Canadian Armed Forces looking to retire BHP by 2026
- Thread starter Challenger2010
- Start date
- Location
- On the beach
Train at the level of the slowest man (insert eye rolly emoji here).
- Location
- On the beach
...and the CAF has specified "Striker fired"
The Cdn Forces could have spent 10 minutes watching an ISPC or IDPA match to learn how to safely lower a hammer onto a loaded chamber. It happens virtually every week-end at thousands of matches across North American by shooters playing IDPA, IPSC and ISPSA. I have never witnessed a AD/ND using the thumb roll method to lower a hammer on a loaded chamber. Hell their are videos on the subject. If Cdn soldiers were experiencing ND's either at home or abroad while lowering hammers on their Hi-Powers than their is something seriously wrong with their training or training methods. No other way to describe it.
Take Care
Bob
I think HP's are exceptional firearms and greatly enjoy them, however they are no longer the ideal tool for all jobs. That "all jobs" part is important as a pistol replacement will be issued to most communities. I think the suggestion of a Glock 19 is smart as it strikes a very nice balance. Plus it's idiot proof for the Army types (I joke I joke......kind of).
I had a soldier come to me oversea's and ask me "How do I get the bolt out of my handgun" I asked this person have they ever shot the BHP and they replied "once on work up training". Is this acceptable? absolutely not, but it's the card many in the CAF are dealt. We need a pistol that is easy to use and as safe as possible for someone with little to no training.
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I understand. I was shooting with two RCMP Officers at our range a couple of years ago. The two were practicing for their annual Classification. I was just out there doing some timed draw practice. Two overheard comment left me shaking my head while returning from taping our targets.
1. Older officer said to have been in the RCMP, former New Westminster LEO, yes I see you shoot the 9MM Luger, my pistol is the 9MM Para Model. - referring I suppose to the head stamp on the cartridges both were using.
2. Same officer who I suspect was taking the slightly junior officer under his wing. "Yes you will like the pistol, mine has the adjustable rear sight, you can move the sight back and forth by hand to adjust for wind-age and elevation. Some of our guns come with fixed rear sights that you can't move."
I just smiled and walked back to my bench.
Take Care
Bob
Brutus
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Seen many HRM police officers training at an indoor range. Out of the twenty or so officers, only two of them demonstrated considerable proficiency with their issue handguns.
Both had many years of service behind them, one was a narcotics detective who carried a shorter barreled pistol and the other one was a K9 officer whom carried the full size variant.
They rest were absolute drek regarding "accuracy" and speed of reload drills.
Both had many years of service behind them, one was a narcotics detective who carried a shorter barreled pistol and the other one was a K9 officer whom carried the full size variant.
They rest were absolute drek regarding "accuracy" and speed of reload drills.
The British are dropping the hi-power for the glock. I'm sure they must have done some testing and the glock has a durable reputation and has readily available parts and low cost, so ......
Why not just follow suit?
Oh, and sell the Canadian forces hi-powers to us and it costs next to nothing to replace them lol
And yes, I know we send them to the smelter
Why not just follow suit?
Oh, and sell the Canadian forces hi-powers to us and it costs next to nothing to replace them lol
And yes, I know we send them to the smelter
Eaglelord17
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Sault Ste. Marie
Overall the Hi-Power is not a bad pistol. Yes it is a bit outdated but is it really worth upgrading to something slightly better?
This is the reason they have stayed in service so long is because we barely use pistols to begin with, and its not like the modern designs are much better (its not like the difference between a Webley Revolver and a Browning Hi-Power). So what modern designs are slightly lighter, slightly easier to disassemble, and have slightly larger magazine capacities.
Parts are definitely running out, but it almost isn't even worth the money and effort to replace them. At the moment it is pick and choose what we need, and a pistol replacement I think should be at the bottom of the list after all the bigger things which the CF needs.
Just a short list of critical kit the CF is lacking...
-Self Propelled Arty
-Good anti-tank system
-Anti-Air Systems
-Combat Ships, even our newest 'fresh out of refit' ships are already showing there age, when the design was only meant for 25 years and it has already reached that point, it isn't a good time to call it a mid life refit
-Resupply Ships, its embarrassing for us to be relying on Chile for resupply
-Fighter Aircraft, those CF-18s are getting up there
-'B' class vehicle fleet (aka all those trucks that supply the CF in war, without supply you might as well not even bother showing up)
-Boots
I could keep going but in any case you can see why I would consider a pistol replacement to be pretty low on the needs category. The odds of lack of a pistol being the reason you died in a modern battlefield is exceptionally low, lack of those other things I listed is much higher up on the reasons you would die.
This is the reason they have stayed in service so long is because we barely use pistols to begin with, and its not like the modern designs are much better (its not like the difference between a Webley Revolver and a Browning Hi-Power). So what modern designs are slightly lighter, slightly easier to disassemble, and have slightly larger magazine capacities.
Parts are definitely running out, but it almost isn't even worth the money and effort to replace them. At the moment it is pick and choose what we need, and a pistol replacement I think should be at the bottom of the list after all the bigger things which the CF needs.
Just a short list of critical kit the CF is lacking...
-Self Propelled Arty
-Good anti-tank system
-Anti-Air Systems
-Combat Ships, even our newest 'fresh out of refit' ships are already showing there age, when the design was only meant for 25 years and it has already reached that point, it isn't a good time to call it a mid life refit
-Resupply Ships, its embarrassing for us to be relying on Chile for resupply
-Fighter Aircraft, those CF-18s are getting up there
-'B' class vehicle fleet (aka all those trucks that supply the CF in war, without supply you might as well not even bother showing up)
-Boots
I could keep going but in any case you can see why I would consider a pistol replacement to be pretty low on the needs category. The odds of lack of a pistol being the reason you died in a modern battlefield is exceptionally low, lack of those other things I listed is much higher up on the reasons you would die.
Add a modular fighting rig to that. I know the SWORD rig is getting out there, and some Patricias have MAV's, but its pretty bad when the supply techs are wearing rigs next to infantry guys with inadequate snack vests.
A more modern pistol will also equal better holster selection- the Bianchis are trash, and I cant fork out 300 bucks on a safariland because I just spent that on Lowas because the issued boots are junk. Also, flashlights. we put them on rifles, they go on pistols too. They want stiker fired, go Glock. But as mutiple people have said, good luck having someone give right to CC to produce it here.
Hey Fellas. Listen, I never served, am not a "high speed/ low drag" type or an "operator"... I'm just a lifelong redneck firearms enthusiast... and I just don't know why COLT Canada has a monopoly on firearms issued to the CF?
I understand, I think, that the intent is to have secure domestic production... but why Colt Canada, and not Glock Canada, or Sig Canada etc...?
As always, I enjoy the informative threads and unsubscribe from the ones infested with the keyboard warriors...
I L-O-V-E hearing from ACTUAL men who have served and who know.
I understand, I think, that the intent is to have secure domestic production... but why Colt Canada, and not Glock Canada, or Sig Canada etc...?
As always, I enjoy the informative threads and unsubscribe from the ones infested with the keyboard warriors...
I L-O-V-E hearing from ACTUAL men who have served and who know.
Brutus
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
I think I can answer you quite easily with just a few facts and some common sense;
-Colt Canada is licensed through it's parent company in the USA to manufacture the AR platform here in this country
-myself I don't know of any other company in Canada that had/had the rights to manufacture the AR since it's selection in 1984ish by the CF
-the initial Canadian company Diemaco, was bought out by Colt Defense in 2005
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OkayShooter
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Nova Scotia
Its true. In my platoon overseas, I was the only one with IPSC or any pistol skills. Most never carried, some were just once a blue moon on the range, some never even shot a pistol. But they were handing them out like candy.
Fact: in Afghanistan, most people issued a bhp didnt know how to use it, strip&clean it, let alone shoot it and got it issued so they didnt have to carry a "heavy rifle" when shopping around on the boardwalk complaining about timmies not having their favorite donut this morning.
Fact: in Afghanistan, most people issued a bhp didnt know how to use it, strip&clean it, let alone shoot it and got it issued so they didnt have to carry a "heavy rifle" when shopping around on the boardwalk complaining about timmies not having their favorite donut this morning.
I still have flashbacks of the day Timmies ran out of coffee...
Remember the number of NDs that Glock users in PDs had when the Glocks first came on line? The same thing will happen if we adopt the Glock. Training, training, training ..... Nothing is fool proof in the hands of a fool.
Like it has been said, go to an IPSC match and watch the CZ Shadow users lower the hammers on their loaded chambers. Can't do that safely?, maybe you should not be packing a pistol.
In IDPA, my wife has opted to go "cocked & locked" with hers as it carries on what she was used to with her 1911s. Again, muscle memory through training.
Like it has been said, go to an IPSC match and watch the CZ Shadow users lower the hammers on their loaded chambers. Can't do that safely?, maybe you should not be packing a pistol.
In IDPA, my wife has opted to go "cocked & locked" with hers as it carries on what she was used to with her 1911s. Again, muscle memory through training.
