I'm tired of hearing gun bashing because a hunting rifle won't shoot 1 or even 2 MOA. Who are we kidding? Shooting with only your feet on the ground, how many can honestly say they can shoot 2 MOA or less at 100yd/100M? This demands some honesty, witnesses are nice, but lets see the groups. I don't care if you are shooting a $10k custom or an SKS. 4 round groups (between 3 and 5, plus most rifles can hold 4 without reloading). My Savage 30-06 once (like I said, once) shot a 0.68MOA 4 rnd group at 200M off the bench. The best I have done off hand is 5 3/4" at 100M. I don't have pics of the O/H target so you folks will have to trust me;-) I'm off to work in a few days so it will be a 2 1/2 weeks until my next range visit to get a target for this thread. I am looking forward to celebrating the skill of great shooters, not their financial success.
Standing Offhand Challenge 100yd/100M 4rd groups Center Fire
- Thread starter emerson
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I'm tired of hearing gun bashing because a hunting rifle won't shoot 1 or even 2 MOA. Who are we kidding? Shooting with only your feet on the ground, how many can honestly say they can shoot 2 MOA or less at 100yd/100M? This demands some honesty, witnesses are nice, but lets see the groups. I don't care if you are shooting a $10k custom or an SKS. 4 round groups (between 3 and 5, plus most rifles can hold 4 without reloading). My Savage 30-06 once (like I said, once) shot a 0.68MOA 4 rnd group at 200M off the bench. The best I have done off hand is 5 3/4" at 100M. I don't have pics of the O/H target so you folks will have to trust me;-) I'm off to work in a few days so it will be a 2 1/2 weeks until my next range visit to get a target for this thread. I am looking forward to celebrating the skill of great shooters, not their financial success.Off hand means shooting off your hands, ie.without any other support(s).
Don't have any pics now of 100 yard stuff. Here's one of my better 200 yard off hand with .260 rem and 6.5 to 20 leup. Can I do it every time ? No.. but it happens often enough you wouldn't want to put your favourite bottle at the target line. As the previous poster said, silhouette shooting definitely helps. I shoot a minimum of 5k rounds of small bore and 2k of center fire per year..
Now THIS is more like it. Real life field style shooting, although I still use a rest for the longer shots in the field, be it a tree, rock, windfall, backpack or whatever. Still, most of my hunting shots were offhand while standing. Something I plan on practicing a whole lot more this year.
Off hand shooting is 90% shooter and 10% gun and IMO takes more practise to be consistant at than other types of shooting. Usually at this time of the year (late winter, early spring) I'm pretty pathetic at off hand shooting. Yesterday was a rare sunny day so I took my 270 win. out for a walk with me and fired 4 rounds off hand at a two foot square piece of plywood at roughly 200 yards....embarrassingly, I only hit it twice. Like the saying goes...know your limit and play within it.
Agree...
I particularly like to shoot off hand at moving targets...Have gotten very good at it over the years...Some clubs around me actually have a few competitions every year doing just that...I have outshot many a competent paper puncher in these competitions...These guys tear me a new one on the bench competition without breaking a sweat...Gotta be good at something!
I think you have it the right way around,can't eat paper.I think it's great that a lot of guys excel at bench shooting but good old fashioned off hand connecting on a target,especially one that's moving,is back to basics shooting.That's what I like to see.
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- Steel Town
I agree... this is the true test of shooting skills -- real world shooting!
After visiting with Ultramag this morning I slipped out to the club range to sight-in my Kimber .338 Win that I changed the rings and bases on last night. I also had to confirm the zero and CCB shot for another Kimber, that one a 7mm Select grade.
I thought I'd rip a couple groups, one with the .338 and another with an LSS 30-06 that I've fitted with a Shilen trigger and 10 shot quik clip conversion.
I thought I'd rip a couple groups, one with the .338 and another with an LSS 30-06 that I've fitted with a Shilen trigger and 10 shot quik clip conversion.
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Standing, unsupported with iron sights Hickock45 style. This takes a skill which is not available in "fine stores everywhere" in a form of optics, super grade match ammo, ballistic calculators and 100 pound cast iron machine to hold you rifle for you on a table.
Thats mighty fine offhand shooting there dogleg. Are you into the high power silhouette game by any chance?
After visiting with Ultramag this morning I slipped out to the club range to sight-in my Kimber .338 Win that I changed the rings and bases on last night. I also had to confirm the zero and CCB shot for another Kimber, that one a 7mm Select grade.
I thought I'd rip a couple groups, one with the .338 and another with an LSS 30-06 that I've fitted with a Shilen trigger and 10 shot quik clip conversion.
High Power silhouette is about dead around here. I used to shoot rimfire, and cowboy but mostly just bang my gongs with hunting rifles or set up my own rimfire silhouettes at my own range. I've been meaning to set up full size swingers at my place. Maybe this will be the year it happens.
The rimfire club doesn't do much anymore, but the target holders are still there and I haul my own targets. Sometimes just the spinners if I'm feeling lazy.
The different shooting discilpines are simply different and direct skill comparisons are moot. All too often, do we hear a bit of "snobery"... with off-hand / silhouette shooters feeling they are superior to F-class...who feel they are better than the LR Benchrest crowd...who belittle the Short BR guys...who claim that off-hand is a waste of time. I really don't understand, one group laying claim to being the best. The bottom line here is those who practice their style the most, are likely among the best shooters in that style. The bottom line for rifles, is that custom typically out performs factory. The bottom line for ammo is that tuned reloads usually out perform the stuff off-the-shelf.
I think that the OP has something here, he is just setting up the scope of the challenge a little off.
One person has mentioned the lack of practicality of groups and I agree (deer kill ones are 10" diameter roughly). The other thing is the standard definition of off hand means on two legs with no artificial supports (hunting sling wraps are normal).
Personally I practice sitting with shooting sticks and off hand as defined above. I can without issue go 10/10 on the 200yd gong with enough regularity that the cause of a miss is easily identified.
We could likely give this challenge some traction by saying show a 10" plate with 10 shots on it from offhand at 100yds and sitting (without sticks, bipods etc) at 200yds and go from there.
One person has mentioned the lack of practicality of groups and I agree (deer kill ones are 10" diameter roughly). The other thing is the standard definition of off hand means on two legs with no artificial supports (hunting sling wraps are normal).
Personally I practice sitting with shooting sticks and off hand as defined above. I can without issue go 10/10 on the 200yd gong with enough regularity that the cause of a miss is easily identified.
We could likely give this challenge some traction by saying show a 10" plate with 10 shots on it from offhand at 100yds and sitting (without sticks, bipods etc) at 200yds and go from there.
