Steel case ammo with Browning M1919A4

katazone

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I have, so far, been using brass ammo in my 1919.
Just got a batch of MFS (not Barnaul) steel ammo for a good price.
I know some of you have used the copper washed type.
Should I worry about using it?
Ware? cycling? jam?

Please share your personal experiences.

Thx
 
They shot steel cased 30 06 out of the 1919 at my club for their pumpkin shoot and it ran all day from what I saw. There was also line most of the Time so it was constantly running.
 
You 1919 owners are aware that steel cased ammo has been going through MGs for about the last 90 years or so now and in Europe its a non issue.
 
I use PRC 7.62x51 copper washed steel stuff exclusively in mine - works perfectly at 3 clicks out.

I DID have a single issue once where the cartridge rim has some extra sealant and it got stuck in the bolt (wouldn't drop into place). Pounded it out, and the rest of the case ran fine.
 
Hi Kevin
I'm currently headspace at 4 clicks and that was no issue for brass ammo.
How would I go about checking headspace for the MFS steel ammunition?
Thought head spacing was for different ammo!
Sorry for the 1919 newbie questions.

It is a total non issue. Just make sure to check your head space when changing ammo and fire away.
 
You 1919 owners are aware that steel cased ammo has been going through MGs for about the last 90 years or so now and in Europe its a non issue.

I did thank you. I am a new 1919 owner and with the price tag on these I would like to minimize any risk of a screw up.
The question was meant to attract any and all situations 1919 Jedi shooters might have encountered. :D
 
I use PRC 7.62x51 copper washed steel stuff exclusively in mine - works perfectly at 3 clicks out.

I DID have a single issue once where the cartridge rim has some extra sealant and it got stuck in the bolt (wouldn't drop into place). Pounded it out, and the rest of the case ran fine.


.308 ?
 
It is a total non issue. Just make sure to check your head space when changing ammo and fire away.

FYI, I have yet to give the 1919 a try since you told me to add that little spring to make sure it doesn't derail.
I'll let you know how it goes!! Thx for that tip.
 
FYI, I have yet to give the 1919 a try since you told me to add that little spring to make sure it doesn't derail.
I'll let you know how it goes!! Thx for that tip.

what little spring got a pic? ive put about 5K thru mine but have not used it in last 2 years
 
what little spring got a pic? ive put about 5K thru mine but have not used it in last 2 years

That message was for Kevin M.
But if you must know, I'll give it my best shot at explaining...Lol
In the top cover where the belt feed lever arm is attached to the cover (pivot), there is a bit of play (gap), often that allows for that arm to come off of the track groove in the bolt, which can results in cycling issues. You can add a tiny tiny spring there to add the smallest ever amount of pressure to the arm so that it will remain in the track while cycling and will therefore correct that issue. That is if that is the problem for you.
I have yet to find out if this is what is causing my problem. It could be headspacing too! but I always always check that at every range trip.
Just learning that different ammo also requires headspacing and was hoping for an answer as to that process. :D
 
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One method that you can use without needing any gauges is to pull a bullet and insert the empty case into the gun with the barrel turned all the way in but the bolt is cocked and now forward. Pull the bolt back 1/2", turn the barrel out a click, let the bolt back to closed and try to fire the action. It won`t fire (click) . Repeat the above counting the total amount of clicks until it does fire. After it fires add 2 more clicks. Now you have the headspace matched up to the ammunition you are using. If the gun is acting up, you can add another click or two, but when you approach 4 clicks over the setting, you are approaching a bad area (excessive headspace) and may have to look elsewhere for the problem. You will end up firing the primer using this method. I would strongly suggest not using live rounds in this method unless you are at the range and the gun is pointing downrange and the range is live.

A common problem I find on the M1919s is the choice of barrel bearings. That is the cone screwed onto the front end of the barrel. There are different diameters for different bullets. If you are using an ex-Canadian cone, most were modified over to .308 by the insertion of a bushing to increase the recoil action to the mechanism. 30-06 would have a larger opening , and for the swede 8mm (for those that still have some) I would suggest the opening would be even larger. Barrel bearings are usually marked as to their size or the round they were meant for.
 
One method that you can use without needing any gauges is to pull a bullet and insert the empty case into the gun with the barrel turned all the way in but the bolt is cocked and now forward. Pull the bolt back 1/2", turn the barrel out a click, let the bolt back to closed and try to fire the action. It won`t fire (click) . Repeat the above counting the total amount of clicks until it does fire. After it fires add 2 more clicks. Now you have the headspace matched up to the ammunition you are using. If the gun is acting up, you can add another click or two, but when you approach 4 clicks over the setting, you are approaching a bad area (excessive headspace) and may have to look elsewhere for the problem. You will end up firing the primer using this method. I would strongly suggest not using live rounds in this method unless you are at the range and the gun is pointing downrange and the range is live.

A common problem I find on the M1919s is the choice of barrel bearings. That is the cone screwed onto the front end of the barrel. There are different diameters for different bullets. If you are using an ex-Canadian cone, most were modified over to .308 by the insertion of a bushing to increase the recoil action to the mechanism. 30-06 would have a larger opening , and for the swede 8mm (for those that still have some) I would suggest the opening would be even larger. Barrel bearings are usually marked as to their size or the round they were meant for.

Thanks stencollector.
I red on 1919a4.com that if, for a s/a .308, I have to go beyond 4-5 clicks when the gun is cold, something was not right.
I will follow your method and do the 1 click at a time until it fires, see if it's sluggish, and increase from there.
So far, I found that shooting Federal XM80C 149 gr (the only ammo I have used ever yet), it ran like a sewing machine at 4 clicks out.
Is there a standard in terms of clicks? or does this truly vary on every ammo manufacturer? and is it also different depending on the gun?

Regards
 
My only experience running Norinco steel cased ammo through my 1919 was the rifle firing the round and then ripping the rim off the case with the case stuck in the chamber.

I have not fired ANY steel case after. Damaging the bolt face would be a MAJOR pain in the a$$!

Cheers
Jay
 
....

A common problem I find on the M1919s is the choice of barrel bearings. That is the cone screwed onto the front end of the barrel. There are different diameters for different bullets. If you are using an ex-Canadian cone, most were modified over to .308 by the insertion of a bushing to increase the recoil action to the mechanism. 30-06 would have a larger opening , and for the swede 8mm (for those that still have some) I would suggest the opening would be even larger. Barrel bearings are usually marked as to their size or the round they were meant for.

I remember a rotating scraper tool in the parts roll on some MG 7.62 C1s that was supposed to be for scraping the carbon out of the barrel bearing plug. Never fired them enough in the service to get that caked up, but it is worth remembering if the gun doesn't seem to have enough (or too much) return force on the barrel.

Back to the original question, I would be equally concerned about the OAL length and case dimensions on blaster ammo. If the round is under-spec it will mess up the clearances through the feed tray, the extractor, the cartridge block and onto the breechblock face. One of the local guys had troubles getting his to extract from the belt. Turns out the rims weren't indexing far enough back for the extractor to engage.
 
My only experience running Norinco steel cased ammo through my 1919 was the rifle firing the round and then ripping the rim off the case with the case stuck in the chamber.

I have not fired ANY steel case after. Damaging the bolt face would be a MAJOR pain in the a$$!

Cheers
Jay

Point noted.
The only time I experienced the rim ripping off was with my AR .308
Turned out it was an extractor issue. Different animal I know! :D

Thx Jay
 
I remember a rotating scraper tool in the parts roll on some MG 7.62 C1s that was supposed to be for scraping the carbon out of the barrel bearing plug. Never fired them enough in the service to get that caked up, but it is worth remembering if the gun doesn't seem to have enough (or too much) return force on the barrel.

Back to the original question, I would be equally concerned about the OAL length and case dimensions on blaster ammo. If the round is under-spec it will mess up the clearances through the feed tray, the extractor, the cartridge block and onto the breechblock face. One of the local guys had troubles getting his to extract from the belt. Turns out the rims weren't indexing far enough back for the extractor to engage.

I compared the MFS steel case ammo with Federal brass. The overall proportions are the same for the exception of the most minute (.000) in length, barely visible to the eye!
I will proceed gently.

Thx
 
Point noted.
The only time I experienced the rim ripping off was with my AR .308
Turned out it was an extractor issue. Different animal I know! :D

Thx Jay

At least with the AR you can replace the extractor fairly simply...

Damaging the bolt face on a 1919 is a MAJOR FRIGGEN ISSUE!!! And the reason I am not running steel cased ammo after my experience!

Cheers
Jay
 
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