First Dealings With Tikka T3......Very Unimpressed

Eagleye said:
You know, Douglas has probably forgotten more than you will ever know about firearms and reloading, so I would be cautious about such Comments. Eagleye.
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Thanks for the support Dave.........I know I come off as arrogant sometimes........I can live with being called arrogant, I am sometimes.........no excuses, I just am. I have done a lot in my life I am proud of, and if sharing some of it here makes me arrogant, then so be it...........I'm an arrogant SOB. It doesn't diminish what I know and what I have learned. I have posted pictures of my gun collection, my loading room and my trophy room, so although I may be somewhat arrogant, I'm not a bull sh!tter, it's all here for all to see.............
 
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c-fbmi said:
Thanks for the support Dave.........I know I come off as arrogant sometimes........I can live with being called arrogant, I am sometimes.........no excuses, I just am. I have done a lot in my life I am proud of, and if sharing some of it here makes me arrogant, then so be it...........I'm an arrogant SOB. It doesn't diminish what I know and what I have learned. I have posted pictures of my gun collection, my loading room and my trophy room, so although I may be somewhat arrogant, I'm not a bull sh!tter, it's all here for all to see.............
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There are a very select few on this forum I will actually take reloading advice from and you are one of them. Eagleye is another. Keep on voicing your mind there are people that are willing to listen and learn from your vast knowledge base.
 
'Looky gimme a break, doing floors in the trophy room right now. Got all the boys up and all the excess holes filled and painted and the extra lighting done and the forklift back up in the shop. Once the floors are done then I have to finish my bar and get all the life mounts in position. Wife is throwing me a Bday party next weekend and all has to be finished for this hodown.........Then maybe I can spend some time on my lathe and build a Penguin and a Lynx and a Hyrax and a 416 WSM and...and... and...and...
Gonna try my hand at checkering this winter too. I bought all the tools several years ago........AGAIN....... and I think I want to try it again, I have more patience now, it might work out better. I threw the last set I had in the garbage one night, many years ago..............it's a long story.
Hey you need to get your ass down here and visit me too.............I could put you to work for a few days around here easy.


ps......thanks for the words of support........I'm glad some on this site value my opinions and experience............You too HTH..........thanks much !!!!
 
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HTH. Thank you for the kind words! I love to share, and, in the process, I often learn a new tidbit.
But reloading for 50 years will get one a bit opinionated, and if he has been paying attention, he has
also accumulated a bookful of knowledge that can be valuable to others. Dave
 
BCBRAD said:
All of what I have posted does not negate years of practical experience........the practical experience goes hand in hand with what I describe, can not figure why an experienced handloader/shooter wouldn't be all over this {/quote}

I'm a relative neophyte here, as I've only been handloading for 25 years, including some experimentation outside the realms of dumping powder in a case and seating a bullet :)

Like everyone, else, I worked up loads, tweaked them, tried different powders, bullets, played with brass etc. Once I learned a bit of a "system" most rifles took a short time to work up good loads and then a bit of tweaking to make them really good. Some rifles were more stubborn, of course. But event he stubborn ones eventually would shoot with at least one combination (although my personal belief is that a good rifle should shoot reasonably well with any reasonable load but thats another story) :)

Then along comes Quickload and after a few measurements and calculations for case capacity, COAL etc, I try their suggested loads on 2 rifles (one that was stubborn and one that I hadn't loaded for before) and bingo. I was actually shocked how accurate it was.

Don't get me wrong- I like handloading, I like experimentation. I understand "old school" I've posted dozens of threads her on CGN over the years on experiments, penetration tests, subsonic loads, etc.

But ultimately, I like shooting more that experimenting with loads, and if something can help me get onto a good (great) load with minimal dicking around, I will use it. Technology is an interesting thing, and often viewed with suspicion. I don't just mean computer technology. Heck, some Generals didn't want to replace bolt actions with semi's because they thought the soldiers would use too much ammo! :)

I don't jump at every tech advance, much of it is meaningless to me. I had one of the first "white brick" cellphones because I needed it, but having the newest Itelephpone isn't important to me, and I have a Itelephone 5s which will see me though until the Number 8 comes out. I use technology that works for me, and Quickload is something that works damn good.
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now you invite me.
gartzs two days tew meself.
wifie packed her chit and moved out fur a kupple days.
thing 2 and'er tree dawgs izz fruck'in awff fur a kupple days to.
jest us tree'ear now.
me, meself and eye.

gartzs set oh 45-70 dies, holder, lee c/l/g and sum knew brass.
awl i need is sum lead and a fruck'in tracking numero.

maybe gonna take the africkan kritter owt and bern sum fewl.

typical folk........git an invite ahfter thuh pawwwrty.
 
Gentlemen.......as far as technology goes, I'm all in favor of it if you like it and want to use it, I'm not knocking technology as such. In my trades there has been technological advancements that speed things up and make things more reliable and I embrace these advances. In building and racing cars there has been huge technological advancements in computerized fuel and ignition management systems and I embrace these in this hobby of mine as well. So I'm not anti technology per say, but I just have no need to speed up my load development process, I enjoy the way I do it, I'm fairly certain that my success rate is as good as a computer can advise me. I'm not trying to make a living at it, or I'm sure I would take advantage of the potential time savings the computer may offer and I'm sure the ammo manufacturers do.
You younger fellas with great computer skills are lucky, but in my opinion a little too dependent on technology sometimes. I'm quite happy to plod along with my loading procedures that have worked for me for 45 years now.........and I enjoy this part of the hobby, I'm not looking to speed it up or eliminate 2/3 of the process by having a computer do it for me.
I think the biggest difference, as applied to loading is that unlike car racing the computer doesn't make the loads any more efficient, it doesn't make the bullets go faster, it doesn't change the burn rate of powders to make them better suited to a cartridge.........all it does is tell you which loads may be best for a given combination and a few other details.......it doesn't make the rifle and cartridge perform better. It may help you get to a good performing load quicker, but it won't make it perform any better.
I'm also sure it is a great tool in the development of loading manuals and speeds this process up 100 times, but I'm not in that business either so it holds no advantages for me.
Anyway I'm sure some of you computer whizzes out there won't understand but I enjoy load development and what I learn by doing it the old way. I'm not interested in having a computer skip through this part of it and tell me what the "probability model" says will be the best load combination for this bullet and case. I don't shoot competitively any more and I have endless time now (sort of) so jumping right to the potential best load is of no value to me..........hell it would just cut down the amount of shooting I get to do....:d:d
 
Gatehouse said:
BCBRAD said:
All of what I have posted does not negate years of practical experience........the practical experience goes hand in hand with what I describe, can not figure why an experienced handloader/shooter wouldn't be all over this {/quote}

I'm a relative neophyte here, as I've only been handloading for 25 years, including some experimentation outside the realms of dumping powder in a case and seating a bullet :)

Like everyone, else, I worked up loads, tweaked them, tried different powders, bullets, played with brass etc. Once I learned a bit of a "system" most rifles took a short time to work up good loads and then a bit of tweaking to make them really good. Some rifles were more stubborn, of course. But event he stubborn ones eventually would shoot with at least one combination (although my personal belief is that a good rifle should shoot reasonably well with any reasonable load but thats another story) :)

Then along comes Quickload and after a few measurements and calculations for case capacity, COAL etc, I try their suggested loads on 2 rifles (one that was stubborn and one that I hadn't loaded for before) and bingo. I was actually shocked how accurate it was.

Don't get me wrong- I like handloading, I like experimentation. I understand "old school" I've posted dozens of threads her on CGN over the years on experiments, penetration tests, subsonic loads, etc.

But ultimately, I like shooting more that experimenting with loads, and if something can help me get onto a good (great) load with minimal dicking around, I will use it. Technology is an interesting thing, and often viewed with suspicion. I don't just mean computer technology. Heck, some Generals didn't want to replace bolt actions with semi's because they thought the soldiers would use too much ammo! :)

I don't jump at every tech advance, much of it is meaningless to me. I had one of the first "white brick" cellphones because I needed it, but having the newest Itelephpone isn't important to me, and I have a Itelephone 5s which will see me though until the Number 8 comes out. I use technology that works for me, and Quickload is something that works damn good.
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Mr Gate you wax eloquent. A friend got me on to this, as I already had QL but really stumbled along with what to do with it, after we discussed, it was deemed that velocity had to reflect reality consistently and about the same time TodBartell was procuring the LabRadar chronograph so was lucky enough to get the 2nd one that showed up. These are valuable tools, another is to study rifle/barrel vibrations, barrel times and anything I could get my hands on. Another benefit was to print off the QL manual so I could real-time reference in problems/misunderstandings I was having, spent most of last winter on the subject.
Anyway, I'm at a point now that I do not endlessly chase loads in search of 'magic'. I do spend a lot of time modelling different cartridges and component combinations, find it interesting.
A new handloader may find this difficult, but one with years of experience will fall right into it.
I tend to think outside the box as much as in, and consider the above the next step in handloading for me.

This site and others provide lots of useful information and experiences.

I've met and shot with Eagleye/ Dave on occasion and he is a true rifleman and a wealth of knowledge, nice guy too.

I'll sit back now and wait for that Tikka to shoot . :)
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BCBRAD said:
Gatehouse said:
Mr Gate you wax eloquent. A friend got me on to this, as I already had QL but really stumbled along with what to do with it, after we discussed, it was deemed that velocity had to reflect reality consistently and about the same time TodBartell was procuring the LabRadar chronograph so was lucky enough to get the 2nd one that showed up. These are valuable tools, another is to study rifle/barrel vibrations, barrel times and anything I could get my hands on. Another benefit was to print off the QL manual so I could real-time reference in problems/misunderstandings I was having, spent most of last winter on the subject.
Anyway, I'm at a point now that I do not endlessly chase loads in search of 'magic'. I do spend a lot of time modelling different cartridges and component combinations, find it interesting.
A new handloader may find this difficult, but one with years of experience will fall right into it.
I tend to think outside the box as much as in, and consider the above the next step in handloading for me.

This site and others provide lots of useful information and experiences.

I've met and shot with Eagleye/ Dave on occasion and he is a true rifleman and a wealth of knowledge, nice guy too.

I'll sit back now and wait for that Tikka to shoot . :)
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I'm going to invest in a Labradar too. It's amazing how well QL and the Labradar work together. More often than not, QL will predict velocity within a few FPS of measured velocity. I often load at the range, too. So between QL, Labradar and the ability to make adjustments in loads as I shoot, I think it will be a great combination to find the right load in short order.

They are both remarkable tools for the toolbox. They also don't prevent you from experimenting on your own, either. :)
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Doug, any updates on working toward accuracy with this rifle? I'm curious if this tikka infact wont shoot well, and if so how tikka handles warranty on it. If the owner chooses that route. Thankyou.
 
As I was told by the warranty centre, with my T3's that didn't shoot MOA, I quote "If you use reloads the accuracy guarantee is void". They simply sent my rifles back without doing a thing to them.
I read on tikkashooters that the boys down under don't sell Tikkas without changing recoil lug and bedding.
 
I reload for a friends Tikka T3 in 300 wsm, and it has the same issue with the short mag, I couldn't get decent accuracy except for one load with a cheap Hornady Interlock!

Not sure why some people have issues with buying modern Savage rifles, I own two Savage 16 rifles in 300 wsm and 300 Savage,
both are deadly accurate with every load I loaded for them,they function perfectly, and with the newer Accustock, feel just as well made and as solid as any other stainless/synthetic rifle I've looked at (the older pre-Accustock Savage 16's weren't as good)

I'd take my Savage 16 over a Tikka any day.

I know the Axis is a cheap rifle, but even those are supposed to be very accurate out of the box.

Some people just like to spend money for bragging rights,
I've handled and fired Sako's as well other "high end" guns that didn't impress me at all,
not sure why people buy them really, unless it's a rare, vintage, or limited edition collectors item.

I currently own well over 20 rifles (vintage, rare, and modern) but those two Savage 16's are probably the most accurate of the bunch.
 
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Nothing new..........the snow came, the temp plummeted and shooting came to a screeching halt. Spending my time welding up an 8' snow plow blade for my tractor right now. Buddy with Tikka is in Mexico so likely won't be any new developments for a couple months.
 
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