More Swiss 1882 cartridge ideas...

I have been doing a little thinking, still haven't gotten around to ordering the dies, however would a 7.62 Nagant revolver die set work for this caliber? Just wondering if anyone has tried it.
 
This thread has been an inspiration. Many thanks to The Kurgan for the original posting.

Picked up a Swiss revolver a few weeks ago and made up some rounds based on the information in this thread. The photos below show the last five of the first batch.

Brass: 32-20 Winchester trimmed to 26 mm, shoulder ironed out with a homemade expander, then sized with a Lee 30 Carbine set.

Bullet: Lee 311-93-1R, which tends to come out to .307 to .308 most of the time. My bore slugs as .305. Bullet seated with the 30 Carbine bullet seater.

Lube: 230 grams each of beeswax, Vaseline, paraffin, with 2 tsp of STP. First made the lube without the paraffin and it was rather soft. Added the wax to stiffen it up.

Powder: 2.9 gr Trail Boss.

Only problem I currently have is that the bullets are loose after sizing with the 30 Carbine die - the case mouths are just a tiny bit too large. After a general sizing I wrap a single layer of dampened onionskin paper around the top half of the case body and run it through the die again. This tightens up the mouth enough to give good tension on the bullet. I really need a die that's either a bit smaller or I need to paper patch the bullets. Note sure what I am going to try there.

Overall, very easy to shoot and a lot of fun. Was so excited that I did not pay much attention at all to accuracy, but we seemed to be getting maybe 3" groups at 20 yards. Will take a look in more detail next time.

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Yes, you need to work with larger diameter boolits when using a 30 Carbine die, as Diopter notes above, .314" lead wadcutters work great. Will be shooting a batch of handloads this weekend... :)
 
The Kurgan said:
Yes, you need to work with larger diameter boolits when using a 30 Carbine die, as Diopter notes above, .314" lead wadcutters work great. Will be shooting a batch of handloads this weekend... :)
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Thanks for the note. I'm already looking into a new mold or two for the Swiss -- I am looking at a couple NOE molds as I have them in other calibres and like them. I used the Lee mold that I had on hand just because I had it on hand. If I recall correctly I think I bought that particular Lee mold to make Tokarev rounds.

I'm still new to casting and don't totally understand the relationship between bore size as read from a slug and the bullet size that should work there.

My slug through the Swiss revolver measures .305. From what I've read -- and I guess I've not read enough! -- I thought that your bullets should be .001 over what the bore slug measures. I was actually a little worried about using the Lee bullets that measure .002 to .003 over the measured bore size. Clearly, I had nothing to worry about -- they worked fine but were obviously too small for the brass sized in the 30 Carbine die, thus requiring a bit of fudging to get tension at the mouth.

So what is the guideline for sizing bullets? How much larger over the measured bore size is safe?

Thanks!
 
I'll respond by saying that the factory 108 grain FMJ's measure .319" in diameter! I think that softer cast .314" is plenty safe. The swiss revolvers seem to be more generous at the throat as compared to the muzzle.
 
If anyone is interested CH4d (7.5 nagant revolver), Hornady (7.5 ordnance) and RCBS (swedish nagant) ($$$$$) make proper dies for this caliber, though I wont be using the sizer on my CH4D dies (no need). They all use different names so use the terms in brackets when searching for their dies.
 
chichibabin said:
If anyone is interested CH4d (7.5 nagant revolver), Hornady (7.5 ordnance) and RCBS (swedish nagant) ($$$$$) make proper dies for this caliber, though I wont be using the sizer on my CH4D dies (no need). They all use different names so use the terms in brackets when searching for their dies.
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What brass are those dies designed to work with? Will they work properly with 32-20 brass or do they expect original brass?

I ask because I encountered this with another oddball cartridge. I apologize for getting a bit off topic here!

I have CH4D 32 WSL dies and they don't size the very thin walled 32-20 brass down far enough. I make my cases from new brass by expanding the case with a homemade expander. The resulting case holds a Hornady Interlock 170 gr FP .321" (Hornady #3210) very nicely. But after firing, the CH4D does not size the case down far enough to hold the bullet -- the Hornady #3210 just drops right into the case.

To fix that, I figured that when I am ironing out the shoulder I need to expand them less than what my homemade sizer does. Not wanting to make another homemade one, I phoned CH4D to order some expander plugs and mentioned to the guy what I was doing with them. He told me that the 32 WSL dies were not designed to work with 32-20 brass -- they were intended for original 32 WSL cases with case walls of original spec thickness.

So while the correct dies are out there I don't want to order expensive dies which are

($$$$$)
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if they are not designed to work with 32-20 cases.

Of course, if they DO work with 32-20 cases, ignore my rant!
 
I just finished making up a batch of ammo for my 1882. 48rds of 7.5x23r. For the brass I used 7.62x38r (7.62 Nagant Revolver) I trimmed to 25.4mm (1"). I used 30 Carbine dies for shaping the brass. OAL I had set at 35mm. The load I will be trying is 2.6grns of trail boss with a 110grn .308 bullet (30 Carbine FMJ), which after looking online seems to be a fairly reasonable place to go.

Pretty excited to shoot it, tomorrow should be fun.
 
That's a good question MDF, you will have to ask them. I know the russian nagant dies from them are designed for the actual case, not like the lee dies that expect 32-20 (they work great btw). I just tried the sizer (haven't needed to yet), and at full length if anything it sizes too much. I then "neck sized" some brass and it turned out fine, so you will be able to size as much as you want with these dies basically. Just tell them what size bullet you will be using so they can size the expander correctly. Here are some pictures, case on the left was full length resized, you can see the bulge from the bullet. Next 2 were neck sized, and look normal. All three will chamber easily in the revolver. The $$$ was more for the RCBS, they want like 160 US, CH and hornady are a lot more reasonable.

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nice work... those reloads look wicked. I have 155 rounds ready for the range in different bullet, case brand, case length (23 and 33mm), and powders (Trail Boss and IMR 4227). For the record, Starline 32-20 and Nagant revolver brass work the best.
 
Eaglelord17 said:
I just finished making up a batch of ammo for my 1882. 48rds of 7.5x23r. For the brass I used 7.62x38r (7.62 Nagant Revolver) I trimmed to 25.4mm (1"). I used 30 Carbine dies for shaping the brass. OAL I had set at 35mm. The load I will be trying is 2.6grns of trail boss with a 110grn .308 bullet (30 Carbine FMJ), which after looking online seems to be a fairly reasonable place to go.

Pretty excited to shoot it, tomorrow should be fun.
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You might want to up the powder charge, but 2.6 is a good starting point. With 110 grain bullets, you might achieve 650 to 700 fps... but no more.
 
Forgot to mention the load I've tried, it's 2 gr titegroup, adapted from the Cartridges of the World load of 2 grains bullseye (they are right next to each other in burn rate). I used a 100 grain .308 wadcutter, my notes say around 650-690 FPS. (seated flush to case mouth, cases are 0.900-0.915 inches long). I will be trying the 100 grain .312 hornady XTP's with this load now, and maybe bump it up a bit to 2.1-2.2, speed is pretty close to their listed 720 FPS.
 
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