Is the 10-22 really just a rimfire shooter's equivalent of the Toyota Corolla?

hoytcanon said:
I have been reading your 10/22 hate for years, but it seems to be based on a very small sample size... my experience with 10/22's runs into triple digits, and it is not nearly the negative, unpalatable experience that you seem to have had... partially because I started my experience with the platform before you were born, and back then they were a different gun... as with all mass produced rifles from pretty much every company, they have been dumbed down over the years to increase profit margins, but so have equivalent rifles from all of the other manufacturers. In general, I find your criticisms biased... I am NOT a lover of the 10/22, nor do I feel any need to defend it, but I can certainly appreciate what it brings to the table, of those factors the biggest bonus has nothing to do with the 10/22 itself, but rather it's popularity and the overwhelming aftermarket support industry that has developed around the platform... the 10/22 and its owners support countless businesses that sprang up with neat and innovative products to tweak it's design, style and accuracy... how is this bad for shooting sports in general? As for the gun itself, the Ruger rotary magazine is an absolute engineering marvel in its simplicity, durability and functionality… the magazine alone is reason to own one... yes, it sucks that our RCMP decision makers are a bunch of anti-gun political clowns, that clearly have no common sense... it would be nice to have access to hi-cap mags again (I built a TUF22 for that purpose). In addition, the claims of marvelous accuracy from "out-of-the-box" 10/22's have certainly been embellished by some, but the flip side of that coin is that the inherent "inaccuracy" has also been embellished by others... IME, the average 10/22 is a reasonably accurate, highly functional plinking rifle and casual (fun) target rifle for those that are not into teeny-tiny paper groups... the kicker is that Ruger has designed the rifle with intentionally LOOSE tolerances, they recognize that the platform will be used by a wide variety of people, for a wide variety of purposes and using a wide variety of ammunition... it has to function properly within all of those parameters... and it does... but those parameters also erode its accuracy potential, this is the unavoidable trade off... hence the aftermarket "tweaking" that goes on to refine individual rifles for individual purposes... people, often yourself, speak of these "necessities" for aftermarket tweaking to achieve better accuracy as a "negative" thing... I do not see it that way... the tweaking only ads to the enjoyment of the entire shooting experience, and goes to support and entire industry... and how many new and young shooters have been intrigued and captivated by the increasing charm of there ever changing, ever improving 10/22 rifles... it certainly got my three kids out to the range, and my nieces and nephews and all of their friends. what do you suppose the long range ripple effects are of that for shooting sports down the road when ballot boxes open and inked "X's" are made?

IMO, we should support shooting sports and the introduction of new shooters to shooting sports, and like it or not, the 10/22 has done far more than its share of adding to our fold... of course there are other options from other companies, I support those as well and the debate will always be around on which is "best," or "most" accurate. The 10/22 is a good little gun, and it is relatively rare to get a truly bad one.
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So...you've been owning/shooting 10/22s for over 50 years? lol I guess if you started when they were in the first 4-5 or so years of production, you probably DO have experience with better ones than I've ever seen. :) There is no "hate" either, I don't actually hate anything.

I also didn't realize that my negative opinions of 10/22s is not only crushing the dreams of young shooters, it's impacting the economy too. I should be more careful with my comments. lol We agree on most things Hoyt, or at least, I agree with 99% of what I've ever seen you post here in the Rimfire subforum. I don't disagree with most of ^ this post either. I am critical of 10/22s though, and while my owning experience =1, my shooting experience is probably close to a dozen~I think all of which were bone-stock factory guns. What they all had in common (both from their owner's comments, and my limited time with them)=terrible triggers, poor accuracy, great reliability. Affection for them~mixed. The 10 round mags are remarkably good, which is also a comment I've made numerous times when people start grousing about high capacity mags.

Anyhow, they're popular guns in spite of my opinions about them..but if/when people ask opinions about $300-$500+ guns that I believe to be problematic, I will speak up if I'm feeling compassionate. lol Like most things, it's a question of managing expectations. If I wanted to write a lengthy (honest) reply that reads; "if you have enough time/money, you can make your new, 10/22 fixer-upper actually shoot well"..I'd do that. Instead, I recognize that lots of people (myself included) want to buy guns and use them, not tinker/fuss/customize/upgrade for the fun of it. If THAT process is where you find the fun=more power to you. It just feels dishonest to recommend or endorse these guns when my experience with them hasn't been good.
 
.22LRGUY said:
So...you've been owning/shooting 10/22s for over 50 years? lol I guess if you started when they were in the first 4-5 or so years of production, you probably DO have experience with better ones than I've ever seen. :) There is no "hate" either, I don't actually hate anything.

I also didn't realize that my negative opinions of 10/22s is not only crushing the dreams of young shooters, it's impacting the economy too. I should be more careful with my comments. lol We agree on most things Hoyt, or at least, I agree with 99% of what I've ever seen you post here in the Rimfire subforum. I don't disagree with most of ^ this post either. I am critical of 10/22s though, and while my owning experience =1, my shooting experience is probably close to a dozen~I think all of which were bone-stock factory guns. What they all had in common (both from their owner's comments, and my limited time with them)=terrible triggers, poor accuracy, great reliability. Affection for them~mixed. The 10 round mags are remarkably good, which is also a comment I've made numerous times when people start grousing about high capacity mags.

Anyhow, they're popular guns in spite of my opinions about them..but if/when people ask opinions about $300-$500+ guns that I believe to be problematic, I will speak up if I'm feeling compassionate. lol Like most things, it's a question of managing expectations. If I wanted to write a lengthy (honest) reply that reads; "if you have enough time/money, you can make your new, 10/22 fixer-upper actually shoot well"..I'd do that. Instead, I recognize that lots of people (myself included) want to buy guns and use them, not tinker/fuss/customize/upgrade for the fun of it. If THAT process is where you find the fun=more power to you. It just feels dishonest to recommend or endorse these guns when my experience with them hasn't been good.
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Yup, you are crushing young dreams and are single handedly raising inflation two points... and don't forget that you are also in a conspiracy to sabotage the electoral system! ;)

My first 10/22 was a pre-hyphen carbine that my dad purchased for me as a kid, I shot that rifle ALOT... and dozens and dozens since... my point being that perhaps your loathing (not "hate", perhaps "distaste for"), might be mitigated with more experience... perhaps. At any rate, I quite like the little rifles, and have shared many good moments afield using them with friends and family... good thing we have lots of options, or what would we talk about?
 
The 1022 is the rimfire equivalent of the AR15. You can build and modify it to your heart's content. There are enough after market parts to create any version you want. Forget about comparing it to cars, that's just silly.
 
hoytcanon said:
Yup, you are crushing young dreams and are single handedly raising inflation two points... and don't forget that you are also in a conspiracy to sabotage the electoral system! ;)

My first 10/22 was a pre-hyphen carbine that my dad purchased for me as a kid, I shot that rifle ALOT... and dozens and dozens since... my point being that perhaps your loathing (not "hate", perhaps "distaste for"), might be mitigated with more experience... perhaps. At any rate, I quite like the little rifles, and have shared many good moments afield using them with friends and family... good thing we have lots of options, or what would we talk about?
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Great points Hoyt, and to be honest...you're making me think I should try an older one. I always liked the look of the carbines (Mini 14/A-Team fan as a kid) and still do, but with respect to sample size..having never had a great experience with them, I've simply moved on. Maybe on the 20th gun or so, something would click. :)

Kidding aside, it's never been my goal to really sh*t on them per se, as I know there are guys who love them...and maybe have a different set of requirements/expectations than I do. Are they fun to shoot~as fun as any semi I've tried, but I remember eventually getting a Marlin 795 ($125 gun at the time with a $25 mail-in rebate) and on the first outing using CCI SV, the gun was pop-can accurate all day long @ 50 yards. When I had the cruddy trigger re-worked on that gun (CGN member, inexpensive) I got it down to 3/4" @ 50 yards without a whole lot of effort. I guess that pushed me even further away from 10/22s, and into the loving arms of Marlins. :) Full disclosure~next to the Savage Rascal all of my kids have outgrown, it's the least-used 22 I own. I'm a bolt-gun guy through and through, as I'm sure is obvious.

You have me thinking Hoyt.. Thanks allot! :)
 
I put my 10/22 into a Magpul x22 stock. The adjustability between myself and my kids is great, and now my QD sling fits up via MLOK nicely and makes shooting much more fun.
I feel that the 10/22 was never really meant for scopes, the factory cheek weld is very bad. Noticed how bad it was when trying to get my kid fitted up to it.
 
I can't think of any other 22lr semi autos that are as reliable OR cheap/available to upgrade/fix any issues i might have. 22lr is cheap ammo so rifles being picky brand to brand should be a given. The biggest strength and weakness of any rifle chambered in 22lr is that it is 22lr.
 
I take it back. The 10/22 isn't the rimfire shooter's equivalent of the Toyota Corolla because the passion is there in the case of the 10/22 (on both sides). Not so in the case of the Toyota Corolla. Big surprise there :)

hoytcanon said:
Yup, you are crushing young dreams and are single handedly raising inflation two points... and don't forget that you are also in a conspiracy to sabotage the electoral system! ;)

My first 10/22 was a pre-hyphen carbine that my dad purchased for me as a kid, I shot that rifle ALOT... and dozens and dozens since... my point being that perhaps your loathing (not "hate", perhaps "distaste for"), might be mitigated with more experience... perhaps. At any rate, I quite like the little rifles, and have shared many good moments afield using them with friends and family... good thing we have lots of options, or what would we talk about?
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I never like the receiver to add a scope on but recently I bought an aftermarket barrel with picatinny rail and now I like mine now it is light and accurate, well that’s just me. I can’t compare it to any kind of car.
 
Old 10-22's were as reliable as Corollas, new ones need an hour or so of work then their as reliable as a Corolla.
 
bobc said:
Old 10-22's were as reliable as Corollas, new ones need an hour or so of work then their as reliable as a Corolla.
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For perspective, old Corollas were nowhere near as reliable and well-made as they are now. Younger readers may not remember, but in the 1960's and for much of the 70's Japanese products were not of the high quality associated with them today. Just as 1990's Korean cars were "cheap" and of less-than- middling quality, so it was with many Japanese products half a century ago. No one bragged about having a Japanese car back then. They were considered cheap, just like the 10/22 is today.
 
If the 10/22 was really the 22 shooter's equivalent of a Toyota Corolla there would be lots of buyers asking for ones in beige ... and with those really stupid-looking fake alloy wheel covers.

And they'd expect their gun to give them a lot of demeaning voice messages like "your magazine is empty" .. or "your fly is open".
 
coyoteking said:
You’ve obviously never had to shoot gophers out of necessity for your livelihood. I’ve worn out a Butler Creek loader and a few 25 round mags.
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Agreed👍 Some years when the grass is literally moving with gophers a 25 rnd mag does not last very long and you are constantly reloading them, 100 rnd mag would be good, 10 rnd is nothing.
 
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The 10/22 can be so much more then any Corolla... except maybe when they gut it, drop a 4WD drivetrain and 1000hp engine and go drifting.

Jerry
 

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