteer members have built up over the years to be a million dollar facility.
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I think this post sums up the attitude of lots of clubs.

Most club safety courses are not just about safety, it's about getting to know the prospective member.

Private clubs have much to lose if members screw up, particularly clubs in the GTA and environs.

Each club has it's own rules. Some seem funny to some, but they work. Admittedly, sometimes people get carried away, but a range closure can be a very serious situation. The chances of ever opening a new club within 150 miles of Toronto are nigh impossible, so clubs have a lot to lose if they are closed.

Judging from some of the talk on Gunnutz, there are some (not many) that would give cause for concern for almost any club.

The fact that one has passes a safety course at one club does not mean they know all of the rules at another. There are other things that need to be learned about the idiosyncrasies of the particular club.

There may be rules that have been instituted by the club to maintain harmony with the neighbours or the township. There may be rules to deal with certain physical peculiarities of the club facilities.

Long established clubs have hundreds of thousands of dollars and sweat equity invested in the club. All of this can be lost by some unthinking individual who causes a problem for the club.

Local by-laws are becoming more and more restrictive, and townships, particularly when driven by disgruntled neighbours are somewhat unforgiving when it comes to enforcement. This can lead to huge legal bills for clubs as well as significant fines.

On the other hand, it's great to see we have a demand for our facilities. This means more and more of that 80% who couldn't care less about firearms is coming over to our side. That means we have a chance through public opinion, to change oppressive laws that have crept in over the past 30 years.
 
nwills said:
Like I said...I'm not trying to badmouth Burlington Club...that's not my intention. I just feel they should try to make the process easier...streamline it? Make sure potential members feel welcomed.

I'm not saying that safety courses are not necessary. As a father of two I can only appreciate the importance of club safety...I would hate to catch a bullet because someone next to me is careless!

That doesn't change the fact that every other club I've dealt with was much more forthcoming and helpful in trying to get me as a new member.

My frustration comes from the fact that I DO want to be a member there....so all those that have nothing better to suggest than me moving on...thanks for nothing.

Either ways....I don't generally go for organizations that make me feel unwelcome with what I consider to be a overly lengthy process...

That's my opinion...and I'm entitled to it.

In closing...All those that are members there and enjoy their membership...great! It seems like a otherwise very good range.

Thanks
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Your opinion is the only thing your entitled to. Range Burlington is a large club. They have many members who went through process you are whining about and are happily shooting there. What makes you so special that you should bypass the same rules as any other member?

Certain clubs have their turn being trashed on this site when self-centred and impatient people who feel entitled to their entitlements consider themselves of such an elite status that they don't have to follow the same rules as everyone else.

I don't belong to Range Burlington. But I don't think they are crying in their colas because you've decided not to join.
 
Doug The Canuck said:
The chances of ever opening a new club within 150 miles of Toronto are nigh impossible, so clubs have a lot to lose if they are closed.
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Instead of these ranges being closed they could be bought and turned into clubs with more firearms friendly rules :)

I was seriously SHOCKED at how few the ranges were in Canada. It makes me sick! I know multiple people who wanted to get their gun license but there is no range within 45 minutes of them so they don't get it.

Not to mention there are so many FULL ranges everywhere!!

It really is upsetting, and probably forces people to go out and shoot illegally. :bangHead:
 
Claybuster said:
I don't belong to Range Burlington. But I don't think they are crying in their colas because you've decided not to join.
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i think that's what OP's saying... they didn't seem to care at all if he joined or not, and they certainly didn't make it easy for him. (Or me when i wanted to join burlington)

I'm not saying they should be crying, but maybe they should be re-evaluating there business practices.
 
canadiansurvivor said:
i think that's what OP's saying... they didn't seem to care at all if he joined or not, and they certainly didn't make it easy for him. (Or me when i wanted to join burlington)

I'm not saying they should be crying, but maybe they should be re-evaluating there business practices.
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They aren't a business. They are a non-profit corporation run by volunteers on behalf of the members.

Every shooting club has a maximum number of members beyond which the club becomes too busy. When that happens you lose people who were already members who do not have the same access to range.

Unless the club needs the money it is better to make it more difficult for new members to join than to lose long-time members because the club is too busy.

The only business practice they might want to look at is their annual fee. Perhaps it is too low. Maybe they need to double it. Imagine the whining and crying you'd that would be posted on ths site if that happened. :rolleyes:
 
saskbooknut said:
Love the attitude.
I am sure that the club in question is breathing a sigh of relief that you are no longer interested.
My club has a waiting period to see if prospective new members are willing to put something back in to the club.
Through the foresight of early members we have a wonderful facility with thousands of hours of sweat equity. We don't "need" new members who just want to use our work without putting in some of their own.
If that is a problem you are welcome to go somewhere else.
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f:P:2:
 
USP said:
Having been a member of Burlington for almost 20 years, I havent sent in my membership dues yet. After the bulls**t with the CFI and the target crap last spring (althought it was changed) I am starting to wonder what is so great about the club anyways. Its small and has poor facilities compared to the other clubs. The only plus is that its 24 hours, I dont shoot much at 3am anymore.

Maybe you can have my spot if I dont send in my dues.
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If you have been there 20 years why are you not on the board? And after that long they sure as hell should listen to you regarding the problems there... or are those in charge there really that dense?
 
Claybuster said:
They aren't a business. They are a non-profit corporation run by volunteers on behalf of the members.

Every shooting club has a maximum number of members beyond which the club becomes too busy. When that happens you lose people who were already members who do not have the same access to range.

Unless the club needs the money it is better to make it more difficult for new members to join than to lose long-time members because the club is too busy.

The only business practice they might want to look at is their annual fee. Perhaps it is too low. Maybe they need to double it. Imagine the whining and crying you'd that would be posted on ths site if that happened. :rolleyes:
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You are a true ambassador to our sport!

Keep up the good work! :jerkit:
 
Doug The Canuck said:
Private clubs have much to lose if members screw up, particularly clubs in the GTA and environs.

Each club has it's own rules. Some seem funny to some, but they work. Admittedly, sometimes people get carried away, but a range closure can be a very serious situation. The chances of ever opening a new club within 150 miles of Toronto are nigh impossible, so clubs have a lot to lose if they are closed.
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Seems to me that this type of thinking will guarantee that the city of Toronto will continue to be an enemy to the firearms community. The only way to change the situation is to get more of the population comfortable with firearms. The only way that this will happen is to get more people into the shooting sports. This doesn't happen when we make it difficult for newcomers. The hunker down and protect what we have mentality will suffice for the short term but eventually will close the doors of the few ranges that we do have left.
 
jusdivinum said:
Seems to me that this type of thinking will guarantee that the city of Toronto will continue to be an enemy to the firearms community. The only way to change the situation is to get more of the population comfortable with firearms. The only way that this will happen is to get more people into the shooting sports. This doesn't happen when we make it difficult for newcomers. The hunker down and protect what we have mentality will suffice for the short term but eventually will close the doors of the few ranges that we do have left.
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Indeed.. and now w/Ford in office it's a good time to press forward w/more clubs!
 
jusdivinum said:
Seems to me that this type of thinking will guarantee that the city of Toronto will continue to be an enemy to the firearms community. The only way to change the situation is to get more of the population comfortable with firearms. The only way that this will happen is to get more people into the shooting sports. This doesn't happen when we make it difficult for newcomers. The hunker down and protect what we have mentality will suffice for the short term but eventually will close the doors of the few ranges that we do have left.
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Well said!!....and I'd like to point out that this 4 page thread isn't about whining....It's about sharing an opinion and a open discussion on the subject of promoting target sports and getting more people into it. Being such a bunch of tight asses will not do that. Keep being so severe and keeping it so damn hard for newcomers to get into and when the number of folks participating in this drops to an all time low...then go and try to see if there won't be a complete restriction on target sports in this country. It's called power in numbers...the more people participate, the higher the percentage of the population is involved, the harder it will be for the Provoncial and Federal government to take this away.

I am happily the member of both Silverdale and The Grange and I can tell you that it's been a great experience...friendly, outgoing and very inviting....I payed membership at both clubs and intend on spending a lot more money at both ranges....therefore...supporting them with my money enabling them to continue. A smile, courteous attitude and effort to see me become part of the club is all I asked for....but it seems that according to some folks on this forum...that makes me an elite...or feel like I deserve special treatment and I should keep my opinion to myself. pffff....please...you guys are what could cost this sport its longevity...

And please...stop calling me an elite, whiner, bad attitude...I'm simply someone who used this forum which has many Canadian shooting enthusiast to share my opinion and turn it into a discussion...not for you to try to bash me in return to my post....otherwise...let's have a moderator indicate that I was out of line by saying what I said and I'll keep the talk to more simple issues and gear talk.
 
saskbooknut said:
Sorry guys if that hurts your feelings. We need members who are active and willing to put something back in to a facility that other volunteer members have built up over the years to be a million dollar facility.
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I have found that new members are the most active and willing to come out and help out were and when needed. At our last range work day we had almost 40 members out to help, of those over 50% were new members.
 
elitism

jusdivinum said:
Seems to me that this type of thinking will guarantee that the city of Toronto will continue to be an enemy to the firearms community. The only way to change the situation is to get more of the population comfortable with firearms. The only way that this will happen is to get more people into the shooting sports. This doesn't happen when we make it difficult for newcomers. The hunker down and protect what we have mentality will suffice for the short term but eventually will close the doors of the few ranges that we do have left.
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I happened on this thread, and I happen to agree with Griffoneur and the others. All this elitism and "old school' mentality is driving new blood out of our sport. Coupled with the fact that the Wendys and the Liberals are targeting us, we are definitely dividing ourselves into oblivion.

I have been a member of a few clubs and I chose to stay with the clubs that would provide new spirit and new attitudes to supporting new members.

We should be sticking with and supporting each other, rather than being snobs and not giving people a chance.

My 2 cents.....................
 
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