XCR-L, can it be built better?
- Thread starter Zeroed-In
- Start date
Lol, I haven't checked CGN for a couple days and I missed 4 pages of entertainment in this thread alone. I better check more often.
I know good for a few chuckles eh, but wow did this thread go sideways fast. I mean come on guys nobody should be arguing that a XCR can compare in accuracy, reliability or weight to a decent AR, it's just a fact that it can't (sorry cal9mm).
As the OP my post was to find a means to somehow modify a XCR so that the advantages or superior attributes of an AR would be reduced through the expenditure of funds. The only reason to justify this expenditure of funds was so that the XCR rifle (with it's improved attributes) could be enjoyed with NR status, because that is the only advantage it has on any decent AR like a Daniels Defense or better. However after the smoke clears it would just be like putting an expensive Porsche turbo wing, wide body flares and spoiler kit onto your average Volkswagen, you'd fool a few, but your left with a basic grocery getter not a performance machine (please Volkswagen fans do not take offence).
A premium AR is a race car and a reliable one at that, but like a race car it's not allowed out with the general public on the open roads sort'a speak. By comparison a XCR is a decent grocery getting pick-up truck (if an unnecessarily over priced one) and that's okay for some, but preaching/arguing it's a high quality performance machine in stock form capable of beating a race car isn't helping anyone and for those who know better it's just fanning the flames. Now I know a thing or two about modifying vehicles for performance and rest assured a pick up truck can be made into a race car, but the cost and time is always prohibitive. To add to that you will forever be left with a pick-up truck underneath w/o ever reaching the performance potential of a true race car. Yet the open road would be attainable and there's something to be said about that, but please don't compare lap times between the two, because they won't even be close just like the performance comparisons of a quality AR versus a XCR.
So for me personally I'm back to where I started knowing full well a XCR could never satisfy my needs for a high performance semi-auto. rifle (I just needed to come to my senses). Where does that leave me, well for now it leaves me stuck at the range telling everyone I know to buy an AR in the hopes that by increased numbers of Rpal AR owners we can change the AR status to NR permanently just like they used to be.
To those that offered intelligent insights thank you.
To those that didn't thanks for the laughs, you know who you are...
Last edited:
Want one? Plus shipping from me to you, figure $35 I'll grab one tomorrow. Let me know. To clarify $2535 to you.
I know good for a few chuckles eh, but wow did this thread go sideways fast. I mean come on guys nobody should be arguing that a XCR can compare in accuracy, reliability or weight to a decent AR, it's just a fact that it can't (sorry cal9mm).
As the OP my post was to find a means to somehow modify a XCR so that the advantages or superior attributes of an AR would be reduced through the expenditure of funds. The only reason to justify this expenditure of funds was so that the XCR rifle (with it's improved attributes) could be enjoyed with NR status, because that is the only advantage it has on any decent AR like a Daniels Defense or better. However after the smoke clears it would just be like putting an expensive Porsche turbo wing, wide body flares and spoiler kit onto your average Volkswagen, you'd fool a few, but your left with a basic grocery getter not a performance machine (please Volkswagen fans do not take offence).
A premium AR is a race car and a reliable one at that, but like a race car it's not allowed out with the general public on the open roads sort'a speak. By comparison a XCR is a decent grocery getting pick-up truck (if an unnecessarily over priced one) and that's okay for some, but preaching/arguing it's a high quality performance machine in stock form capable of beating a race car isn't helping anyone and for those who know better it's just fanning the flames. Now I know a thing or two about modifying vehicles for performance and rest assured a pick up truck can be made into a race car, but the cost and time is always prohibitive and you will forever be left with a pick-up truck underneath w/o ever reaching the performance potential of a true race car. Yet the open road would be attainable and there's something to be said about that, but please don't compare lap times between the two, because they won't even be close just like the performance comparisons of a quality AR versus a XCR.
So for me personally I'm back to where I started knowing full well a XCR could never satisfy my needs for a high performance semi-auto. rifle (I just needed to come to my senses). Where does that leave me, well for now it leaves me stuck at the range telling everyone I know to buy an AR in the hopes that by increased numbers of Rpal AR owners we can change the AR status to NR permanently just like they used to be.
To those that offered intelligent insights thank you.
It's a fact. And you already knew the AR was superior? Why did you ask a stupid question again? To enjoy a NR that has been modified with attributes of an AR, so that it approaches the AR's glorious superiority? Isn't that an XCR? If you want to re barrel it then re barrel it. It isn't gonna do much for improving accuracy though, even with a modified retention method and the best barrel god himself created, the piston will influence the barrel harmonics and still interfere in bench rest accuracy. Sorry.
Last edited:
Yes absolutely. If you can get me a brand new xcr, With taxes and shipping included (like andrew3081 said) to my door from a dealer for 2500 I have emt waiting!
And for that to happen you'd have to find a brand new xcr for around $2175 before taxes. Why don't you and Andrew let us know where you guys are getting your brand new xcr's cheaper then what the importer sells them for?
Last edited:
Last edited:
I paid $2650, brand new through armtac.
I was just picking an ar at the same price point.
It all depends on what that nr status is worth to you.
Hell, I'm at $4000 on my acr now, but it's as close as you can get to combining the xcr's control layout with the ar's accuracy.
Mauser GDog
CGN frequent flyer
Pretty sure those 4x designs haven't changed much in a long time, although admittedly, I don't know squat about the Tavor.
Mine was $2497 shipped to my door. You need to move to a better province.
I know right? factionrr talks as if Ontario is the only province in Canada. 14% GST/PST - LOL - suckers!
Anyone that lives in those greedy provinces that needs a middle man to purchase a rifle in Alberta where we only pay 5% let me know. If you think that you can save money after shipping costs I'll gladly purchase and ship it to you. I accept EMT and won't charge any commission. You pay for the rifle, the tax and my actual shipping costs and it'll be on it's way. I ship expedited with insurance but if you don't want insurance that's up to you.
I'll even take it out and break it in for you if you want
I'll even take it out and break it in for you if you want
Eugene stoner's armalite rifle: AR10, Ar10t, SASS, Ar15, m16, m16a1, m16a2, m16a3, m16a4, xm177, CAR, m4, m4a1, spr, cqbr, c7, c7a1, c7a2, c8, c8a1, c8a2, c8a3, c8fthb, c8sfw, hk416 Those are the official models (and prolly missed a few inbetween) and not taking into account new finishes on market, improved parts like bcm and rainier cocking handles, barrels, aluminum alloy changes (6061t6 and 7075t6) and now polymer (not an improvement), forged or billet ect. Some improvements are cosmetic, some utilitarian, some are as simple as fire control differences, or hand guard colour. some are major improvements like a forward assist. Barrel materials and procedures, And piston driven models. Ect. Prolly missed some, these are off the top of my head.
Mikhail kalashnikov's automat kalashnikova: ak 47, aks, akm, rpk, ak74, ak101, ak103, ak12, ak107/108, I think it's at ak109 now. And a plethora of models inbetween. Each model built on the next to modernize and improve.
M14: m14, m14e1, m14e2, socom, m14 DMR, m21, m25. And more models in between. Again all built on and improved.
Tavor: Gen 1, Gen 2, Gen 2.5, ctar, x95.
Swiss/sig: 550, 551, 552, 553, 556
Alex robinson's XCR: variants from A to what are we at now K? L?
Overall the designs have remained the same, however small improvements are still improvements, and are continued to be improved upon today with new manufacturing methods and materials. Like I said, this is just scratching the surface.
I haven't gotten into calibers or individual companies claiming Thier rifle is the most tactical because it's black and another company making theirs darker and therefore it's more tacticaller then the previous, ect. People don't even know what that word means anymore because of marketing scams and misrepresentation, same with "milspec".
Last edited:
Now I never said you made a stupid comment even though your posts prove it. Sure I knew the AR is superior to a XCR who doesn't. My hope was to learn from those that have done it, that is improved the accuracy of a XCR through an improved barrel and barrel retention method. I thought about re-barreling a XCR and the reason for my original post was to determine if it was even possible to do, or was that to difficult for you to understand. Now are you touting the re-barreling as not improving accuracy from your own attempt to do so, or just guesstimating from your vast firearms knowledge. As you would be wrong, re-barreling a XCR can and does make a big improvement to the accuracy as I've learned from the actual completed modification using a Herron Arms SS barrel.
Bingo
So I'm stupid based on my posts? How so? Please elaborate.
You thought about re barreling an xcr and if it could be done. Yet you learned that it can be done? Thru experience? With a huge difference in accuracy? So why are you droning on about this, especially with such significant results, that you have personally experienced?
I'm actually applying common sense based on personal knowledge. When the massive chunk of metal in the gas tube begins it's rearward travel. It's rattling around inside the gas tube, those harmonics are transferred thru the gas regulator and into the barrel before said bullet leaves the barrel. The faction of a second it takes for the bullet to leave the barrel from the gas port, the piston has already begun traveling rearward with bolt carrier and bolt. in a gas gun, the bullet has left or is leaving by the time the gas travels through the gas port down the gas tube and begins rearward movement of the bolt carrier and unlocking the bolt.
Please define a big improvement in accuracy? And please reread my response, I never said it wouldn't improve accuracy, just not to bench rest standards. Correct me if I'm wrong, but "isn't gonna do much" is not "won't", correct?
Last edited:
Mauser GDog
CGN frequent flyer
Agreed.
I'm pretty sure most of those variants you've listed are virtually the same rifles fitted with different task specific accessories, barrel lengths/weights, stock styles or optics.
And each variant improves on the other, let's look at the m16 family shall we. The original AR15/m16 had tri shaped forearm, light barrel, no case deflector, no forward assist, no ejection port cover, iron sights, was made with 6061t6, and wasn't issued with a cleaning kit because it didn't need to be cleaned. And thru evolution, is now the rifle it is today and more. And continues to evolve. Just like any weapon system, No system is perfect.
Now before you say that was a long time ago, the current service rifle's mid-life upgrade was done mid 2000's.
Last edited:
Can't find and don't care enough to search...
