VZ58: Optics, sights & mounts. update sept

[Curtton]

VZ58: Optics, sights & mounts.

I gathered all the information and pictures and organized them in one thread to share it with you .

you are welcome to post your pics as long as they are NOT FROM CYBERSPACE .

if I used your pics please maintain them on your photo album , thank you for your contribution . if you wish to edit them , you can PM me .

1.MOUNTS

a.SCOUT MOUNT
pros: -solid mount , metal to metal contact.
-non rust, aluminum.
-average difficulty to install .
-low mount.
-no drilling.

cons: -replaces rear sight leaf .
-needs to remove rail for cleaning (got a solution below).

helpful hints: once you are happy with your set up , use blue locktite on the lower screws, also scrape the paint where the lower screws meet the block so you would have a metal to metal contact and not have paint in between .

top HG was modified to allow the removal of the HG without disturbing the scout mount rail thus retaining zero.
notice you can barely see the mod on the HG .

modification: i used a dremel to removed the bridge that connects the two brackets that holds the locking pin, then i hand file , there is still plenty of strength left also i file a bit of the front tabs .

Note: On how to remove the leaf and install a scout mount, read section 8.

After great amount of interest and customer feed back on producing an economical mount for the VZ/CZ platform. We have come to the simple but yet effective design that should make mounting a red dot optic a breeze. Not only will you not have to remove the rail to clean your rifle. It also makes mounting & aim you CQB optic's an easy to do as 1,2,3. The best part of this soon to be released optic platform is that if your a traditional shooter and enjoy your wood furniture and just want something that is easier to aim with the the original iron sight's. Or your tactical operator that needs extra space to mount your thermals or NVG's. Here is a solution that we have design just for you.

(*Tested to fit with all red dot platform's. Some of witch are not shown here.)

E.T.A.: June, 2011.
Price: Yet to be determined.

Also looking forward to hearing what you say here at the CGN community on what you may like or dislike about this mount platform before it is released.

b.SIDE MOUNT

to mount a russian side mount (SVD type) , you need to use a bracket bcos the receiver walls of a CZ are too thin , mounting the bracket for the scope or a red dot is the same , only difference is the length of the bracket.

for scope the bracket needs to be longer due to the eye relief and the for the red dot it can be shorter , mounted closer to the rear . see how to install a bracket below in the section 2 "mounts for scope, drill and tap" .

left: SVD mount , right: AK mount

We have just received a few scope mounts, see picture below. We don’t have a CSA rifle left in house to offer it to but I believe it will place the scope over the bore axis. Mount appears to be well made and has a sturdy case deflector included. Scope rail is approx 4.25 inches long .

Part # CSA-SM-001

NCStar AK side mount for existing rail on CSA.

i bought my mount from hical.ca , its inexpensive and yet , the quality is not bad , i was quite pleased with it. ncstar is light in weight, it is centered vertically. the mounts sits high enuff to clear for the removal of the carrier also it doesnt hinder my view when im using the iron sight.

the ncstar uses 3 screws instead of a QR lever which does take some time to install it but its not a biggy to me since i had plans of leaving it on permanently . the 3 points contact ensures the mount is held in solidly.

please note , any mount for CSA rail will require you to remove the factory folder before installation , lucky for me the swivel ring on the galil is set deep enuff that i didnt have to remove it.

CSA VZ58 Fixed Scope Mount - Made in Canada - MSRP$80.30.

DRILL AND TAP

curtton:
top right pic. for POSP SVD side mount, due to the eye relief, the scope had to be mounted partly beside the mag well and also bcos the receiver walls are thin , i had to attached a 1/4" metal bracket (6" x 7/8") by drill & tap , i placed the 3 allen caps heads ( #8-32x1/2" ) on the inside of receiver , they are located 3rd , 6th & 7th hole from the left. do not put them higher cos it will interfere with the striker or carrier movements (ignore hole #4 , not needed to hold the mount , 3 is enuff).

then i attached the rail to the bracket by drilling and tapping 3 holes (another way is to weld the rail to the bracket) , on the rail its located in the 1st , 2nd & 4th hole from the left or 1st , 2nd & 5th on the bracket .

bottom left pic. i flip the bracket over so you can see the front shaded part where i grinded off 1 mm to compensate for a small rise on the receiver also i had to file and drill holes to accommodate the protruding axis pins (see below pic between 5th and 6th hole).

bottom right pic. note: the screws heads on the rail below had to file down.


helpful hints : drill and tap the first hole thru both the receiver and bracket, screw it together, it will help prevent the pieces from moving before you drill the rest . repeat this process with the rail and the bracket.
always clamp pieces together before tapping and screwing , otherwise you will end up with gaps and that will make your mount wobbly .

note: location of the screws are not always by choice, avoid drilling thru the serial numbers or having the screw heads hinder the movements of the carrier, striker and trigger .

After serious deliberation I have finally decided to scope my CZ858.
Rail: http://interammo.com/shop/product_info.php?cPath=27&products_id=67
Scope: POSP 4x24M

I might post a detailed write-up but for now just a few pics.

Installation was VERY EASY! No threading involved and the rail itself makes it virtually impossible to install it in a wrong place.

You still need to watch for the alignment with the barrel and preferred elevation adjustment range. I've installed mine to have 300m chevron centered, not 100m. That way I'm OK to at least 600m with 4x24M POSP.

Range report to follow.

OK, here we go...

s>

CUSTOM SIDE MOUNT

I decided to share my invention with other VZ owners. I have designed a side scope rail mounting system that doesn't permanantly alter your rifle. No drilling in the receiver whatsoever. You are free to copy my design for your own use if you wish so but for mass manufacturing talk to me first please !!!
I tested it at the range and it surpassed my expectations. Very solid platform.

hutchster:

c. HAND GUARD MOUNT

NEA HG mount.

Infratek with Comp M2

NEA with Comp M2

I don't see any need to have a different stock configuration for either of these setups. So you get a chin weld with a higher setup, no big deal. Honestly, I like the heads-up config better, but I really wanted a lower rail. The Infratek restricts your sight picture using irons and there's no way you can come close to co-witnessing.

I've used both setups successfully on the same rifle, even though there has to be at least an inch difference in height.

For my purposes, the NEA design is superior and it's easier to install.

OR you can do this:

Well, it's the same mount in the same location. The only difference is that the rail, being contained within the handguard's limits, sits about 3/16" lower. The rail is a standard Weaver rail with a small base radius that fits the VZ's handguard tube perfectly. I drilled four holes and tapped them with 6-48 threads to get enough purchase in the sheetmetal channel. I am fabricating a small part that will be placed underneath the channel and add some more thickness for the screws. As it is, however, it is already very solid. Perhaps putting some Loctite Red will be a good prevention measure.
Having to find a way of fixing the handguard side panels, maybe I'll extend that small sheeetmetal part to form a retainer.
More to come!

I just got my BC tact hand guards in the mail today and figured id post some pics etc etc for anyone thats on the fence about these.Im a s**tty photographer ,so the pictures dont do these H/G's justice

was so excited i dint even bother to take of the NEA barell clamp and stock adapter.

I gotta say i really, really like these hand guards.It does kind of suck that co witness is not an option, but for me thats not really a big issue.Overall the quality is excellent the finish is excellent and IMO these are 1 of the best looking H/Gs on the market.Im going to the range this weekend and will do a full review then .But i dont anticipate any surprises,these things are solid as a rock.Hopefully they will remain that way and RTZ will be a non issue like the NEA H/G set.Did i mention i really like these hand guards?

B.C. Tactical Handguard Set

CNC From A Solid Piece Of 6061 Aircraft Grade Aluminum

Side

2 Tone Colour

Top

Bottom

Colour Set's will be Anodized Black but OD Green & Khaki Tan could be available if there is enough interest.

These handguards are revolutionary in the fact that they will allow you to use your original OEM part's and will work just like your original OEM handguard set. Except for the "Pressure Fit" capability that will enhance your groups and will also allow you the ease of cleaning and plus the enjoyability of "Return To Zero" features. These handguards are a must for anyone who wants who want to mount a red dot optic, long eye relief scope or any other products that require precise aiming features on the VZ 58/CZ 858 platform. The mil-spec 1913 rails allow you the endless mounting capabilities of multiple product's from light's & lasers to forward mounting grips & bi-pods.

d. BARREL MOUNT

Detail view of NEA barrel clamp:

I installed the rail and home and moved the optic to it at the range. After installing the optic I test fired and noticed it was stringing the rounds vertically. Make sure you have the rail clamp tightened down properly and Loc-tited or this may happen to you, too. Once installed properly the POI did not waver.

I did not have the time to fire more than about 50 rounds through the rifle with the optic on the rail, so it didn't get very hot. The clamp was no hotter than the handguard so I don't anticipate any heat-related issues with the optic. Time will tell.

I think the options available to Canadian VZ shooters are really quite amazing. It's not hard to create the perfect rifle for you.

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e.CUSTOM PISTOL GRIP MOUNT

I designed it for the user to be able to view the iron sights without obstruction and also to be just like the fixed to the receiver mount except no gunsmithing required. All that you do is place the Fab pistol grip mount in between the to forks and attach the pistol grip normally. the optic will be mounted directly over the rear cover guard so your optics will not get hit by spent brass. Also I wanted to be able to field strip the firearm without removing the mount, so zeroing isn't an issue. If you look at the picture that shows the bottom of the mount you will also notice a notch taken out on one side. This is for the safety to be on and off without any interference.

f.TOP RAIL MOUNT

supplied by corwin arms.

Done.. The only modification required to attach this to any VZ now would be to remove the rear sight and rear cover pin and slap it on.

Made a bracket that straddles the dust cover & receiver. The rear pin was replaced with an allen bolt that passes through and pulls it all together. I still kept the forward sight spring to provide for-up pressure, and it still pivots upward for disassembly.

3 points of contact now vs. 2. the only thing I was real worried about was it taking a lateral hit and busting off. Not now.

My original plan was to use a longer rail and tie it to the forward handguard so it's one solid mounting platform, I may do that in the future.

Here are the details: rear sight leaf TIG welded to the front of a 3/8" square
steel bar. Deflector TIG welded at about 50 degrees a little bit to the left of the bolt carrier crest since some of the spent casings like to fly straight up.
Adjustable screw at the rear bottom of the bar sits on the receiver cover and does two things : levels the bar and keeps the receiver cover nice and tight.
Installation and removal takes less than 15 seconds.

.

g. NEA REAR MOUNT

Here's a few pics of the new NEA items.

The stock adaptor is one piece and mounts with a single bolt to the receiver. It uses an AR receiver end plate to index the stock in the correct orientation.

With Yankee Hill BUIS front and rear. When NEA releases it's barrel clamp rail you'll be able to mount both BUIS on fixed points.

This looks like the best method of mounting a regular scope on to a CZ 858 rifle. This is only the protoype, the production rail will extend to the end of the top cover. Watch here for more details.

4.OPTIC: RED DOTS

As for the picture...

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VZ-58
John Willis Single Point Sling
Eotech 516
Surefire G2

...And the Fab Polymer Railed fore-end

Here's mine with and without a vfg.

In order to hold zero I replaced the top cover take down pin with a wingnut and screw to attach it tightly with no play. Hopefully I'll get some non-corrosive ammo in the near future so I needn't take the handguard off everytime I go to clean it and lose my zero.

I've got both Hakko panoramic sights and they're both very nice with fine reticles. The replica I once had was complete junk.

I have. The Kobra sight is high and some shooters did complain it was not as low as an Eotech for example. But for me, it does not bother me because I shoot with both eyes open anyways and I don't have my cheek on the stock.

Here's some pics of mine that I have done up. I think it needs a better mount for the reflex sight. I find on the forward handgaurd it does not hold zero. If you remove the handgaurd for cleaning the gas system it looses zero agian. Anyone know of a better mount?

Other than that it is a great shooter. I have the quad rail forward handgaurds, muzzle break, folding stock. Jackie Six doctor optic clone reflex sight. The muzzle break makes a significant difference on recoil and accuracy with double taps. I find Im shooting this rifle more than my AR.......not going to say its taking over as my favorite, but it definately has my interest.

I have thought of adding a forward vertical grip, but I find that just infront of the magazine is an excellent place to hold the rifle for balance. Do you guys think the forward grip is worth while?

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My Vz58

Finished a couple mods to the cz. The site is a "q-point". Its good in theory (size, function, basic design), but doesn't hold 0. I can tap it with my finger, and its off. Problem seems to be a poorly designed pivot for windage. Can anybody suggest a sight similar to this, but not overly expensive? I have a bushnell XLP, but find it a bit bulky looking.

I also finished my 858. minus the brake that marstar is taking forever to send out.

This is the only other picture I have. My smith just cut the rail to fit then drilled and tapped it...according to him it was a fairly simple job. You can see whare the rail sticks out on either side of the scope mount, and the screws that attach it to the receiver. The 58 has a bunch of metal taken out (I believe they call it a lightening cut) in that area, I assume to reduce weight...the edges of these cuts are rounded and that is why the edges of the rail have to be champhered to fit.

(HG mount are from FAB)

(aimpoint micro H-1 and tact HG mount from http://www.vz58.net/)

Here's a few more with my Dr. optic. Hopefully I can get to the range with it this week.

The Dr.Optic and Trijicon versions claim to be parallax free, wheras the (burris)FastFire is only free up to 50m (but it's half the cost so you gets what you pay for). If I were going to spend more I'd love a Micro Aimpoint.

I am liking the barrel mount option but it's an area that isn't being explored too much.

I've already ordered a new rail, one that I feel will add a more "Factory" look rather than the crude mount I've created.

There is a lot of trial and error with sight heights and rail combinations; hopefully more people will start trying different combos and we can find out what works and what doesn't

I feel it solves the following:
-No removing/re-installing of the optic
-Solid platform (metal on metal)
-Being able to keep the iron sights
-Being able to see the irons as well as the dot (Co-Witness)
-Proper cheek weld for both RDS and irons
Are there any cons?

alittle heavy, but i like the Kobra.

(eotech)

Vortex SPARC on NEA cantilever mount for me.

Bushnell Trs-25

she's just about done. just looking for an ambidextrous bolt carrier and off to 3 gun

Range of red dot = whatever you like. I shoot at 200 & 300m gongs with mine. At 100m it's about a 4-5" gun with surplus ammo. On the brightest sunniest day I can still keep both eyes open and see it clear as a bell.

I had the Fabarm but changed out to the NEA/Neit metal one. My zero definitely changed with the plastic Fabarm. Have only shot it once with the metal one, retest is tomorrow or Sat. But the word is, this is definitely the way to go and that they retain zero well.

It's the Vortex StrikeFire ($189 WSS), in an ADM 68L low quick release mount (about $110, TSE).

5.OPTIC: SCOPES

6. STEEL PEEP SIGHT

Rauch Tactical VZ58 rear peep sight. These are designed for faster target acquisition with the VZ58 iron sight system. They replace the original rear sight and use the factory rear sight drum.

Material is 6061-T6 Aluminum with a black hard anodize finish.

pic by gomer_pyle of Raunch Tacitcal rear peep sight:

Note: On how to remove the leaf, read section 8.

Here's a couple pics of the FO front sight. The flash pic makes the FO look orange. The VZ front sight post has a milled out slot in the threaded portion. On the one I removed from my rifle it was about .1 mm wider in the center of the post than at the ends. I used a flat bladed screw driver to spread the milled out section of the NEA sight a corresponding amount. Fit is nice and snug.

If you don't have a front sight tool, which I don't, you can make one by Dremeling a appropriately sized slot in the end of a bolt. You can then use a wrench on the bolt head to turn the sight in or out.

7.DEFLECTORS

It doesn't look too good but it WORKS !!

i preferred this set up bcos it attaches to the rear sight leaf, the leaf is spring loaded so it absorb the vibration
from striking shell casing .

very easy to install, slide the elevation piece forward , hook the deflector then slide the elevation piece back ,
make sure its lock in , it took only 5 seconds to install .

top is the original SKS deflector, the bottom was mod to fit CZ858 , took a few min to mod.

the back tabs needed filing and bending inwards abit due to the rear sight of the CZ858 is narrower than the rear sight of the SKS.

Here's fews pics of my final set up on my cz. I put the mounting rail from Interammo, very well made and easy to install, possibly the best rail for side mounting, rock solid too! I made a heavy duty shell deflector with a piece of 14g steel and some flat black paint...may look crude but is built to last! The POSP scope is a very good setup for a CZ, hold zero very well, sturdy and clear image and i like the reticle too.

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[/IMG]

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8. How to remove the sight leaf.


If you bought a scout mount from marstar or wolverine , the box is marked for VZ but the instruction sheet inside are for a SKS, altho the actual installation of the mount on a CZ858 and the SKS are the same , the removal of the rear sight ladder are slightly different and it has cause some difficulties . hopefully some day (maybe it have already) the instruction sheet will be corrected.

1. do your safety check.

2. secure your rifle on a vise , if no vise then have another person hold the rifle firmly but do not have their hands near the rear sight.

3. i prefer to use a sharp tool with a handle but you may use the "L" shape front sight adjusting tool that comes in the cleaning kit.

4. place the tool in the gap which is in front of the ladder , press in hard to depress the leaf spring below the ladder and with the other hand push down on the ladder and slide it toward the rear.

there is another technique to removing the ladder, when the tool is in the gap , use the sharp tool as a lever and push down and lever it towards the rear , the ladder should pop out , if using this technique then i would suggest you keep your other hand away from the rear sight cos the tool tend to slip.

5. do not remove the leaf spring , it should be in place when installing the scout mount.

6. heres a pic just to illustrate what it looks like without the spring in place , note how the ladder are held in place.

7. pic of the scout mount on the rifle.

8. should you want to remove the scout mount and reinstall the ladder then the procedure are reverse .

helpful hints. you may want to scrape the paint off where the screws are in contact with the rear sight block, as for you would want a metal to metal contact and not have paint in between, also its a good idea to secure the screws with loctite , once you are zeroed in.[/QUOTE]


9. ADJUSTING STANDARD SIGHTS

adjusting sights for VZ/CZ858 would be the same as the SKS.
http://www.surplusrifle.com/sks/sights/hs.asp
[YOUTUBE]sv0VNRe4wIk[/YOUTUBE]

10. SIGHT ADJUSTING TOOL.

We have a number of Magna-Matic's sight tools coming in to the store. http://shop.neitdesigns.com

They adjust the elevation of the post as well as azmuth of the drum. They are compatible with the AK, SKS and VZ 58.

See http://www.magna-matic-defense.com/AKFST-AK-47-Front-Sight-Tool-p/akfst.htm for info.

as you can see this new tapco sight tool is built strong , thicker at the "U" and the opposing arm , also the milled cut (pen pointing) has been shorten leaving more metal .

VZ58 family.
Latest to join the VZ58 family are CSA and FSN. check out the differences below.

a. wolverine imported Česká Zbrojovka CZ858, painted bluish/gray finish, comes with complete accessories kit of 4 mags, pouch, cleaning kit, sling and a bayo.

1. CZ858-2 tactical, non-res , 18.75" non-chrome.

2. CZ858-4 tactical, restricted , 15.5" chrome.

b. marstar imported CZ Hermex CZH2003, painted bluish/gray finish, comes with complete accessories kit. rifles nolonger available.

3. CZH2003 VZ58L (long barrel), non-res , approx 18" chrome.

4. CZH2003 VZ58S (short barrel), restricted , 15.5" chrome.

c. wolverine imported Czech Small Arms CSA SA-VZ58 sporter, painted black finish, carrier tabbed, side rail, comes with 2 mags, cleaning kit and sling.

5. CSA SA-VZ58 5.56 rifle, non-res , 18.75" non-chrome , painted black, side rail, skeleton stock.

6. CSA SA-VZ58 5.56 carbine, restricted, 11.75" non-chrome, painted black, side rail, folder.

7. CSA SA-VZ58 7.62 carbine, restricted, 11.75" chrome , painted black, side rail, folder.

d. marstar imported Novohradský FSN, blued plum/black finish, comes with 4 mags, pouch, cleaning kit and sling.

8. FSN-01, restricted , 15.5" chrome, nickel steel gas block.

9. FSN-01F (folder), restricted, 15.5" chrome, folder.

10. FSN-01W (wood), restricted, 15.5" chrome, FH.

11. FSN-01K (krink), restricted, 11" chrome , FH, folder.

e. north sylva co. imported Czech Small Arms CSA SA-VZ58 sporter, comes with 2 mags, cleaning kit, sling and CD.

12. CSA SA-VZ58 5.56 rifle, non-res , 18.6" non-chrome, black, red furniture. no rail & brake.

[/QUOTE]

13. CSA SA-VZ58 5.56 carbine, res, 11.8" non-chrome, black blued finish, folder, scope mount and muzzle brake.

Sa vz. 58 Sporter Carbine .223 Rem technical specification:
Caliber .223 Rem (5.56 x 45 mm)
Muzzle velocity 790 - 830 m/s (2591 - 2723 f/s)
Number of grooves in barrel 4
Twist of the rifling 1 : 7
Overall length of rifle with stock extended 755 mm
Overall length of rifle with stock folded 545 mm
Barrel length 300 mm
Length of sight line 265 mm
Extent of rear sight from 100 to 800
Width of rifle 59 mm
Height of rifle with magazine 170 mm
Practical rate of fire 40 výstřelů /min.
Maximum range of fire 1,800 m
Lethal effect of projectile up to 1,400 m
Weight of rifle (without magazine) 2.97 kg
Weight of rifle with loaded magazine 3.48 kg
Weight of empty magazine 0.15 kg
Weight of full magazine 0.51 kg
Trigger pull 2.5 - 2.7 kg (24.5 - 26.5 N)


14. CSA SA-VZ58 5.56 super short, restricted, 7.5" non-chrome, black blued finish , folder, scope mount and muzzle brake.

Sa vz. 58 Sporter COMPACT .223 Rem technical specification:
Caliber .223 Rem (5.56 x 45 mm)
Muzzle velocity 675 - 685 m/s (2214 - 2247 f/s)
Number of grooves in barrel 4
Twist of the rifling 1 : 7
Overall length of rifle with stock extended 645 mm
Overall length of rifle with stock folded 435 mm
Barrel length 190 mm
Length of sight line 155 mm
Extent of rear sight from 100 to 500
Width of rifle 59 mm
Height of rifle with magazine 170 mm
Practical rate of fire 40 výstřelů /min.
Maximum range of fire 1,100 m
Lethal effect of projectile 1,100 m
Weight of rifle (without magazine) 2.75 kg
Weight of rifle with loaded magazine 3.26 kg
Weight of empty magazine 0.15 kg
Weight of full magazine 0.51 kg
Trigger pull 2.5 - 2.7 kg (24.5 - 26.5 N)


15. CSA SA-VZ58 7.62 non-res , 18.6" . no rail & brake. earlier model not chromed later model chromed. pic to come.

16. CSA SA-VZ58 7.62 carbine, restricted, 11.8" chrome , black blued finish, folder.

Sa vz. 58 Sporter CARBINE 7.62 x 39 mm technical specification:
Caliber 7.62 x 39 mm
Muzzle velocity 670 - 700 m/s (2198 - 2296 f/s)
Number of grooves in barrel 4
Overall length of rifle with stock extended 755 mm
Overall length of rifle with stock folded 545 mm
Barrel length 300 mm
Length of sight line 265 mm
Extent of rear sight from 100 to 800 by 100 m
Width of rifle 59 mm
Height of rifle with magazine 170 mm
Practical rate of fire 40 shots/min.
Maximum range of fire 2,500 m
Lethal effect of projectile 2,500 m
Weight of rifle (without magazine) 2.97 kg
Weight of rifle with loaded magazine 3.65 kg
Weight of empty magazine 0.19 kg
Weight of full magazine 0.68 kg
Trigger pull 2.5 - 2.7 kg (24.5 - 26.5 N)


17. CSA SA-VZ58 7.62 super short, restricted , 7.5" chrome, black blued finish, folder, scope mount and muzzle brake.

Sa vz. 58 Sporter COMPACT 7.62 x 39 mm technical specification:
Caliber 7.62 x 39 mm
Muzzle velocity 560 - 570 m/s (1837 - 1870 f/s)
Number of grooves in barrel 4
Overall length of rifle with stock extended 645 mm
Overall length of rifle with stock folded 435 mm
Barrel length 190 mm
Length of sight line 155 mm
Extent of rear sight from 100 to 500 m
Width of rifle 59 mm
Height of rifle with magazine 170 mm
Practical rate of fire 40 shots/min.
Maximum range of fire 1,800 m
Lethal effect of projectile 1,800 m
Weight of rifle (without magazine) 2.75 kg
Weight of rifle with loaded magazine 3.43 kg
Weight of empty magazine 0.19 kg
Weight of full magazine 0.68 kg
Trigger pull 2.5 - 2.7 kg (24.5 - 26.5 N)

 

[suprathepeg]

Originally Posted by suprathepeg
There are only 3 places on the rifle that give you a solid consistant mounting position and thats the rear sight leaf, the barrel and the left side of the reciever. Since 90% of the rounds fired from 58/858 rifles are corrosive removing the upper hand guard for cleaning after a day of shooting is a must and for me this puts the hand guard mounts in question as there will always be some play although rifles will vary and the return to zero will bit a bit off although your milage may vary.

The scout mount replacing the rear sight leaf is a nice solid mount but its really only good for red dot types or possibly one of the mid eye relief scopes like the Burris or Leupold scout scope offerings. The drawbacks are limited magnified optics selection, you lose the irons so if the optic fails it kills your day and you have to modify the upper hand guard in order to clean the gas system. I have never used one on my 858 but have used one on my m44 and although solid, it did shift over time (there is a lot more recoil involved with the m44 so milage may vary). I'd take this option over an upper hand guard rail but thats just me.

A new and good idea is barrel mounted optics. For forward mounted red dots this is a great idea. It gives easy access to the gas system for cleaning and it is nice a solid. I like this idea better then upper hand guard options cause the mount is large enough can act as a strengthener and heat sink on the barrel. I'm working on a prototype mount now that should be easy to mount and stay solid although others have adapted other barrel mounts to their rifles and the idea is promising whatever path you choose.

The way the 58/858 is designed it lends itself best to the SVD type optics mounting for magnified optics. This system allows the shooter to retain the use of iron sights and the Russians have mounts with weaver rails or scope rings so you can mount pretty well any optic you want. Unfortunately the russian red dots are designed to be mounted closer to the eye then the POSPs so with the current side rail offerings once you commit to one eye relief you are kinda stuck there.

Another drawback is offset, the russian optics untill the last few years have pretty well all been left offset. My theory is that they did this so the shooter could always easily fall back on the iron sights if needed. Since we aren't likely to ever use our rifles in combat this is somewhat lost on most shooters. That said I'm left eye dominant and I can still comfortably use the SVD setup cause the rifle is rather thin. Almost every adaptation of the SVD mount rail that I've seen builds it out even further then is was deisgned to be on the SVD only making a small problem a bit worst. I think if I used some of the rifles I've seen on the wire I wouldn't find the positioning comfortable. Oh yea and the SVD rails on their own don't fit on the side of the rifle so you NEED to fabricate an adapter to make it work.

The real drawback is casing ejection; unlike the AK or SVD which eject to the right, the 58 ejects almost straight up (consensus is the 1:00 position) meaning that anything mounted above the ejection port like a scope gets hit with spent casings which can damage the scope.

If only somebody could make it better...

 

[Harold Manback]

I have a scout mount and a Bushnell Holo-sight. I want to take the Holo-sight off and use a handgun scope with my scout mount for deer hunting. Does anyone know if this will work? Will the objective still be in the way of the ejecting brass? Can anyone recommend a long eye relief scope that would work well.

 

[suprathepeg]

Maybe a 2x aimpoint would work and not get hammered by the ejecting rounds. I would stick with the dot though.

 

[saskcop]

Some very nice rigs here. How are these forward mounted rigs for holding zero?

 

[suprathepeg]

Some very nice rigs here. How are these forward mounted rigs for holding zero?

Read my previous post.

 

[DMcFaul]

Here's a one-piece machined (all steel) tri rail that I made that's a direct replacement for the bakelite portion of the upper handguard. It slides into and is tapped to the steel mount and fights tighter than a junior high prom date. I've noticed no appreciable loss of zero with this even with repeated removal of the handguard.

This mount still allows me to remove my RDS and use my iron sights which is quite important in a design for me.

I wasn't sold on the israli plastic-over-7.62x39 handguard idea, and was too impatient to see how the new metal mount faired so I made my own.

It's proved to be a excellent addition. I just need to get on making a lower guard to accompany it.

 

[obiwanbonjovi]

Here's a one-piece machined (all steel) tri rail that I made that's a direct replacement for the bakelite portion of the upper handguard. It slides into and is tapped to the steel mount and fights tighter than a junior high prom date. I've noticed no appreciable loss of zero with this even with repeated removal of the handguard.

This mount still allows me to remove my RDS and use my iron sights which is quite important in a design for me.

I wasn't sold on the israli plastic-over-7.62x39 handguard idea, and was too impatient to see how the new metal mount faired so I made my own.

It's proved to be a excellent addition. I just need to get on making a lower guard to accompany it.

looks very nice is it as heavy as it looks?

 

[DMcFaul]

looks very nice is it as heavy as it looks?

No, it's actually quite light. It's skeletonized. I'll have to throw up a end profile picture to show that later.

 

[Dr.Lector]

This is palinak's new rail. Aluminum billet. 4 rails.
Top rail is a see-thru with U-channel for the iron sights.
(I don't guarantee the pix will stay that way,
since they are on his server).

 

[Curtton]

• Unique lever locking mechanism to allow a quick detachable top half for easy cleaning.

paul is there a close up pic of the unique locking mechanism ?

 

[palinak]

will take some close up pics of how it locks etc.....including a short vid

 

[Stevo]

will take some close up pics of how it locks etc.....including a short vid

palinak,
Is the upper handguard available separately for those who don't want the fore-end?

 

[palinak]

At this time I just have sets..... with the next run I'll have extra uppers made.

cheers
P

 

[chopper 1]

How ?

At this time I just have sets..... with the next run I'll have extra uppers made.

cheers
P

How does the lower mount ? Pin or locking screw ?

 

[palinak]

You use the original cross pin to secure it in place and there is also a alan screw from the bottom that presses against the receiver body. It is a very precise fit.

The top piece locks in via a lever that pushes an oval lock above the piston into the rear housing. The oval lock is also tapered so it creates pressure between the front gas block and rear piston housing on the receiver. It sits on top of the front receiver sides and snug’s the housing preventing any lateral or vertical movement.

 

[chopper 1]

Very Nice -

You use the original cross pin to secure it in place and there is also a alan screw from the bottom that presses against the receiver body. It is a very precise fit.

The top piece locks in via a lever that pushes an oval lock above the piston into the rear housing. The oval lock is also tapered so it creates pressure between the front gas block and rear piston housing on the receiver. It sits on top of the front receiver sides and snug’s the housing preventing any lateral or vertical movement.

Much better than the old brugger clone - no front ferrule tension making groups rise - you can put a spacer shim at the front to control how much tension you need - will order a couple -- thanx

 

[palinak]

well I worked on these with the same Slovak company that provided the previous ones but as with the previous ones the price for these would have been out to lunch (I guess not thinking ahead mentality, charge as much as possible) .....therefore we did some minor improvements locally and manufactured them locally at a much more reasonable rate. They are superior to any other hand guard I have seen for the 58s

 

[hutchster]

well, after studiously examining curtton's tutorial on "cutting the bridge", i plunged in head first with the dremel.

it turned out to be a fairly simple procedure, and if i did it again, i'm sure i could have made it cleaner, but function over form wins the day

at left is the used spare i bought from wolverine (just in case i botched it) that i modified, and at right is my factory original clad in a fab defense handguard.

[/IMG]

here is a closer shot of my redneck chop skills

[/IMG]

when it came to the front tabs, i was unsure of how much material i should remove, so i took my time rechecking until it just snuck by.

[/IMG]

here is a side by side comparison of the front tabs.

[/IMG]

[/IMG]

so, for anyone hesitant to try this, don't worry, its simple
all you really need is a dremel with chop blades, and a file.

and with the scout scope rough mounted.

[/IMG]

 

[Deckard]

Good thread.