Dispute over SMD-12 classification
- Thread starter Dlask Arms
- Start date
Sendero, your friends loss of his life is the PERFECT reason we need this shotgun from Dlask!!!
Heartfelt condolences to all who knew him.
Cheers
Jay
P.S. I may be spending a significant amount of my career in engineering in the far north, I WILL LIKELY WANT TO HAVE THAT 8.5 870...
Heartfelt condolences to all who knew him.
Cheers
Jay
P.S. I may be spending a significant amount of my career in engineering in the far north, I WILL LIKELY WANT TO HAVE THAT 8.5 870...
Risking turning this into a bear defence thread:
My french is bad but I think I get the gyst of the paragraphs. IMHO those people need a good dose of reality, an axe is not a good defence method and pepper spray is not the best option in the hands of a trained individual. Sure there have been papers written touting pepper spray as more effective than a firearm but the paper is very biased/limited in its approach and methodology. At work there are places we do not allow our staff to go with pepper spray because it would be too much risk to our people's safety.
While nothing is guaranteed to stop an agressive bear 100% of the time a powerful fiream is by far the most effective option in trained hands. The whole idea is to reduce the risk as much as possible to people, much like we wear seatbelts in cars. If a panel were to suggest that a firearm was not effective and therefor should not be carried they would be opening themselves up to severe liability.
My french is bad but I think I get the gyst of the paragraphs. IMHO those people need a good dose of reality, an axe is not a good defence method and pepper spray is not the best option in the hands of a trained individual. Sure there have been papers written touting pepper spray as more effective than a firearm but the paper is very biased/limited in its approach and methodology. At work there are places we do not allow our staff to go with pepper spray because it would be too much risk to our people's safety.
While nothing is guaranteed to stop an agressive bear 100% of the time a powerful fiream is by far the most effective option in trained hands. The whole idea is to reduce the risk as much as possible to people, much like we wear seatbelts in cars. If a panel were to suggest that a firearm was not effective and therefor should not be carried they would be opening themselves up to severe liability.
I'm sure that within the last few months in the legal forum there was a thread regarding a company being sued or charged by some gov't department or ministry over not providing an employee with knowledge or a means of defense after a bear attack . I think it was a mining exploration company but i can't find the thread .
Here is the article:
Mining company charged with negligence in Yukon bear attack
Last Updated: Monday, May 7, 2007 | 10:09 AM CT
CBC News
The Yukon Workers Compensation Board has filed negligence charges against a Yellowknife-based mining exploration company, blaming it for the death of an employee who was killed by a bear.
The six charges against Aurora Geosciences that were laid last week are considered to be the first of their kind in northern Canada and British Columbia.
The compensation board alleges the company failed to properly train Jean-François Pagé, who was mauled to death by a grizzly bear in April 2006.
Pagé, a 28-year-old originally from Quebec, was staking mining claims in the bush near Ross River, about 198 kilometres northeast of Whitehorse.
He was apparently attacked by a sow after coming within five metres of a bear den that contained two cubs, RCMP said at the time. They believed the sow probably attacked Pagé to protect its young.
The board alleges the company didn't properly train or equip Pagé for the job.
His death shocked friends like Annie Savoie, who described Pagé as knowledgeable about the Yukon wilderness and "a real bush guy, he loved it," she told CBC News.
"He was living in it, too, so I don't think he was unproperly trained in that circumstance."
Veteran Yukon geologist Al Doherty, who helped train Pagé for his job, warned that should the board's charges against Aurora Geosciences be proven in court, it could set a dangerous precedent for everyone who works in the wilderness.
"It opens a huge can of worms for employers, because now all of a sudden it seems that if you don't get up and dress your employee in the morning, you're liable, you know?" said Doherty, who survived a similar bear attack 22 years earlier.
"This was a bear attack.… He walked into a bear den, and even if he had bear spray or a gun he might not have made it."
Doherty said safety records show bear attacks are rare in the mineral exploration business. Most accidents involve slips or fall, he added.
Aurora Geosciences' first court appearance is scheduled for June 5. The charges carry penalties of up to a year in jail and a $150,000 fine.
Aurora Geosciences is a company of geologists and geophysicists who conduct mineral, oil and gas exploration in Northern Canada and Alaska.
Mining company charged with negligence in Yukon bear attack
Last Updated: Monday, May 7, 2007 | 10:09 AM CT
CBC News
The Yukon Workers Compensation Board has filed negligence charges against a Yellowknife-based mining exploration company, blaming it for the death of an employee who was killed by a bear.
The six charges against Aurora Geosciences that were laid last week are considered to be the first of their kind in northern Canada and British Columbia.
The compensation board alleges the company failed to properly train Jean-François Pagé, who was mauled to death by a grizzly bear in April 2006.
Pagé, a 28-year-old originally from Quebec, was staking mining claims in the bush near Ross River, about 198 kilometres northeast of Whitehorse.
He was apparently attacked by a sow after coming within five metres of a bear den that contained two cubs, RCMP said at the time. They believed the sow probably attacked Pagé to protect its young.
The board alleges the company didn't properly train or equip Pagé for the job.
His death shocked friends like Annie Savoie, who described Pagé as knowledgeable about the Yukon wilderness and "a real bush guy, he loved it," she told CBC News.
"He was living in it, too, so I don't think he was unproperly trained in that circumstance."
Veteran Yukon geologist Al Doherty, who helped train Pagé for his job, warned that should the board's charges against Aurora Geosciences be proven in court, it could set a dangerous precedent for everyone who works in the wilderness.
"It opens a huge can of worms for employers, because now all of a sudden it seems that if you don't get up and dress your employee in the morning, you're liable, you know?" said Doherty, who survived a similar bear attack 22 years earlier.
"This was a bear attack.… He walked into a bear den, and even if he had bear spray or a gun he might not have made it."
Doherty said safety records show bear attacks are rare in the mineral exploration business. Most accidents involve slips or fall, he added.
Aurora Geosciences' first court appearance is scheduled for June 5. The charges carry penalties of up to a year in jail and a $150,000 fine.
Aurora Geosciences is a company of geologists and geophysicists who conduct mineral, oil and gas exploration in Northern Canada and Alaska.
RevolverRodger
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
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- Somewhere in QC
Are there going to be any more made ???
HeadDamage said:
For now... I'm sure the Fudds are working on getting these trashed as well.
As for silly laws, the solution is simple...make it mandatory that before any such law is passed the law maker must prove their case, and wrestle a Grizzly with their bare hands.
It isn't going restricted. They have been approving the Rem 10" and 8.5" Police Magnum and the 14" guns for years and this is not any different. The grip is not "folding or telescoping"
Now all we need is a pump shorty in 44 mag.
Now all we need is a pump shorty in 44 mag.
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CanAm said:
So what was it about the engraved receivers that allowed the high-and-mighty to re-classify them as restricted?
I'd line up for an unrestricted pump .44 mag!!! But wouldn't having a rifled barrel change the way it would be classified, making it restricted?
krausb said:So what was it about the engraved receivers that allowed the high-and-mighty to re-classify them as restricted?
They are saying the SMD-12 is a whole new gun designed to be fired with one hand vs. the 870 which was design as a full length gun and shortened by adding a grip and short barrel. Basically, it has been deemed a handgun. Just bureaucratic BS.
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Foxer said:
Ah, I see. Thanks!
I don't know about a pump.. but if someone made an aftermarket 'pistol' grip for levers you'd have some very interesting options
Hell yeah!!!! Anyone want a .45/70 pistol grip shorty guide gun? Now how's that for bear defense?!!!
