Bush Pilot Revolver ?

So people seem to like semis and 357 or greater.

So what about 357 sig in a semi?
9mm barrels allow for cheaper practice, with a heavier hitter for practical use, and the advantages of a semi (lower weight, higher capacity). Penetration of this round with fmj is also comparable to 7.62x25, which is important on a bear...

Carried in a survival pack with the 9mm adapter would also make a decent survival firearm.

If I had a bush job requiring ATC I would be looking at this round.
 
Camp Cook said:
I second Ardents comment...

When packing a handgun all day power/weight should be considered that is why I feel my 4.25" SRH in 454 Casull is the most powerful/lightest all day day carry handgun available.

S&W 460/500 have the power I would prefer but they are far to heavy to pack around all day the Desert Eagle is in the same category too me...

:popCorn:
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I third Ardents comments. DE is a toy for fun only. Not something i want to relie on in the bush.
 
I agree. I was joking around, trying to be a smart A$$.

Being serious, I would get a 44 mag ruger redhawk with 4.2 inch barrel. Stainless, so its less maitenance and cleaning. I would pick a 44 magnum over a 357 magnum because if you ever do need it for that once in a lifetime situation, it is nice to have a little bit of extra knock down power.

If there was a good deal on a 357 magnum then I would'nt pass on it, but I personally would be looking for a 44 magnum.

Ardent said:
The Desert Eagle's a joke and a movie gun. Awfully heavy, large, and prone to problems when it gets a little gritty due to the gas powered action. I've found them not to be reliable either, though this could be the individual gun, I was not impressed.
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Hey Guys: For those who think that they can get a 9mm or 10 mm approved on a carry permit, forget it. You will be 100% rejected. I know this as I have had a carry permit now, for over 30 years. The minumum requirement is equal to a .357 magnum or better. That means Factory manufactured ammo. You can not get 9mm or 10mm approved ammo in Canada that will equal any .357 mag. Yes you can handload 10 mm up to or slightly over a .357 mag but you can;t get it approved because only factory ammo is recognized by RCMP. Additionally you can not transport hand loaded ammon on any commercial airlines. Such as needed when repositionaing for a project requiring a sched flight. The ammo if hand loaded will be refused and forfited, then if you need it on the other end right away, you have a problem. I suggest that any of you reccommending a 9mm as a handgun for protection of life against wild animal attacks have never been in the bush legally nor had a carry permit, or you would know that the gun jams when subjected to the environment and rian forests, and all the debris that accumulates while stomooping throught th ebush accordnigly. I have also had semi auto's when it was legal to pack a 10 mm, and trust me they friggin jam if you can;t or don;t keep it clean. Anyone who has ever had a bear attack and I have, knows that a friggin 9mm will just bounce off a grizzly skull, and at 2 feet away the second shot won;t matter any more. Your dead. If your getting a bush gun, plan on a one shot kill at close range, and from a gun that will kill a bear with one shot. I still say .357 is too small. Just because I've been there, done that. Start with a .44 revolver, learn how to shoot it, it will save your life.
 
I can think of a couple of guys locally (BC) that used to have G20s on their ATCs before the CFO decided they were prohibiting autos of all sorts.

Hornady defensive 10mms are around 550 ft-lbs. Silvertips are about 650. Double Tap 10mms are around 725 ft-lbs.

Hornady Critical Defense in .357 are around 600 ft-lbs. Silvertips about 550. Remington Golden Sabres is more like 400 ft-lbs.

There is a lot of factory 10mm that will pound the f**k out of most factory .357.
 
My first handgun on my ATC was a Colt Delta Elite 10mm and my second was a Glock 20 10mm the CFC wouldn't allow any semi-auto's on my 07 renewal & I let my ATC expire Sept 10/09 taking 1 1/2 years off to spend with my little guy.

I have to say I've never heard of the CFO questioning the ammo used before is this something new in the last 1 - 1 1/2 years on my application range report I just stated 10mm/45 Colt/454 Casull for ammo used?
 
gene drader said:
Hey Guys: For those who think that they can get a 9mm or 10 mm approved on a carry permit, forget it. You will be 100% rejected. I know this as I have had a carry permit now, for over 30 years. The minumum requirement is equal to a .357 magnum or better. That means Factory manufactured ammo. You can not get 9mm or 10mm approved ammo in Canada that will equal any .357 mag. Yes you can handload 10 mm up to or slightly over a .357 mag but you can;t get it approved because only factory ammo is recognized by RCMP. Additionally you can not transport hand loaded ammon on any commercial airlines. Such as needed when repositionaing for a project requiring a sched flight. The ammo if hand loaded will be refused and forfited, then if you need it on the other end right away, you have a problem.
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None of this is true.
 
Most RCMP tell you when you attempt to go round and round with them over the 10 mm issue is this: "Is the factory ammo readily availble most anywhere"? No the Hornady critical is not. Not most defence ammo. What you need to dela with is can you walk into a sport shop in Fort Nelson or any remote sport shop for example, and get factory ammo for the gun. Yes .357 is availble in most places as the minimum.
I wasted over a year trying to get my Glock 21 in 10 mm back on my permit. I guess if you have lots of money and want to challenge the RCMP in court...go for it. In the mean time its still .357 factory ballistics and ammo.
I tried the whole spectrum with my handload data against the .357. I tried importing factory ammo. Didn't work.
 
I had my 9mm pistols on my 2006 ATC. Then I heard that they weren't allowing them anymore.

I don't really believe in pistols for ATC but like to include them on my ATC in order to argue against pistol bans proposed by the Paul Martin Liberals.
 
I see there is no sense trying to save any of you any time, especially when someone wants to make comments saying none of this is true.
Go find out for yourself. I won't waste anymore of my time.
 
gene drader said:
I see there is no sense trying to save any of you any time, especially when someone wants to make comments saying none of this is true.
Go find out for yourself. I won't waste anymore of my time.
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all right, fair enough

gene drader said:
Hey Guys: For those who think that they can get a 9mm or 10 mm approved on a carry permit, forget it. You will be 100% rejected. I know this as I have had a carry permit now, for over 30 years. The minumum requirement is equal to a .357 magnum or better. That means Factory manufactured ammo. You can not get 9mm or 10mm approved ammo in Canada that will equal any .357 mag. Yes you can handload 10 mm up to or slightly over a .357 mag but you can;t get it approved because only factory ammo is recognized by RCMP. Additionally you can not transport hand loaded ammon on any commercial airlines. Such as needed when repositionaing for a project requiring a sched flight. The ammo if hand loaded will be refused and forfited, then if you need it on the other end right away, you have a problem.
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1) as posted above by geologist, he has had a 9mm on his ATC. My father had a 38 Special on his (though in either case it was not the primary carry piece). I have my 45 ACP on my current ATC and there is no factory loaded ammunition available in Canada that matches good 357 ballistics. There is no such '357 ballistic equivalent minimum', and there is certainly no condition regarding availability of factory ammo.

2) there is no restriction against handloaded ammo on comercial flights. People attend shooting competitions regularly with handloaded ammunition. I believe Air Canada specifies that ammunition must be in the manufacturers containers, which is of course no problem, as the handloader is the manufacturer. I fly commercially regularly with handloaded ammunition for my pistols.

there you go.
 
From Air Canadas website http://www.aircanada.com/en/travelinfo/airport/baggage/hunting_equip.html#-ammunition-firearms;

Only shells and cartridges are accepted and must be carried in checked baggage. Gunpowder and gunpowder pellets are strictly prohibited.

Ammunition allowance is limited to 5 kg (11 lb) per passenger. Allowances for more than one passenger cannot be combined into one or more packages.

View related information in the ‘Firearms' section below.

Packing instructions

Ammunition must be packed separately from the firearm in a secure, strong container made of wood, metal or plastic. The original carton can also be used but it recommended that the carton be placed in a secondary package such as a resealable plastic container.

To avoid shock movement, the properly packaged ammunition must then be placed inside a suitcase and cushioned with clothing.

gene drader said:
Additionally you can not transport hand loaded ammon on any commercial airlines. Such as needed when repositionaing for a project requiring a sched flight. The ammo if hand loaded will be refused and forfited, then if you need it on the other end right away, you have a problem.
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Can you provide a link to any Airline/DOT/FAA/ICAO information suporting your statement?
 
All I know is I tried to take my .44 mag and handloaded ammo onto a B.C. carrier on a sched flight and they provided information whereby they would not allow handloaded ammo. I had to send it home and purchase factory ammo to take on the plane. Perhaps each carrier is different. This was last year at Williams lake. So rather than have it happen again anywhere, I just take factory ammo.
If others out there still have a permit for a 9mm, then they are fortunate. RCMP to the best of my knowledge pulled the existing permits for 9mm or 10mm semi's, when they did mine. They told me it was B.C. and Alta blanket wide when the permit was cancelled.
Sporting events may well be different when transporting ammo. I don't know. All I was sure of was that I was refused a flight when on route for the purpose of business.
 
Another note from above. I read the geologist saying "had" on his permit in 2006 not have on his permit. Permits are good for a maximum of two years. So i would speculate that if he tried again, it would be refused. I also had a 10 mm glock on my permit in 2006. I don't think it works anymore. Mine was removed in 2008.
 
gene drader said:
Another note from above. I read the geologist saying "had" on his permit in 2006 not have on his permit. Permits are good for a maximum of two years. So i would speculate that if he tried again, it would be refused. I also had a 10 mm glock on my permit in 2006. I don't think it works anymore. Mine was removed in 2008.
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My current ATC, which was renewed in August 2010, has my 45 ACP, which, on paper has factory ballistics substantialy below your claimed minimum requirement of 357 magnum.

If they will accept a 45 ACP then they will most certainly accept a 10mm. From my dealings with them over the years, including writing employers letters for crew and associates, I quite frankly never thought they cared.

I've never had issues with semi-autos, though my two year time period may have overlapped the CFO's directive against them.
 
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