Incredible Stun Baton?

DOOK said:
Maybe I missed this, but when they showed up to seize the baton, did they have a warrant?
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No, he caught me off guard when I was at work . He did an amazing job at making me feel that he was doing me a favour. I did explain to him that it was legal length . He took it any ways to show his superior and confirm that it was legal/ illegal . All B.S. , I won't let them do that to me ever again.
 
Im reading Former Prohibited Weapons No 3 right now.

Yeah it seems that it needs to be under 480 mm to be illegal.

HOWEVER.....at the very end it says "and any similar device" So does that mean: "it has to meet this very specific criteria or something sorta kinda like it".
Seems like the politicians that wrote this law wanted some wiggle room. That is not cool.

Any LEO's here can you please try to produce some type of judicial ruling on this thing. Damn! Living in Canada shouldn't be this hard!!!
 
And any similar device is what I posted ages ago. Can anyone really say that being "right" is so important unless you have a bottomless pit of money for legal and fines, and will not lose your job serving probation or even time. Do we need to shock ourselves with the baton to figure out that when you pee in the wind, you get very wet!
 
Mark18 said:
And any similar device is what I posted ages ago. Can anyone really say that being "right" is so important unless you have a bottomless pit of money for legal and fines, and will not lose your job serving probation or even time. Do we need to shock ourselves with the baton to figure out that when you pee in the wind, you get very wet!
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The guy wants to fight and get his property back... and rightly so. I say 'good for him'.

What do you care? It's not your money being spent, or your job at risk, or your leg that's being pee'd on.

And when he wins... it benefits all of us, including you.
 
Mark18 said:
And any similar device is what I posted ages ago. Can anyone really say that being "right" is so important unless you have a bottomless pit of money for legal and fines, and will not lose your job serving probation or even time. Do we need to shock ourselves with the baton to figure out that when you pee in the wind, you get very wet!
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"Any similar devices" is meant as any device made to discharge electric shock that is less than 480mm long. Picture some kind of balloon made to discharge current; if the ballon has a circumference less than 480mm, it's prohibited, longer and it's not even a weapon. On the other hand, if the current can be discharged while the item is less than 480mm long (for example, let's suppose that it can be separated into 2 parts, and the electric-discharging part is now less than 480mm), then it is prohib, even if it's made to be long than 480mm. I've never had a stun baton in my hands, but if, say, the flashlight can come off and the baton can still discharge, then it would be prohib.

I figure the one peeing in the wind is the cop who seized the baton, and the alleged expert. However, the taxpayer is gonna end up being wet, not either of these cops.

I think the lesson is obvious here: Unless you're the victim of a crime, don't let any LEO into your home without a warrant. No cops would bother filling the paperwork and asking a warrant for a cattle prod that might or might not exist (the whole thing started with a kid bragging so...). They have a set amount of money to collect every month from traffic violations, and they need to reach it. Collecting random items doesn't help them reach their financing goals, so cops are not really encouraged by their superiors to do something like that. I know it sucks to say that, but no one should cooperate with law enforcement unless they're the ones reporting a crime, are the victim of the crime, or the cop in question is their buddy. It's just never in your own interest. That's the crappy world we live in, even in a democratic country like ours.
 
VinnyQC said:
I think the lesson is obvious here: Unless you're the victim of a crime, don't let any LEO into your home without a warrant. No cops would bother filling the paperwork and asking a warrant for a cattle prod that might or might not exist (the whole thing started with a kid bragging so...). They have a set amount of money to collect every month from traffic violations, and they need to reach it. Collecting random items doesn't help them reach their financing goals, so cops are not really encouraged by their superiors to do something like that. I know it sucks to say that, but no one should cooperate with law enforcement unless they're the ones reporting a crime, are the victim of the crime, or the cop in question is their buddy. It's just never in your own interest. That's the crappy world we live in, even in a democratic country like ours.
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I had the RCMP call me on my Blackberry after they received an unintentional 911 pocket dial from it.

I had to let them search my home at 2300. No warrant.

It turned out OK.
 
geologist said:
I had the RCMP call me on my Blackberry after they received an unintentional 911 pocket dial from it.

I had to let them search my home at 2300. No warrant.

It turned out OK.
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I doubt you "had to" let them search your house. Never heard of having to let the police search your house after a 911 call
 
geologist said:
The RCMP said I had to let them in.
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They always say that. It's almost never true. The only 2 reasons cops could enter your house without your permission are:
1-Legally obtained warrant;
2-They have reasons to believe that a crime is being commited or that someone is in immediate danger.*

In case of a 911 call, #2 is playable, but hardly. It all depends on circumstances. Suppose they call you back on the BB and you say "Well, I'm in germany and this is an ip-phone linked to a canada number, so canada's 911 is getting the call, but I'm 7000 miles away". Then what are they gonna do? Break the door to make sure nothing is going on?

A cop can't enter your house, ask you to empty your pocket or show Ids at his will. We don't live in a police state. Without due process or suspicion that a crime is being commited, a cop's job is to get near a highway and go after law abiding citizens driving 1kmph over the speed limit to give them speed tickets. Even if you know for a fact that some dude stole your possession, have seen (or even recorded him) enter his house with your possession, a cop can't enter his house without a warrant. And they will not bother getting a warrant for John Doe's laptop computer or lawnmower. They'll just tell you to stick it, call your insurer.

*Cops will often use this excuse when they've entered a place illegally. Most people don't complain, just like in the case of this cattle prod, but almost everytime someone does file a complain, the cops in questions are found to have acted illegally. The punishment is always ridiculous, usually a simple reprimend. Sometimes a day or a few day of suspension, which is just another word for unpaid vacation.
 
VinnyQC said:
They always say that. It's almost never true. The only 2 reasons cops could enter your house without your permission are:
1-Legally obtained warrant;
2-They have reasons to believe that a crime is being commited or that someone is in immediate danger.*

In case of a 911 call, #2 is playable, but hardly. It all depends on circumstances. Suppose they call you back on the BB and you say "Well, I'm in germany and this is an ip-phone linked to a canada number, so canada's 911 is getting the call, but I'm 7000 miles away". Then what are they gonna do? Break the door to make sure nothing is going on?

A cop can't enter your house, ask you to empty your pocket or show Ids at his will. We don't live in a police state. Without due process or suspicion that a crime is being commited, a cop's job is to get near a highway and go after law abiding citizens driving 1kmph over the speed limit to give them speed tickets. Even if you know for a fact that some dude stole your possession, have seen (or even recorded him) enter his house with your possession, a cop can't enter his house without a warrant. And they will not bother getting a warrant for John Doe's laptop computer or lawnmower. They'll just tell you to stick it, call your insurer.

*Cops will often use this excuse when they've entered a place illegally. Most people don't complain, just like in the case of this cattle prod, but almost everytime someone does file a complain, the cops in questions are found to have acted illegally. The punishment is always ridiculous, usually a simple reprimend. Sometimes a day or a few day of suspension, which is just another word for unpaid vacation.
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I checked the law before I relented to the search. On 911s they can search without a warrant.

http://svan.ca/police-rights/

In what urgent circumstances can the police enter my home?

The police can enter your home without your permission in the following urgent circumstances:
• A 911 call has been made from your home, and the police believe that entry is necessary to prevent death or serious injury.
• Where the police believe that someone in the home is in need of emergency services.
• To help someone who has reported a domestic assault to safely remove their belongings.
• To protect people from injury if the police suspect that there is a drug laboratory in the home.
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http://mtcsalc.org/en/publications/police-powers?p=2

In urgent situations, the police can enter your home without a search warrant or your permission. For example, if the police are pursuing someone who has committed or will commit a serious crime and they believe the suspect is in your home, they may enter your home without a warrant. However, they must tell you that they are the police before entering.

The police can also enter your home if:
•they need to provide emergency aid to someone,
•they believe there is someone in your home who might harm another person (to protect someone’s safety in the home)
•they are investigating a disconnected 911 call,
•they have reasonable grounds to believe there are drugs or evidence of another offence in your home, which may be destroyed if they wait to obtain a search warrant, or
•they are helping an animal that is injured, ill, abused, or neglected and in immediate distress.
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"A 911 call has been made from your home, and the police believe that entry is necessary to prevent death or serious injury."

A buttdial from a BB is neither a call made from your home nor an indication that death or serious injury is imminent. The fact that someone answered the phone, and calmly told them there isn't any emergency when they called back is evidence of that.

Cops of any kind will always begin with "We have the right to..." or "You have to let us..." and about 98% of the population will comply, wheter they should or not. Pretty much all the time, compliance is against your own interest. Don't be fooled, cops use the exact same tactics that BestBuy uses to sell you an extended warranty on a TV: they'll badger you and try to frighten you until you cave in or tell them to stick it where the sun doesn't shine ("Your TV will eat your kids and burn your house if you don't pay an extra 30% for the extended warranty..." is about as reasonnable as "We need to search your home because of a buttdial" ).
 
geologist said:
I checked the law before I relented to the search. On 911s they can search without a warrant.

http://svan.ca/police-rights/



http://mtcsalc.org/en/publications/police-powers?p=2
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First, realize that police can and do lie during the course of their duties... they're allowed to. It's up to you to know your rights and the law. Ignorance of the law is not an excuse. They say they want to enter your home and claim they legally can... however, you stand your ground and insist on a warrant or to speak with a lawyer first and see what happens. What do you think they going to do? Arrest you? For what? No... they are going grumble a bit and finally leave.

As for 911 calls, simple hang ups are not sufficient grounds for exigent circumstances, especially in the age of easily pocket dialed cell phones. There would have to be something else... such as strange noises in the background, (heard on the 911 tape), a history of responses to your address for domestic issues, if you have a criminal record that includes spousal abuse, if the neighbors heard screaming or an argument, when the police are at your door, they see obvious signs of a disturbance, struggle, fight, etc., etc. etc. But for a simple hang-up? Nope. There is a reason warrants exist... and you should have insisted on one.
 
I know this thread is a bit old by now but I just read through it and had a question for you legal experts. In a case like this where a crooked cop steals a law abiding citizens property under false pretences is there any option of filing a restraining order against this crooked cop to stop him from stealing from you again? Surely there is something in place to protect citizens against criminals with badges?
 
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