I just joined in late last year so was not able to vote at the agm. But if they vote it down again, the old guard will need to go.
IDPA-POCO-Members [UPDATED-PROPOSAL TURNED DOWN FOR 3RD YEAR IN A ROW. SEE POST#285]
- Thread starter OEM
- Start date
I just joined in late last year so was not able to vote at the agm. But if they vote it down again, the old guard will need to go.
Poco is a shooting club and should be run by shooters. If the current club exec are ignorant of CGN that is an indication of their lack of interest in the sport in Canada or just being too outdated.
Tomochan you are right, a very good example is Slavex. He is totally committed and shoots very well. Look at how well Abby is operating. Unfortunately he is not a member at Poco. We need someone like him to step up and go with it may be you are the right candidate.
Tomochan you are right, a very good example is Slavex. He is totally committed and shoots very well. Look at how well Abby is operating. Unfortunately he is not a member at Poco. We need someone like him to step up and go with it may be you are the right candidate.
Be warned, being this committed is a good way to get committed. Its mentally very tiring.
The exec at any club are often very reluctant to change. Also a lot of exec are like your strata council, full of people that like power, no matter where they can get it. I hope I can say that my BOD at Abby are not like that though. It takes members showing up and voting, and also getting on the boards. Some clubs it takes years of work to accomplish that simply due to the procedures set in place to get into director positions.
Good luck at Poco guys.
The exec at any club are often very reluctant to change. Also a lot of exec are like your strata council, full of people that like power, no matter where they can get it. I hope I can say that my BOD at Abby are not like that though. It takes members showing up and voting, and also getting on the boards. Some clubs it takes years of work to accomplish that simply due to the procedures set in place to get into director positions.
Good luck at Poco guys.
easyrider604
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Greater Vancouver, BC
Thank you for your well wishes, Slavex.
I am confident that Rottboy, who has been working on/with the POCO BOD three years running, will get the job done sooner than later.
The chances are even better now with the support of the many who voted YES. Rottboy has the skills to sell IDPA to the BOD. All we got to do is rally behind him.
I am confident that Rottboy, who has been working on/with the POCO BOD three years running, will get the job done sooner than later.
The chances are even better now with the support of the many who voted YES. Rottboy has the skills to sell IDPA to the BOD. All we got to do is rally behind him.
Its been two weeks since Rottboy's last presentation. Wonder how long it will take the BOD to come up with an. Answer.
Rottboy told me his presentation including Q and A took 15 minutes.
Still keeping my fingers crossed. Tomorrow Rottboy and I will be making that long drive again for our IDPA fix. LOL
Rottboy told me his presentation including Q and A took 15 minutes.
Still keeping my fingers crossed. Tomorrow Rottboy and I will be making that long drive again for our IDPA fix. LOL
That would be a backstop issue - They are not rated for rifle rounds on the lower ranges, is my understanding.
IPSC WAS as IDPA is, then it got GAMEY & expensive. A lot of this expense at POCO was due to particular people as was the 'Black Badge',etc.,etc.. to the point where I COULDN'T AFFORD to re-join POCO after 20 year membership. Upon getting 'back on my feet', I'm told I have to take all these "courses" and PAY for things I know better than most & longer. However, IF IDPA got into POCO, I guess I'd have to "Bite the Bullet" & pay these B.S. 'fees' to 'particular people' just to shoot at my old club.
Those BS fees are for membership in IDPA and match fees cover the cost of targets, for the maintenance and building of new props and to help cover the cost of maintaining the Club's ranges. Not sure who the "particular people" are but if you have passed the Black Badge in the past you are good to go in IDPA.
Take Care
Bob
Drew, you got it from the horse's mouth. If you ever got a BB in the past you are good to go as far as IDPA is concerned. Can't get away from IDPA fees and Poco membership fees. Then there may be a minimum of 5 bucks to shoot a match which covers targets. Other than that, can't think of any other fees that you would have to pay for. Unless Poco would impose other fees.
Canuck44 & Hugodog, I wasn't referring to IDPA fees, I was talking about POCO fees, "Range Familiarization", "Holster Qualification", as B.S. As a 20 + year member of Burke, WAY before and during present 'hierarchy', I'm pretty 'familiar' with range ! As to BB & 'holster qualification', I've been doing this stuff since 1978 and was a Can. and Northwest (incl. U.S.) 'B' class Champion, repeatedly in Open AND concealed carry.
I put on some of the biggest, smoothest, most rewarding to the participants (prize tables !), enjoyable matches EVER seen in the NW, both 'concealed' and not,YEARS before BB was even invented and shot for DECADES without it.
I was relaxing in a hot tub with Bill Wilson and #### Heine in Moline, Ill. at the U.S. I.P.S.C. Nationals (think it was '84, lost the t-shirt!) when Bill was 'bemoaning' the direction IPSC was going, after John Shaw intro'd the first comp. and S&W's Tommy Campbell had brought out the 'Spring Open Jacket' for concealed stages to access his Mod.59 in a 'chest holster' to IPSC, away from Cooper's original hopes. I told Bill what WE in Canada were doing with 'Lem's Tac. Matches', my 'FlashMatch', etc. and his eyes got REAL big and he got very excited, much to the amusement of Richard and myself, wondering if that could be 'expanded' Nationally.
Few years (decades!) go by, and 'lo and behold IDPA ! First thought I had was 'Wilson, you S.O.B., you WERE listening, and you DID it ! Good for you.' THEN I thought, 'Hey, wait a minute......'
So I have NO problem with IDPA, to quote Keith, "Hell, I was THERE !" at IDPA's 'seminal' moment. Believe it or not, I really don't care. I CAN tell you that Wilson's swim-trunks were blue with a white stripe and Richard Heine's kind of an orangy colour ! THAT's where IDPA STARTED, Moline, Illinois.
As to 'Holster Qualified', my 'freebie' Davis rig, presented to me personally by Gordon Wm.Davis, or Uncle Gordie, as my daughter calls him, may not be 'state-of-the-art' anymore, but then neither am I, and yes, I have a perfectly suitable 'pancake' , slide, revolver and whatever other retention devices required for IDPA or anything else 'cept BP or Cowboy (been there, done that, didn't like it ) !
I was one of the first 3 IPSC C.R.O.'s, taught MANY courses, classes (incl. E.R.T.or 'SWAT' ), and shooters and have done more in this sport in all it's various forms than you could believe, but getting older, slower, breaking my hip and back and one too many divorces has kind of 'takin' me out' of contention, to say nothing of lawyers fees ! With over 200 trophies for every 'practical' type of shooting you can imagine, IPSC, Cowboy Action, pre-IDPA 'Concealed', Bowling Pin, 3-gun, etc., etc., I REALLY don't need anymore, nor do I know what a 'Black Badge' IS, you think I need one, or would 33 YEARS of experience suffice ? I got the pictures and videos too !
I may have misworded (?) myself, but I can't see how, and for this I apologise; IPSC got "gamey & expensive".
POCO's CHARGING for 'Range Familiarisation and Holster Qualification
courses for long time, familiar, returning members is BS.
"Particular People", AT POCO, have been 'nickle and dime-ing' us to
death for YEARS for their own gain, if you ONLY knew.........
So, Bob and Dog, does that 'clarify' my position for you ? I applaud your 'defence' of IDPA and sorry for any confusion I caused in my wording. I WAS an IDPA member last year, but never got to shoot a match ( Chilliwack IS a ways) I AM a newbie on CGN, but FAR from it in 'Gun Games' !
"Fast is Fine, Accuracy is Final." W.Earp,
Best, Drew
I put on some of the biggest, smoothest, most rewarding to the participants (prize tables !), enjoyable matches EVER seen in the NW, both 'concealed' and not,YEARS before BB was even invented and shot for DECADES without it.
I was relaxing in a hot tub with Bill Wilson and #### Heine in Moline, Ill. at the U.S. I.P.S.C. Nationals (think it was '84, lost the t-shirt!) when Bill was 'bemoaning' the direction IPSC was going, after John Shaw intro'd the first comp. and S&W's Tommy Campbell had brought out the 'Spring Open Jacket' for concealed stages to access his Mod.59 in a 'chest holster' to IPSC, away from Cooper's original hopes. I told Bill what WE in Canada were doing with 'Lem's Tac. Matches', my 'FlashMatch', etc. and his eyes got REAL big and he got very excited, much to the amusement of Richard and myself, wondering if that could be 'expanded' Nationally.
Few years (decades!) go by, and 'lo and behold IDPA ! First thought I had was 'Wilson, you S.O.B., you WERE listening, and you DID it ! Good for you.' THEN I thought, 'Hey, wait a minute......'
So I have NO problem with IDPA, to quote Keith, "Hell, I was THERE !" at IDPA's 'seminal' moment. Believe it or not, I really don't care. I CAN tell you that Wilson's swim-trunks were blue with a white stripe and Richard Heine's kind of an orangy colour ! THAT's where IDPA STARTED, Moline, Illinois.
As to 'Holster Qualified', my 'freebie' Davis rig, presented to me personally by Gordon Wm.Davis, or Uncle Gordie, as my daughter calls him, may not be 'state-of-the-art' anymore, but then neither am I, and yes, I have a perfectly suitable 'pancake' , slide, revolver and whatever other retention devices required for IDPA or anything else 'cept BP or Cowboy (been there, done that, didn't like it ) !
I was one of the first 3 IPSC C.R.O.'s, taught MANY courses, classes (incl. E.R.T.or 'SWAT' ), and shooters and have done more in this sport in all it's various forms than you could believe, but getting older, slower, breaking my hip and back and one too many divorces has kind of 'takin' me out' of contention, to say nothing of lawyers fees ! With over 200 trophies for every 'practical' type of shooting you can imagine, IPSC, Cowboy Action, pre-IDPA 'Concealed', Bowling Pin, 3-gun, etc., etc., I REALLY don't need anymore, nor do I know what a 'Black Badge' IS, you think I need one, or would 33 YEARS of experience suffice ? I got the pictures and videos too !
I may have misworded (?) myself, but I can't see how, and for this I apologise; IPSC got "gamey & expensive".
POCO's CHARGING for 'Range Familiarisation and Holster Qualification
courses for long time, familiar, returning members is BS.
"Particular People", AT POCO, have been 'nickle and dime-ing' us to
death for YEARS for their own gain, if you ONLY knew.........
So, Bob and Dog, does that 'clarify' my position for you ? I applaud your 'defence' of IDPA and sorry for any confusion I caused in my wording. I WAS an IDPA member last year, but never got to shoot a match ( Chilliwack IS a ways) I AM a newbie on CGN, but FAR from it in 'Gun Games' !
"Fast is Fine, Accuracy is Final." W.Earp,
Best, Drew
easyrider604
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Greater Vancouver, BC
For the WIN!
That is why I am totally against taking the Black Badge Course, because of the principle involved. I shot IPSC in a past life, didn't shoot myself or anybody else, never DNF'd or DQ'd, I was taught but never had to pay anybody to teach me....for our training, we brought our own cardboard targets and ammo, we were allowed to use the clubs steel plates and poppers and what not.
I am no politician and I would leave the club politics to other more qualified people. I just want to call things the way I see them. I say the system in place at the POCO club, as far as the requirements for BB and IPSC, simply stinks!
I hope these "Particular People" get a regular job to support themselves. I am sure there are also qualified instructors out there, who are more than willing to share their time and talents towards the benefit of the sport, not their pockets.
That is why I am totally against taking the Black Badge Course, because of the principle involved. I shot IPSC in a past life, didn't shoot myself or anybody else, never DNF'd or DQ'd, I was taught but never had to pay anybody to teach me....for our training, we brought our own cardboard targets and ammo, we were allowed to use the clubs steel plates and poppers and what not.
I am no politician and I would leave the club politics to other more qualified people. I just want to call things the way I see them. I say the system in place at the POCO club, as far as the requirements for BB and IPSC, simply stinks!
I hope these "Particular People" get a regular job to support themselves. I am sure there are also qualified instructors out there, who are more than willing to share their time and talents towards the benefit of the sport, not their pockets.
Thanks, Big, for the agreement. Best be careful though or you too might be labelled a
"Dissident Element" as I was, by "Particular People" and their lackey followers ! Not that I didn't deserve, love and proudly wear on an engraved name tag I bought, the title !!!!!
I know people that DID pay and take the course, but never received any BB, and were told they'd have to pay and take it again, they never DID, but are happily and competently competing in IDPA to this day, and are STRONG supporters of it !
"Dissident Element" as I was, by "Particular People" and their lackey followers ! Not that I didn't deserve, love and proudly wear on an engraved name tag I bought, the title !!!!!
I know people that DID pay and take the course, but never received any BB, and were told they'd have to pay and take it again, they never DID, but are happily and competently competing in IDPA to this day, and are STRONG supporters of it !
For two years off its write a test so we know you're familiar with the rules still. Not a big deal. All this chest thumping makes me laugh. If you were out of Stock car racing for two years you'd have to recertify, don't really see the big deal. If you start granting exceptions to people it undermines the whole thing. The BB course is cheap compared to everything else involved and is completely unrelated to the issue at hand. It also has nothing to do with the fees or courses POCO has in place.
Not driven 'on record', right?
BB course is very good to great to a new shooter, full stop/period!!!; not effing afraid to sound British here. I'm not British, it's just the language we use that came from over there...
But, big A-Hole Butt!! Some, a few, shooters shoot USPSA and IDPA in the USA on fairly regular basis (more than 3-4 times a year) and it falls well under Canadian IPSC/IDPA radar.
Here is my personal story - I live very close to the border and very close to a US range (member of). To start shooting USPSA (back 3 years ago) all I had to do was to get a 'Safety Check' -- it was FREE, did I mention FREE?. Took less than 45 minutes, and it was one-on-one test. Draw, turning, moving, safe range procedures, range commands, and other shift like dat.
I honestly think, some (few) shooters should be able to at least TRY challenging BB curse FOR FREE.
easyrider604
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Greater Vancouver, BC
Hey guys...some great suggestions all around. However, I sense this thread is being derailed into yet another IPSC thread. Remember the whole idea is to get IDPA started in Poco.
I am honestly not interested in IPSC...and I am really amazed about some of you guys with the really fantastic credentials. Good for you!
I feel for you, with your years of experience, being forced to take a whole course all over again. I dunno guys, I see it as IPSC's loss if they wanna make you old dogs jump through the same hoops, when all they need to do is a simple test like what ceezer said he did. The USPSA idea is a really good one and perhaps that should be pursued here in BC. However, I feel you should take your battle to the IPSC guys in BC. Correct me if I'm wrong, but this BB thing is not a Poco requirement, but a BC-Wide thing right?
So, let's keep the topic on course here. The debate at hand is if we should have IDPA in Poco. All you great ex-IPSC shooters are most welcome to join IDPA in Poco when it happens. IPSC's loss is IDPA's gain, at least, from the sounds of it, in Poco. Either way, you get your fix eh.
The BB is good for 1 year. If you don't shoot 1 qualifier in over 2 years, you need to redo the open book exam and compete in a level I match under the supervision of an RO or TCI. You need to go MORE THAN FOUR YEARS (in BC) before you need to redo the entire course.
A drivers license is good for 5 years. If you let your license expire and do not renew for THREE YEARS, you have to be re-tested for your license. I'm pretty sure they won't let you get away with an open book exam, nor will they let you challenge the drivers exam for free, either.
Drivers license renewals are actually more strict than IPSCBC BB requirements...
There are more than the costs for just targets and tape. You have facilities that you are using, including the toilets, running water, maintenance of grounds and clubhouse, the on site caretaker, power, insurance for non-members, the unavailability of those ranges to other members/rental groups, wear and tear on props, target stands, steel, walls and barricades...
These are just SOME of the costs that are incurred just by virtue of being on site and using the range that everybody tends to overlook. I've probably missed a bunch.
Unless you feel that your group should let everybody else foot the bill so that you can play. Personally, I wouldn't expect the club to charge less than $10 for members and $15 for non members at an absolute minimum.
Sure, clubs and organizations are charging a lot of money for their services nowadays. I'm old enough to remember a time when $15 would get you into a match, give you a chance to win a nice trophy and even get a door prize, but I also remember when primers cost $1.25 per box and you could buy a thousand bullets for $45.
I've seen 4 lower mainland clubs shut down over the last 15 years. Don't tell me that municipalities aren't looking for excuses to shut down the one nearest you. Clubs are doing their best due dilligence to make sure that some idiot who thinks he knows better doesn't f* up just once and screw things up for the rest of us, and if that means making everybody jump through the same hoops and forcing a few of us to endure the humiliation of taking a basic safety course, then so be it.
Hey guys...some great suggestions all around. However, I sense this thread is being derailed into yet another IPSC thread. Remember the whole idea is to get IDPA started in Poco.
So, let's keep the topic on course here. The debate at hand is if we should have IDPA in Poco. IPSC's loss is IDPA's gain, at least, from the sounds of it, in Poco. Either way, you get your fix eh.
There are no losses, only gains for members at Poco. The gain is another choice. If IDPA is in Poco then people will choose whatever fit their fancy.
Let's make it, "In addition to and not an instead of" issue. That way everyone can have fun.
