The new R18 is priced accordingly and fine. Back in the day, an ATRS MS or Stag would cost upwards of 4k to build a decent Gucci semi-auto. Sure these aren't the same rifles because of buffer, gas-systems but they are semi's. This is what we can get at this point right now. I'm getting one or two for the price of a bren or modded out x95 or tommy build sl8.
TACCOM24 Sterling arms R18 mk3 .223
- Thread starter greentips
- Start date
it would be nice to see a canadian company create something simple and reliable like a su16 - instead of every single company trying to create the most robust and fancy ar clone. While enough sport shooters are capable of these prices many just want something cheap for the range several times a year
Cool story, but everything you just listed is prohibited either by OIC or (in the case of the MS/MH) the FRT. We are discussing the pricing of what is currently available for semi-auto, centerfire, sporting/utility rifles on the Canadian market. In that context, the R18 Mk3 is very reasonably priced for what you will receive if the quality of fit and finish hold firm on Production Rifles. Assuming no surprises, the Mk 3 will
The R18 Mk3 is about as simple, robust and safe as you can get in a .223 rifle. Those wantng something cheaper for the range just several times per year are advised to purchase an SKS from Russia or China, a case of corrosive ammo, and some.cleaning supplies. People need to pursue the hobby in keeping with their means. Don't complain because the VERY reasonably-priced Mk3 is beyond your means, do something positive about your financial lot in life....
Bartok, you seem to be quite defensive over this firearm. I don't disagree with you. If the QC is good, it will offer a wonderful value for Canadians as compared to offerings from larger manufacturers, at least until C21 is (hopefully) revoked.
My concerns are that you mention you are friends with a major financial backer for this product. It would be hard for me to be totally unbiased in that situation. Also, were you able to randomly pick a rifle or was one sent to you? Did you receive it for free for the purposes of your review and will you be sending it back or keeping it?
My concerns are that you mention you are friends with a major financial backer for this product. It would be hard for me to be totally unbiased in that situation. Also, were you able to randomly pick a rifle or was one sent to you? Did you receive it for free for the purposes of your review and will you be sending it back or keeping it?
It is difficult not to become excited when what you believe to be the "next great thing" lands in your lap - at least insofar as those who are interested in modern sporting rifles are concerned. How do you get the word out without sounding like a shill? It is no easy task, especially when members of your audience try to ascribe dubious motivations to your altruistic efforts.
It is impossible for me to to remain totally objective given my genuine excitement over this platform and yes, my friendship with the Chief Designer. So I made all of that very clear in the "Disclosure" segment of my review. In other words, you were warned.
As to your concerns, they are as valid as my Review. You can choose to believe what I write based on my 42 years of "black rifle" experence or not. Your perogative. I will say this however - I don't write fluff pieces to promote items that I do not believe in 100%.
So far as I know the rifle was not hand- selected other than the fact that it was given to me as a non-fIring sample due to some tolerance issues. So they gave me a lemon to play with while the good prototypes commence test-firing. I clearly did not get a hand-select based on that consideration! The rifle that I have will be exchanged for a pre-Production rifle that I can fire for accuracy and reliability results in approximately 3 weeks time. After which point I will provide Part 2 of my Review. The rifles are only lent to me on a temporary basis for my review purposes.
I have not discussed any financial or material renumeration for my most recent Review of an SAI product, aside from what is detailed below. SAI did quite unexpectedly gift me with an R18 Mk2 following my Review of that rifle several years ago, but I have advised the SAI representative that placing my name on the list to purchase from the first production Run is plenty thanks enough this time. I mostly write my reviews for the benefit of CGNers anyhow. My friendship with the R18's Chief Designer simply gets me access to their latest designs so that I can share them with you. I don't expect to receive a free rifle every time I write a review.
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Sure thing, Ace! Darn - you've got me all figured out, don'tcha?
Too bad you're too late. I've already declined a freebie rifle in favour of a spot at the head of the line to purchase my copy....
Last I checked, "robust" meant "Sturdy" or "exhibiting strength", which is exactly what the Mk3's Upper Receiver and Bolt Carrier Assembly both are and do. As for Safe, yes - the additional Firing Pin Safety adds an extra layer of user protection that no other non-prohibited firearm does on the current Canadian market.
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Receivers for an MS were 1300 with tax. Stags sets were so cheap! Depending on which parts you throw on. My MS was close to 4k all said and done. Stag was a bit cheaper.
IMO, CFW barrels are the worst. I bought one because it looked great and shot a couple of ammo boxes at the range. That thing got hot and opened up to like big burtha. That junk was taken off and sold and replaced ASAP. They look and sound cool.
The R18 is priced perfectly in this market. I will buy one or two (restricted). It would be good if someone would make barrels for it.
Oh, the rifle they gave me will certainly fire - my photos are plenty evidence of that. If you mistakenly think that they manufacture non-firing prototypes for review purposes, well then you are out to lunch. The rifle is perfectly capable of firing, I was asked not to proceed to my Review Part 2 due to tolerance issues with the Bolt Face and resultant excessive Headspace. That was a good enough reason for me to wait 3 weeks for a rifle that will give realistic accuracy and reliability results.
Yes, you missed that nugget of information in my Review. Just like you must have glossed over my Disclaimer to get to the good stuff. Who knows what other details you missed? Details are important and my review is full of 'em. Maybe a slow re-read is in order so that you don't nit-pick more details that were already provided to you...
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You come across as very petty Bartok, is it so hard to admit that you really don’t know what the quality of the rifle is yet? Dial down your over-the-top enthusiasm and be realistic for a moment. A recent prototype (the one you received) had such excessive tolerance issues as to be unsafe to fire, and yet how many people have you tried to shoot down for their skepticism over possible tolerance issues with Turkish outsourcing?
We’re talking a gun manufactured by people that the Canadian market in fact has had mostly-negative experiences with, and you’re saying it’s the best thing since sliced bread when you haven’t even seen anything but a defective lemon of a prototype. Just rein it in man. You don’t really know any better than we do here.
Show me where I have tried to shoot down anyone for skepticism over possible tolerance issues with Turkish Outsourcing. I'll wait. The fact is that you will find that I stayed out of that entire conversation because I know nothing about that particular subject. Your recall is fundamentally flawed. Notwithstanding the potential for tolerance issues with outsourcing, I am confident that SAI's QC processes in Canada have taken that potentiality into account and will ensure that tolerance issues do not plague the launch of the new rifle. You can harbour all the doubt you like,
You want to talk about petty Zortron? Just because I don't give any credence to your inane presumptions of failure and negativity, you are now resorting to name-calling. Whatever. Base on your demonstrated maturity you must be a youngster yet. You'll learn some day that you get a lot further in life by getting along with people instead of picking fights. Until then, I am done with you. Blather on all you like concerning a firearm that you quite evidently do not understand....
Just an FYI quite a few people outside of this forum have echoed similar sentiments and to be quite honest, his points are valid. As someone who is supposed to be an objective view into this project, you are very, very quick to champion something which you haven't had a chance to really play with yet. I understand you're excited and it's essentially an MCX at home (AKDAS Sem 223), but the further you engage on here, the more weary people are of both your opinion and role with SAI. For someone with just a friendly connection with JR, you seem to have a lot more to say than the company that is selling them under their name.
Well, I don't have the time to frequent other firearms sites outside of CGN, so I really don't care what people are saying about me "over there". And since when am I supposed to be entirely objective? I promised a non-biased review, which I believe I delivered based on direct observation and handling of the Prototype Rifle lent to me by SAI. As it turns out, based on my examination of the rifle, I have become a big believer in the revised operating systems (Gas and Action) of the Mk3. If SAI's QC holds, then this rifle will completely dominate the other AR180B-derivative designs. We'll know if my faith in SAI was warranted after the first production rifles enter the wild with initial user feedback.
I've had plenty of opportunity to play with the rifle. I have repeatedly stripped it down to its component parts, carefully examined the design revisions, and am sold on the Mk3 as a result. I know that the rifle will function as it is based on proven designs. The only quesstions at this point are the accuracy of the factory Barrel and the reliability of the system. I'll will get those answers in due course.
I have more to say than SAI on here because they asked me to do the Review on their behalf. The SAI staff are understandably busy with bringing their new rifle to market. Duh.
In the interests of peace, I will quite happily cease and desist in this thread and leave you newer guys to your own devices. No skin off my nose!
Bartok is like a weird combination of a guy with lots of experience that knows what he's talking about, aaand a ridiculous product shill that will fully endorse something that sucks because he has some sort of vested interest in it. It's weird, lol. There's good parts you can pick and choose out of his reviews, but best to take them as a whole with a grain of salt.
I dunno guys. I am very skeptical about anything new and this includes Mk3. But why are you picking on Bartok? He disclosed his relationship to SAI, and then provided us technical preview. I am thankful for that even though in some of this conclusions I'm either not agreeing or very skeptical. I trust either my personal experience or representative sample of feedback from hundreds of testers.
It's pretty obvious for me that an adult person can separate facts presented by pictures and technical information about the rifle from the conclusions of the reviewer. Take the facts, CONSIDER reviewer's conclusions and MAKE YOUR OWN.
I don't understand why you're asking Bartok to change his opinion, just because you don't agree with it? You expect it be better/in line with your expectations? He might be wrong or right - how does it matter anyway? It's other person opinion, don't rely on it, get your own based on the collected facts and your existing knowledge and experience.
It's pretty obvious for me that an adult person can separate facts presented by pictures and technical information about the rifle from the conclusions of the reviewer. Take the facts, CONSIDER reviewer's conclusions and MAKE YOUR OWN.
I don't understand why you're asking Bartok to change his opinion, just because you don't agree with it? You expect it be better/in line with your expectations? He might be wrong or right - how does it matter anyway? It's other person opinion, don't rely on it, get your own based on the collected facts and your existing knowledge and experience.
It’s more than just an opinion when the person acts as spokesperson for the company? Is it not?
I’ve had EE dealings and have followed Bartoks posts since 2013 and find his posts interesting and informative and I have tons of respect for the man.
But most people will buy this based on his opinion,which I find a bit to enthusiastic… lol
I mean if it was that easy to fix and at a $1000 less,3 years later, what do that say about the company involved?
Also everyone who bought the first gen for $3000 are now out 50% ,which should have been corrected the first go around.
But hey,at least we got another piston gun to choose from
I’ve had EE dealings and have followed Bartoks posts since 2013 and find his posts interesting and informative and I have tons of respect for the man.
But most people will buy this based on his opinion,which I find a bit to enthusiastic… lol
I mean if it was that easy to fix and at a $1000 less,3 years later, what do that say about the company involved?
Also everyone who bought the first gen for $3000 are now out 50% ,which should have been corrected the first go around.
But hey,at least we got another piston gun to choose from
