Old Time Grizzly Guns

mike Crawford said:
You are the exception then ,, I know lots of guys that will not pass a 50 yard bow shot and will tell you they are comfortable at 60 .. Or maybe i know alot of morons .. I do not bow hunt just for that reason .. you need too get close .. I much prefer a long range rifle
Click to expand...

I have also used a spear... the distance was six feet... I passed up a fifteen FOOT shot as too far... the choice of tool isn't the problem, often the problem is pushing the tool beyond its capabilities and even MORE common is the chump using the tool pushing beyond his/her capabilities. There is more to take into consideration than even ballistics and skill... emotional state (buck fever etc...) and environmental conditions come into play as do other gear being utilized.

I can't think of one good reason to not be certain of a shot BEFORE taking it... and that still doesn't guarantee a desireable outcome.
 
I have a friend from Bella Bella that grew up hearing stories of men hunting grizys with spear and knife
In a argument like this one he went out and baited a bear under a tree and climbed up tree
For two week he would climb the tree each day and wait wen the Grizly finally went for the bait he jumped on to the bear and went hand to hand stabbing him several times finally managed to get the juggler with his knife
My friend was beat up and chewed up pretty good me and my uncle went to visit him while he was recuperating he survive he not so young anymore now
he laughs about it and said it wasn't the smartest thing is done but he said it seems like a good idea at the time haahaa

The Real hunters are the guys that Hunt with traditional bows any one can shoot a rifle but it takes real skill hunting with a bow and a pointy stick my friend with the knife was just crazy
 
Last edited:
heronfish said:
Isn't the point of hunting to get as close as possible and make a clean kill?
Click to expand...
Yes it is .. But with a big gun you can shoot the moose and kill it and not have to sneak in like you may need too do with a shorter range gun ,, In the case of bears I would prefer too be a EXTRA 100 yards back when the shot was took and still have enough gun
 
mike Crawford said:
Yes it is .. But with a big gun you can shoot the moose and kill it and not have to sneak in like you may need too do with a shorter range gun ,, In the case of bears I would prefer too be a EXTRA 100 yards back when the shot was took and still have enough gun
Click to expand...

Ok... I see where the confusion comes from... you "have" to sneak in... I "want" to sneak in... I "want" to shoot them from a few feet... that is what I enjoy the most... being in extremely close proximity with mature biggame animals, without them being aware of my presence... if I get the shot, great... if not, also great...
 
hoytcanon said:
I have also used a spear... the distance was six feet... I passed up a fifteen FOOT shot as too far... the choice of tool isn't the problem, often the problem is pushing the tool beyond its capabilities and even MORE common is the chump using the tool pushing beyond his/her capabilities. There is more to take into consideration than even ballistics and skill... emotional state (buck fever etc...) and environmental conditions come into play as do other gear being utilized.

I can't think of one good reason to not be certain of a shot BEFORE taking it... and that still doesn't guarantee a desireable outcome.
Click to expand...

I think this is what I have been trying too say but not in the right words :)) People will push the range the gun is good for .. so why take a 30-30 in the first place .. it limits you big time .. If you bow hunt you know your limit ,, but like I said there is people that will do 50 yards in a heart beat if it is a big deer or moose ,, and tell you they can do 60 .. But if there was a bow out there that could shoot 100 yards .. why would you limit yourself too the bow that can only do 40
 
mike Crawford said:
I also read a lot of hard books way back in the day .. Ben East wrote a book called ""Bear attacks "" Or at least I believe that was the name of the book as a guy borrowed it and never returned it :))) But anyway in that book it said that a 223 would kill the biggest bear that ever walked .. but that did not make it a bear gun . I am not real sure why people want too hunt with the smallest caliber or least powerful gun possible .. Maybe because grandpa killed a moose or bear with a 44-40 they want too do that too.. But today we have way better choices .. I wanted too do a griz hunt when I was younger and did a pile of research on this ,
Griz have been killed by the 30-30 and 38-55 and 44-40 for sure ,, And a very large Griz was killed by an Native woman with a 22 also .. I seen pictures of that very bear she killed ... The older guns were considered a big step up from a black powder gun for sure that took three minutes too reload ,, today you can still kill a bear with with one .. But I doubt a guide would take you on a griz hunt if you showed up with a 30-30 ,, Or even a 45-70 for that matter ,, As most hunting is done at longer range so the guide can save your ass if you miss and the bear charges .. And he most likely will not be carrying a 30-30 either
Click to expand...

My grandmother told me a story about putting down a black bear that was in a trap. She said she felt 'right sorry for him' as the bear let out a mournful sad groan shortly after she shot it. I asked her what type of gun she used and she said: "a .44". In those days, I think that would have equated to a Winchester model 1892 in .44/40. I don't have anything personal to relate wrt Grizzlies as we don't have any here.

It still makes a good excuse to buy a firearm and ammunition.

How can you have a house without a gun? What if a bear came through that door?
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
mike Crawford said:
I think this is what I have been trying too say but not in the right words :)) People will push the range the gun is good for .. so why take a 30-30 in the first place .. it limits you big time .. If you bow hunt you know your limit ,, but like I said there is people that will do 50 yards in a heart beat if it is a big deer or moose ,, and tell you they can do 60 .. But if there was a bow out there that could shoot 100 yards .. why would you limit yourself too the bow that can only do 40
Click to expand...

Then why argue ballistics or equipment, when the problem is a lack of maturity in the hunter... they can choose a .338 Lapua or a .50 BMG and still shoot beyond the reasonable range of their tool.

I would go so far as to say that IME those who choose magnum chamberings set-up for long range shooting are MORE likely to push the limit than the guy shooting equipment that is clearly limited.... again, IME.
 
hoytcanon said:
Ok... I see where the confusion comes from... you "have" to sneak in... I "want" to sneak in... I "want" to shoot them from a few feet... that is what I enjoy the most... being in extremely close proximity with mature biggame animals, without them being aware of my presence... if I get the shot, great... if not, also great...
Click to expand...

I uselessly do not NEED too sneak in as I carry a 300 win mag when moose hunting and have a 338 as a second gun ,, My point is that if You use a 30-30 or a short range gun you need too get A lot closer too the game too make a clean kill .. Not that a 30-30 will not kill a moose or is a bad gun .. Lots of people from southern Ontario will drive 15 -20 hours one way too go moose hunting in an area that is clear cuts ,, But will take a 30-30 too hunt with ,, They want too bring a moose home .. so end up pushing the limits of the gun ,, My point all along is WHY take a 30-30 in the first place .. If you go there and are a bow hunter you know you are limited too 40 yards .. when people go rifle hunting they are limited by the gun they carry .. so why limit your self too a 100 yard gun when you can carry a 200-300 yard gun,, If I was a bow hunter and there was a 40 yard bow and a 200 yard bow I would have the 200 yard bow .. you can still sneak in too 40 if you so wish or you can opt too kill the animal at 200 .. WHY would you take the 40 yard bow with you and leave the 200 yard bow at camp
 
mike Crawford said:
I uselessly do not NEED too sneak in as I carry a 300 win mag when moose hunting and have a 338 as a second gun ,, My point is that if You use a 30-30 or a short range gun you need too get A lot closer too the game too make a clean kill .. Not that a 30-30 will not kill a moose or is a bad gun .. Lots of people from southern Ontario will drive 15 -20 hours one way too go moose hunting in an area that is clear cuts ,, But will take a 30-30 too hunt with ,, They want too bring a moose home .. so end up pushing the limits of the gun ,, My point all along is WHY take a 30-30 in the first place .. If you go there and are a bow hunter you know you are limited too 40 yards .. when people go rifle hunting they are limited by the gun they carry .. so why limit your self too a 100 yard gun when you can carry a 200-300 yard gun,, If I was a bow hunter and there was a 40 yard bow and a 200 yard bow I would have the 200 yard bow .. you can still sneak in too 40 if you so wish or you can opt too kill the animal at 200 .. WHY would you take the 40 yard bow with you and leave the 200 yard bow at camp
Click to expand...

You clearly can't understand what it is I am doing out there... I'm not just stacking up meat, although I enjoy the meat... if it was just about the meat, I would stay home and order a cut & wrapped beef... it would be a heck of a lot cheaper...

I am attempting to "experience" nature in an ancient way, have you ever slapped a deer, or have a bull moose literally step over you, or have a bear knock you over responding to a dying rabbit call... it is an exhilerating rush... I don't want to shoot from several hundred yards.
 
mike Crawford said:
I have not went moose hunting in a few years now ,, But there was a guy that camped just up the logging road from me that DROVE 700 klm a day looking for moose.. He was there too get a moose
Click to expand...

I paddle 10 km a day... and I get my moose... and from inside 20 yards.
 
My Dad hunted grizzly in Whitehorse back in the 80's and early 90's. Parker Hale 303 British. My Dad only owned 1 high powered rifle in his whole life. There was nothing his 303 didn't take down. I have it now and will keep it for the rest of my life.
 
Ranger Dave said:
My Dad hunted grizzly in Whitehorse back in the 80's and early 90's. Parker Hale 303 British. My Dad only owned 1 high powered rifle in his whole life. There was nothing his 303 didn't take down. I have it now and will keep it for the rest of my life.
Click to expand...

And i DO Believe that ! :) 303 was -is a pretty good Cartridge ! RJ
 
I
hoytcanon said:
I have also used a spear... the distance was six feet... I passed up a fifteen FOOT shot as too far... the choice of tool isn't the problem, often the problem is pushing the tool beyond its capabilities and even MORE common is the chump using the tool pushing beyond his/her capabilities. There is more to take into consideration than even ballistics and skill... emotional state (buck fever etc...) and environmental conditions come into play as do other gear being utilized.

I can't think of one good reason to not be certain of a shot BEFORE taking it... and that still doesn't guarantee a desireable outcome.
Click to expand...

Hunting with a spear really puts you in a hole difrent place
trying to control your excitement and at the same time sadness as the reality what you're about to do sets in ever Hunter shood experience mix feelings at least once
Maybe this whole long range trend would disappear and a greater respect for the animals we hunt as a result
 
Last edited:
carverk said:
I

Hunting with a spear really puts you in a hole difrent place
trying to control your excitement and at the same time sadness as the reality what you're about to do sets in ever Hunter shood experience mix feelings at least once
Maybe this whole long range trend would disappear and a greater respect for the animals we hunt as a result
Click to expand...

If I wasn't convinced of the 100% lethality I would never have done it.... no different than bowhunting at a shorter range, just as bowhunting is no different than a .30/30 but at shorter range, just as a .30/30 is no different than a .300 WM but at shorter range. Range is the thing... and the ability to stay within it.
 
hoytcanon said:
If I wasn't convinced of the 100% lethality I would never have done it.... no different than bowhunting at a shorter range, just as bowhunting is no different than a .30/30 but at shorter range, just as a .30/30 is no different than a .300 WM but at shorter range. Range is the thing... and the ability to stay within it.
Click to expand...
Yep, range and marksmanship. I have seen an awful lot of guys head out with the latest 975 Whizbang Magnum, sporter barrel, often only bore-sighted. One shot fired at an oil jug at 47 yards to "check zero". Now, they're ready to shoot a moose at 700 yards, offhand. Yeah, a 30-30 demands q good, if not expert, marksman, but for the vast majority of hunters, 200 yards is the practical maximum range, which is only 50 or so yards further than a 30-30's max. Would I use one to hunt cuts? Nope. But my wife did put 3 shots in the lungs of a 7 year old cow moose at 220 paces with a 7.62 x 39. It would have been DRT if she hadn't tone down to it when it laid down.

Better a 30-30 in the heart than a 458 Lott in the hoof.
 
You must log in or register to reply here.
Back
Top Bottom