Norinco M14 Blew Up
- Thread starter Dogleg
- Start date
well..... after consulting the kuhnhaussen manual........ i'm gonna bet dimes for dollars this is one of two things
A) reloader error , nothin to do with powder charge, though personally from my readings 45 grns of 4895 is definately on the upper scale of a hot load for the m14. I would be looking at incorrect primer or incorrect primer seating depth.
B) Operator error, that rifle shows evident signs of cosmoline and i'm going to guess the bolt has crud in it, causing a stuck firing pin.
We can rule out a "slam fire" caused by hammer follow by asking this simple question... is the rear tang iof the firing pin intact? If it's broken off, it was a slam fire...... if not ..... we are now leaning 99% towards an out of battery fire..... see A and B above.
My comments aren't meant to stir the pot or belittle the guy posting this.
No one should feel hesitant or embarrassed to share thier catastrophies
we can all learn from this.
Reloaders...... there's all kinds of opinions, books and internet articles on how to reload for these rifles..... some are good, some are not.... some are out to lunch entirely.
IMR or H 4895 is standard fare for the m1 and m14 rifle, as practiced early on in the developement stages of this rifle.
Search the net, call brownells, or get a stateside buddy to order from fulton armory and send you..... the 30 cal service rifle shop manual by Jerry Kuhnhaussen, the difinitive work on what's safe and not safe when it comes to reloading for the m14. It has incredibly in depth info on this exact situation experience here in the start of this thread. I'm confident to say that you experienced a reloaded ammunition related or stuck firing pin related out of battery detonation. Will be interesting to read Savage's report on this rifle once he get's a chance to inspect her.
There's a lesson to be learned for everyone here..... READ THE STICKIES >>>> the threads at the toip of this battle rifle forum...... all that FREE info is there to ensure your #### does'nt fall off........
A) reloader error , nothin to do with powder charge, though personally from my readings 45 grns of 4895 is definately on the upper scale of a hot load for the m14. I would be looking at incorrect primer or incorrect primer seating depth.
B) Operator error, that rifle shows evident signs of cosmoline and i'm going to guess the bolt has crud in it, causing a stuck firing pin.
We can rule out a "slam fire" caused by hammer follow by asking this simple question... is the rear tang iof the firing pin intact? If it's broken off, it was a slam fire...... if not ..... we are now leaning 99% towards an out of battery fire..... see A and B above.
My comments aren't meant to stir the pot or belittle the guy posting this.
No one should feel hesitant or embarrassed to share thier catastrophies
we can all learn from this.Reloaders...... there's all kinds of opinions, books and internet articles on how to reload for these rifles..... some are good, some are not.... some are out to lunch entirely.
IMR or H 4895 is standard fare for the m1 and m14 rifle, as practiced early on in the developement stages of this rifle.
Search the net, call brownells, or get a stateside buddy to order from fulton armory and send you..... the 30 cal service rifle shop manual by Jerry Kuhnhaussen, the difinitive work on what's safe and not safe when it comes to reloading for the m14. It has incredibly in depth info on this exact situation experience here in the start of this thread. I'm confident to say that you experienced a reloaded ammunition related or stuck firing pin related out of battery detonation. Will be interesting to read Savage's report on this rifle once he get's a chance to inspect her.
There's a lesson to be learned for everyone here..... READ THE STICKIES >>>> the threads at the toip of this battle rifle forum...... all that FREE info is there to ensure your #### does'nt fall off........
That's just God sending you a message for shooting a Giraffe!
He took his time.
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The Sierra Manual Edition 5 has the Service Rifle data also.
I am not so sure of that it doesnt look like cosmoline it looks like wheel bearing grease or electrical contact grease .
I really enjoy this thread, If anything it has gotten people to think about there reloading practice which is great as there have been many posts on this subject and lots of misinformation as well has been posted in the past .Military Semi autos are a safe firearm to shoot However understanding the way the system operates and the proper maintenance is essential in keeping it safe operating condition.
Although the Norinco M305/M14S is a well built firearm I believe that the dealers have an obligation no duty to ensure what they are selling is safe and is in proper operating condition.Ensure the barrels are indexed properly and that the headspace is with in the parameters .It is not the buyers responsibilty to have there rifle checked after they buy it to make sure the it is in proper operating condition . These rifles are not sold as used surplus rifles but are sold as new rifles .
Hmm, now I'm somewhat worried about my loads for my M305. My SPEER #13 manual suggests 42-46gr of Varget w/ 168gr HPBT bullets, and specifically says for certain powders(Varget included) that its recommended for gas operated semi-auto match rifles. Hodgdon has the same numbers for .308win (no mention of gas rifles). I am loading 155gr HPBT bullets, which aren't in the Speer manual (150gr are listed @ 43-47gr). Hodgdon's website says 44-47gr varget for a 155HPBT. I loaded from 42-45gr in 50rounds. Nothing exploded after firing them.
Should I reduce my loads for the next batch of ammo? (say down to 42gr?)
Should I reduce my loads for the next batch of ammo? (say down to 42gr?)
Well, you certainly could reduce the next batch and see what it does to your accuracy...unless you loaded up and increased your accuracy already, and therefore know that reducing the load will negatively affect your accuracy.
In general I go with the least amount of powder that will give me an accurate round, in any gun. Why burn the extra money if you don't have to?
In general I go with the least amount of powder that will give me an accurate round, in any gun. Why burn the extra money if you don't have to?
Recieved the rifle letting it warm up it must have spent the entire trip in the back of a pickup truck
geesh i wish i could have a ring side seat for this autopsy hehehe don't often get to inspect a blown apart rifle for cause.
At least we have capable, and willing folks amongst us to inspect and report back. Keep us posted Savage
Afterwards I am going to have the reciever and bolt MPI tested for defects and Rockwell tested
Thanks DL. I could not tell what it was in the pick.
Pathfinder
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That will be interesting, I hope to hear from your findings.
Yeah I am REALLY interested to see what we find out here...
Thanks Dogleg for this thread, could be very informative for everyone and thankfully it didn't come at the cost of any of your fingers or other hard-to-replace factory items.
Thanks Dogleg for this thread, could be very informative for everyone and thankfully it didn't come at the cost of any of your fingers or other hard-to-replace factory items.
