Sig550 Vs Xcr
- Thread starter LibertyorDeath
- Start date
Agreed. I've seen metal shavings, burrs, and other issues from reputable manufacturers. Strip and inspect - maybe not every bolt, but every component.
- Location
- Port Perry/Toronto
There is only one resolution to this fight -we need a shoot off!!!! First rifle to malfunction looses!!!
Well at least one person on here understands the meaning between a field strip and a complete tear down....
If you have to do a complete tear down on a rifle before you fire it, I would suggest that you would be a fool to buy that rifle.
And if you would want to pay $1000 for the factory to do the teardown for you, then me thinks you have too much money to waste. Give me some plz.
I gotta say though that I wish that I had the dough and the time to torture test the XCR to failure. We should start a fund, so an owner can afford to see what it takes to kill the rifle. Would help put this thread to rest.
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And if you would want to pay $1000 for the factory to do the teardown for you, then me thinks you have too much money to waste. Give me some plz.
I have rarely done more than a field strip to shoot a rifle, regardless what that rifle cost. If I have it was only for personal interest, and not to ensure things were installed properly.
If you are telling me every XCR requires a complete detailed strip before it shoots, that is poor workmanship, and a poor product overall.
The point of this retarded thread was a comparison of the two systems: Sig vs XCR.
No one that buys a rifle should be required to 'torture' test or beta test the product, that is what the factory should do. Sig has done it, Robarms hasn't -that was the only point to this characteristic comparison of the two systems.
The only reason for me wading into a thread filled with nonsense is to set some poor unsuspecting SOB straight with regard to the validity of some claims that the XCR is a great rifle.
Bottom line: the XCR doesn't hold a candle to the Sig rifles. The XCR are overpriced in my opinion, and come from a manufacturer with a proven history of questionable research and development, quality and control.
The main reason they are sought after in Canada is they are a non-restricted, semi automatic rifle that accepts detachable AR mags.
For anyone looking to purchase an XCR, I would highly recommend they do further research on the product. Good luck with your purchase!
I used to be an XCR Fanboy... as soon as they were announced I had proclaimed myself as in line to purchase, but as they have hit the streets, I am less and less willing to part with the cash. For two grand I would rather save up a little longer and get a Tavor or a Swiss.
The XCR seems to be of the same category as the AR180B and should really be priced accordingly in order to entice me to buy one.
Not to knock Wolverine - he has to charge a certain markup based on his expenses to keep the doors open; but according to price point, an XCR and a Sabre AR15 should be of approximately equivalent quality. I think based on the owner feedback I have read, that this is not the case. Something has come off the rails somewhere and I am going to assume that the profit magain is the same for both Sabre and Robarms rifles, and the cost of importation is the same in terms of staff hours to pull the permits, fees etc. I would also make a reasonable assumption that the cost of shipping an order of X quantity of rifles from Sabre is greater than the cost of shipping the same quantity of rifles from Robarms. Assuming that the rate of currency exchange is similar to both countries, This tends to suggest to me that the wholesale cost that Wolverine is required to pay for the rifles is probably where things have gone off the rails and that Robarms is asking a premium price for the Canadian version of the rifles relative to their fielded value after delivery, as compared to the Sabre rifles.
The XCR seems to be of the same category as the AR180B and should really be priced accordingly in order to entice me to buy one.
Not to knock Wolverine - he has to charge a certain markup based on his expenses to keep the doors open; but according to price point, an XCR and a Sabre AR15 should be of approximately equivalent quality. I think based on the owner feedback I have read, that this is not the case. Something has come off the rails somewhere and I am going to assume that the profit magain is the same for both Sabre and Robarms rifles, and the cost of importation is the same in terms of staff hours to pull the permits, fees etc. I would also make a reasonable assumption that the cost of shipping an order of X quantity of rifles from Sabre is greater than the cost of shipping the same quantity of rifles from Robarms. Assuming that the rate of currency exchange is similar to both countries, This tends to suggest to me that the wholesale cost that Wolverine is required to pay for the rifles is probably where things have gone off the rails and that Robarms is asking a premium price for the Canadian version of the rifles relative to their fielded value after delivery, as compared to the Sabre rifles.
Davy Crockett
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Fraser Valley
well damn, now I'm just going to have to buy a black special too so I can see for myself . Thanks a lot guys.
. Thanks a lot guys.Beltfeds last post has explained this issue fully.
It never ceases to amaze me how some people become attached to their guns and will then defend them to the end. I don't care how great your one gun is. Pull a large sample off of the production line (10 to 25 guns) and run them hard against the Sigs (or HK 416's or SCAR's or Colt Canada C8's). Most experience people know what the outcome will be. Those that question the outcome are not as experienced as they pretend to be on the internet.
This reminds me of other threads like, "My Glock jammed, there for all Glocks are Sh#t." (If you believe that one then believe the next one) "My XCR is the greatest battle rifle ever produced and has never jammed or broke."
Back to the original topic, I like XCR's but they are not in the same class as SAN products, end of story. By leading someone down the garden path to believe that they are, so they might spend their hard earned money on one, is irresponsible.
I'm out, Rich
It never ceases to amaze me how some people become attached to their guns and will then defend them to the end. I don't care how great your one gun is. Pull a large sample off of the production line (10 to 25 guns) and run them hard against the Sigs (or HK 416's or SCAR's or Colt Canada C8's). Most experience people know what the outcome will be. Those that question the outcome are not as experienced as they pretend to be on the internet.
This reminds me of other threads like, "My Glock jammed, there for all Glocks are Sh#t." (If you believe that one then believe the next one) "My XCR is the greatest battle rifle ever produced and has never jammed or broke."
Back to the original topic, I like XCR's but they are not in the same class as SAN products, end of story. By leading someone down the garden path to believe that they are, so they might spend their hard earned money on one, is irresponsible.
I'm out, Rich
It doesn't take a lot of money to run an XCR to failure. We did it with less than $100 worth of ammo.
It wasn't a catastrophic failure but it still put the rifle out of commission until we got replacement parts.
One of the cheap spring clips that held the hammer pin in place broke and jammed up the trigger mechanism. This was on a brand new rifle.
It's just one of the small things I don't like. There is enough room to have used E clips, which are much more durable.
It's just one of the small things I don't like. There is enough room to have used E clips, which are much more durable.
Not to downplay this breakage,...but this is not something I would consider a failure of the rifle or RA. Guns break......fact.
You don't "like" it,...................one of the Small things you don't like.
I think I would be a little pissed,...but I would get over it. I assumed you had a major breakage...like a lug or barrel,..or something major.
thanks for the heads-up and the reply. I think I will risk it.
My friends Ar 180b would not even cycle when he first got it,...we took it to my range and thanks to the good people at Wolverine,...he was able to get it working. FYI
Throttle_monkey1
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
so beltfed showed a link to the testing of sigs. Great link! Rich lps says that if you take a sample batch of xcrs they will fail before the sigs. Of course "those in the know" know this, so he doesn't have to provide us feeble xcr owners any documentation or proof.
I don't even own an XCR, and while they may well be less reliable than a SI
- I don't know how that would be relevant to the light range and field common to most civilian owners
- the amount of vitriol regarding the XCR seems unwarranted - people are applying mililtary usage standards where they shouldn't, and seem self-righteously indignant about the 'crappy' nature of the rifles when they haven't, by and large, actually held one.
- maybe some of the design features are poor - again, i don't own one and don't know - but if so, just point them out and move on. No need to slag the product off as a whole.
My car is not as good on a racetrack as, say, a corvette. So what? It cost less and I don't ask it to go on a racetrack.
Singular experiences (armedsask) don't count for much either - it's multi-sample testing that counts. Internet aneqdotes count for little as well. For example, before I bought an AR15 I was certain that I would need a McFarland ring to make it reliable - turns out to be pure bunk - and that it would be a jam-o-matic unless cleaned regularly with a toothbrush - also pure bunk.
If someone owns, shoots and likes an XCR, let them have their fun. If they're making excuses for first-batch problems or inherent design flaws, let them live in their (as you see it) fantasy world.
- I don't know how that would be relevant to the light range and field common to most civilian owners
- the amount of vitriol regarding the XCR seems unwarranted - people are applying mililtary usage standards where they shouldn't, and seem self-righteously indignant about the 'crappy' nature of the rifles when they haven't, by and large, actually held one.
- maybe some of the design features are poor - again, i don't own one and don't know - but if so, just point them out and move on. No need to slag the product off as a whole.
My car is not as good on a racetrack as, say, a corvette. So what? It cost less and I don't ask it to go on a racetrack.
Singular experiences (armedsask) don't count for much either - it's multi-sample testing that counts. Internet aneqdotes count for little as well. For example, before I bought an AR15 I was certain that I would need a McFarland ring to make it reliable - turns out to be pure bunk - and that it would be a jam-o-matic unless cleaned regularly with a toothbrush - also pure bunk.
If someone owns, shoots and likes an XCR, let them have their fun. If they're making excuses for first-batch problems or inherent design flaws, let them live in their (as you see it) fantasy world.
First of all - let's be fair.
Robinson arms is a small company! Back in the days, they have ONE 18 years old kid doing all the welding of M96 receivers. That's how small they were back then. You simply cannot expect the same design maturity or consistency in QC - all their part are proprietary and are not rountinely made by several big shops with accumulated experience. It is just reality - you are not buying a honda civic, you are buying a put together by a big local garage, that is a bit different from everyone else..
Now, putting that aside - from consumer perspective, it is not an execuse. However, when you buy a Robinson, you expect to buy a "nich" product that is, you want something different than the run of the mill stuff. So really, you understand what it is - and therefore suck it up buttercup!
In my mind, the XCR is a great hobby rifle. There is nothing wrong with it. If you want one, go buy one. On the other hand, it is unrealistic to compare it to SG55X or SCAR. THe SCAR had gone through many changes since the original submission, and the XCR has not even gone through the submission ( the damned BFA! )
Robinson arms is a small company! Back in the days, they have ONE 18 years old kid doing all the welding of M96 receivers. That's how small they were back then. You simply cannot expect the same design maturity or consistency in QC - all their part are proprietary and are not rountinely made by several big shops with accumulated experience. It is just reality - you are not buying a honda civic, you are buying a put together by a big local garage, that is a bit different from everyone else..
Now, putting that aside - from consumer perspective, it is not an execuse. However, when you buy a Robinson, you expect to buy a "nich" product that is, you want something different than the run of the mill stuff. So really, you understand what it is - and therefore suck it up buttercup!
In my mind, the XCR is a great hobby rifle. There is nothing wrong with it. If you want one, go buy one. On the other hand, it is unrealistic to compare it to SG55X or SCAR. THe SCAR had gone through many changes since the original submission, and the XCR has not even gone through the submission ( the damned BFA! )
hahhhaa - people lost the right to bid because they did not submit everything required in the bidding package. Not surprised at all, especially if you are in hurry, tired and have not slept for a few days to get stuff done.
