Homestead range

r_taylor said:
And there is the most retarded statement this week folks.
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Is it? I sure wish it was...

Let's look at the similarities between the two:
- both the APRA and the CGC support the alienation of restricted firearms owners (APRA by the abolishment of a core discipline within the provincial body).
- both groups actively try to discourage firearm ownership amongst the general population (the APRA by turning away people seeking membership and making such nonsensical rules for access, that people simply don't want to join).
- both groups support the persecution of firearms owners (APRA members are seriously going to call the police on a member of the public that has climbed the fence to see the range? Are you serious?)
- both groups are filled with delusional people who have considerable ego issues whereby they think they are better than everyone else and they believe they can't possibly be wrong or mistaken.
- both groups have a selfish 'my way or the highway' attitude toward the shooting sports and firearms ownership in general.
 
toomanyhobbies said:
Craig, while I feel your frustration, a rant like this isn't going to make you any friends.

If you sneak onto one of the club's private ranges and are shooting there, you are trespassing. Do you even know if there are other people perhaps working down in the butts? That behaviour will get the cops called, it's irresponsible and unsafe. On the other hand, if you come in politely and ask to learn about the club / range, or come out to a visitor's day event, you will be welcomed. Don't expect to be allowed to shoot your own guns on the range at this point. I know it's not optimal but you have to start somewhere. Clubs usually vet new members because there are too many idiots who will wreck things if left unsupervised. Prove yourself responsible and you'll be golden.
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So what is the point of a visitors day event if I can't visit and shoot my guns? Not trying to be a d!ck just asking. Doesn't sounds like people out there are really into "sharing".
 
r_taylor said:
I don't think it is. I believe it is one of the many "ad-hoc" shooting areas that some people feel they are entitled to use.
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Speaking of entitlement? There is a bit of irony.
The APRA enjoys a lease of over 300 acres of public land for around $2000 a year, turns away likely hundreds of shooters a year and then you complain that the very same people you turn away legally shoot on adjacent public land?

Granted, leaving a mess is a boneheaded thing to do, but the APRA have proved to produce some of the biggest bunch of winers going.
 
beltfed said:
Is it? I sure wish it was...

Let's look at the similarities between the two:
- both the APRA and the CGC support the alienation of restricted firearms owners (APRA by the abolishment of a core discipline within the provincial body).
- both groups actively try to discourage firearm ownership amongst the general population (the APRA by turning away people seeking membership and making such nonsensical rules for access, that people simply don't want to join).
- both groups support the persecution of firearms owners (APRA members are seriously going to call the police on a member of the public that has climbed the fence to see the range? Are you serious?)
- both groups are filled with delusional people who have considerable ego issues whereby they think they are better than everyone else and they believe they can't possibly be wrong or mistaken.
- both groups have a selfish 'my way or the highway' attitude toward the shooting sports and firearms ownership in general.
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Wow, I thought I had heard everything. This certianly takes the cake for delusional ramblings. Comparing any pro-firearms organization to CGC is complete lunacy. Apparently you had a bad experience. But there are many, many others who regularly have a good experience at the complex.
 
I have never heard so much crying and #####ing from people because they cannot shoot here or there.

I compete at the BR matches at Rosebud on a yearly basis. That place is set up for SR BR and silhouette. Nothing more. It is a gem of a place to compete at. In my opinion if memberships were not capped that place would end up like a hole like the public range. I have never seen or heard so much belly aching or trash like I have seen at the public range.

Everybody wants to shoot the crap out of everything and not police themselves.

I can tell you one thing, crap like this would not be tolerated at any of the US ranges I have shot at. Many have orientation sessions before you are even allowed a membership. You screw up, you are done.

There is no mentality like i read here. I have a PAL, own a restricted, so It is my given right to shoot at any and all ranges. OMG.

My belly aching rant for today.
 
I think the likely problem here is the old "one bad apple" situation. Those clubs there are so amongst the #### storm that is homestead that I can't say I blame them for for being gun shy, no pun intended. It's nice to have a clean,organized, SAFE place to shoot and when you get to become a member of a place like that of course you want to protect it. I have been all over that 300 acres and the whole complex is littered with garbage with exception of the clubs mentioned. Those bad apples are why people have such a hard time gaining access to those clubs. I believe rosebud requires referral by a member of good standing for two years now, BTSA I found was reasonably easy to join but, in order to get a key you need your card signed off three times by a member who would vouch that you were reasonable on your three visits. Anyone who is shooting off those ranges in the garbage strewn clear cuts could be subject to a $1000 dollar fine. That comes from a CO who I was speaking to on the weekend while out there adventuring with the pooches shooting some clays trying to get the new guy used to the sound of a shotgun. He was a decent enough fellow but seen me pulling out of the woods in my truck and turned on his lights. He let me off with a verbal warning and said that whole area is off limits except for the maintained gravel roads. His reasoning was the demonstration forest and public day use areas adjacent to the APRA lease. There is even signs going up there, this fella is nervous even driving down the road because dummies shoot up all the road signs.
 
Oh and yes I picked up my empty shells and my missed clays, as embarrassing as it is to admit I missed something with 12.ga target loads.
 
I think the larger issue is the complete lack of sufficient ranges in the region.

Let people play in their own ponds if they want too but there are far more shooters than ranges which add to the conflict and causes people to "do their own thing" which generates even more unwanted attention.

There needs to be more ranges taking members and with decent annual fees that allows new shooters to continue the sport.
 
0neshot said:
I think the likely problem here is the old "one bad apple" situation. Those clubs there are so amongst the #### storm that is homestead that I can't say I blame them for for being gun shy, no pun intended. It's nice to have a clean,organized, SAFE place to shoot and when you get to become a member of a place like that of course you want to protect it. I have been all over that 300 acres and the whole complex is littered with garbage with exception of the clubs mentioned. Those bad apples are why people have such a hard time gaining access to those clubs. I believe rosebud requires referral by a member of good standing for two years now, BTSA I found was reasonably easy to join but, in order to get a key you need your card signed off three times by a member who would vouch that you were reasonable on your three visits. Anyone who is shooting off those ranges in the garbage strewn clear cuts could be subject to a $1000 dollar fine. That comes from a CO who I was speaking to on the weekend while out there adventuring with the pooches shooting some clays trying to get the new guy used to the sound of a shotgun. He was a decent enough fellow but seen me pulling out of the woods in my truck and turned on his lights. He let me off with a verbal warning and said that whole area is off limits except for the maintained gravel roads. His reasoning was the demonstration forest and public day use areas adjacent to the APRA lease. There is even signs going up there, this fella is nervous even driving down the road because dummies shoot up all the road signs.
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Well said. The Swiss Rifle Club Tell has a similar vetting process for new members for the same reasons. I can guarantee members are in no way "elitist" and all applications for membership are reviewed by the club executive. In fact, we welcome persons with an interest in SVV/Swiss military rifle and pistol shooting to contact us for info.
 
r_taylor said:
Wow, I thought I had heard everything. This certianly takes the cake for delusional ramblings. Comparing any pro-firearms organization to CGC is complete lunacy. Apparently you had a bad experience. But there are many, many others who regularly have a good experience at the complex.
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It would be if it were not true.
The bottom line is the APRA turns away more people from the sport and the organization than it brings in.
It isn't just me, ask your fellow shooters outside of the organization and the feeling is one of general negativity.


cycbb486 said:
I compete at the BR matches at Rosebud on a yearly basis. That place is set up for SR BR and silhouette. Nothing more.
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Actually, that isn't true.
Rosebud was set up and intended from the outset as a 'generalist' shooting range. A place for the membership and public to go and shoot in a safe, organized, clean and comfortable manner.
The 'splintering' and specialization came after.
This was the same vision that was intended for the new ranges that the BTSA has claimed as their 'own' - they were built for all members of the APRA, not the select few within the BTSA only.
The idea was to expand and allow for a higher cap on membership and general shooting in addition to more competitions.



cycbb486 said:
I can tell you one thing, crap like this would not be tolerated at any of the US ranges I have shot at. Many have orientation sessions before you are even allowed a membership. You screw up, you are done.

There is no mentality like i read here. I have a PAL, own a restricted, so It is my given right to shoot at any and all ranges. OMG.
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No one is advocating for the people shooting up and leaving garbage in their wake.
Opening up the range to membership who sit in on an orientation and given the rules and riot act is pretty normal fair, as are punishments up to and including revocation of membership in the event of non-compliance with those rules.

But, when a club turns away shooters for nothing more than the rifle they use to shoot with (range caliber templating notwithstanding), their actions become discriminatory. Vetting shooters over the course of three events could also be construed as a form of discrimination.
 
beltfed said:
It would be if it were not true.
The bottom line is the APRA turns away more people from the sport and the organization than it brings in.
It isn't just me, ask your fellow shooters outside of the organization and the feeling is one of general negativity.




Actually, that isn't true.
Rosebud was set up and intended from the outset as a 'generalist' shooting range. A place for the membership and public to go and shoot in a safe, organized, clean and comfortable manner.
The 'splintering' and specialization came after.
This was the same vision that was intended for the new ranges that the BTSA has claimed as their 'own' - they were built for all members of the APRA, not the select few within the BTSA only.
The idea was to expand and allow for a higher cap on membership and general shooting in addition to more competitions.





No one is advocating for the people shooting up and leaving garbage in their wake.
Opening up the range to membership who sit in on an orientation and given the rules and riot act is pretty normal fair, as are punishments up to and including revocation of membership in the event of non-compliance with those rules.

But, when a club turns away shooters for nothing more than the rifle they use to shoot with (range caliber templating notwithstanding), their actions become discriminatory. Vetting shooters over the course of three events could also be construed as a form of discrimination.
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The sign on the gate pretty much explains it for me , Rosebud Benchrest and silhouette , the range and the members are great, the range will continue to improve due to the hard work of the volunteers that make this club great, hope things improve for you
 
Have to say my experience with APRA pretty much mirrors beltfed. Group of holier than thou FUDDS who IMHO would prefer the unwashed masses be unarmed and playing golf rather than being able to pay reasonable annual range fee, get a key and shoot their restricted a few times a year in peace.
 
BeltFed (MJ), not sure where the impression comes from that Rosebud was to be set up as a GENERALIST range. I spent some time and talked to a few of the OLD guys who were avid BR shooters at Namaka and Rosebud BEFORE it was moved from the vicinity of the community of Rosebud to its current APRA lease location. I can call more but I ahve a good idea I will hear the same thing.

What I was told is that the range was set up by competition shooters when it was located near the vicinity of the community east of Calgary. It was never considered a plinking club. It was then moved by the competition shooters in the mid 80's to its current location under the APRA lease. The club will continue to be a Bench Rest and Silhouette Club. There are no intentions for it to be a plinking club where all can come and shoot.

That is what I can pass on. I am just passing on what I was told. These guys have been shooting a long time. I shoot with them every year so I will take there word.

I am not one to argue about this as I am in MB. What I do know, it is one of the best SHORT RANGE BENCHREST facilities in Western Canada. The rimfire and centerfire silhouette range is pretty nice as well.

It is unfortunate that there are a lack of facilities for those of you who want to run and gun. What I see as a common issue is those people from the citites who want a place to shoot. They want restricted firearms where they can only be shot at ranges. Unfortunately there are not enough of them but maybe there is a reason for the lack of.

I am fortunate that I do not have that issue. I go to the family farm and can shoot from point blank to about 1200 yards. The only mess I have to deal with is my own.

I hear the term "FUDDS" all the time. The final thing I can say, you never here those of us who are not interested in restricted firearms COMPLAIN about the ranges we frequent or bash the restricted guys. The restricted guys belittle those of us who want a nice, clean, quiet place to shoot and compete at. Letting the restricted guys shoot at a nice clean facility, it would not be nice and clean for long.

Time to plan a cleanup for my so called NICE,Clean shooting facility that the shotgunners and restricted guys continue to make a mess of and NOT clean up after themselves.

My take on this.
 
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I'm pretty close to homestead. But I might end up joining that one. This thread hasn't really left me with any desire to join a range at homestead.


Any testimonials on the Shepard range? Yay/nay? Pros/cons?

I'm 70 km from Shepard range. So it has to be pretty good
 
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The Shepard range is good but, it's being encroached on by the city and might not be there in a few years. The club has built what is being described as a "world class facility" near lake mcgreggor. That will make your total trip somewhere in the 200km range though.
 
cycbb486 said:
BeltFed (MJ), not sure where the impression comes from that Rosebud was to be set up as a GENERALIST range.

My take on this.
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That notion came from a long time Fullbore shooter who was part of the build at the time (HR) - I wasn't around then, so I'm only going on the oral history.

What I can say for certain is that I have shot on the Rosebud side of things on a weekend and weekday when there were no competitions and everyone who was shooting seemed reasonable and friendly. Guys were shooting a mix of firearms with one benchrester shooting a Garand. The percentage of members of Rosebuds' hundreds of members who shoot benchrest or silhouette is quite likely very small, and the percentage of competitors who only shoot their firearms involved in competition is likely even smaller still.
The point is that not every weekend is spent competing, and shooters generally tend to use a mixture of firearms.

The more range groups specialize and disclude other shooters and shooter groups, the more we will see a negative impact on the shooting sports overall - that is my take.
 
Well I have done what I can do. Alberta (or anywhere) residents who are interested in shooting can come to BC and for a $35 fee get a limited competitive membership and compete in our matches. The fact remains that the APRA as the PRA in Alberta holds the keys to limited but zero cost use of the military ranges in Wainwright and Edmonton (these ranges are certified up to prohib). They just don't play well with the military, or military shooters.
 
Gunnerlove said:
The fact remains that the APRA as the PRA in Alberta holds the keys to limited but zero cost use of the military ranges in Wainwright and Edmonton (these ranges are certified up to prohib). They just don't play well with the military, or military shooters.
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This is NOT fact. You are absolutely incorrect. The APRA holds no keys. The facts are that the APRA ceased to be involved with the DCRA about 5 years ago. APRA is not the designated PRA for Alberta. As I have explained every year about this time, the APRA is merely the leaseholder with K Country. The APRA does not hold matches!

Just because no other entity in Alberta will step forward and start a new affiliate with the DCRA is not the APRA's problem. For reference, access to military ranges is not on anyone's radar at the APRA.

There is nothing stopping anyone from starting a new Alberta affiliate with the DCRA and taking their shoots to the military ranges.... except nobody involved with those disciplines seems interested in doing the legwork, so yet another season will drift by for those shooters. This annual blaming of the APRA is almost comical, if it wasn't so pathetic and ill informed. I predicted it for 2015, I will predict it again for 2016. I imagine at this rate you guys will still be blaming everyone else in 10 years, not just the 5 years that you have under your belt now.
 
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