Has the AR market in Canada totally collapsed or what?

cr5 said:
Every person who likes firearms in Canada should own at least 1 restricted rifle or pistol.
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Well I own a pistol so my civic duty job in the firearms community vis a vis restricted ownership is done.

Don't get me wrong I've been going back and forth on getting a really high end AR as well. So my mind is not fully made up yet. But I'm leaning towards the new sg542 as opposed to a Knights or Noveske, but hey you never know, I might end up getting a Knights after all. But mind you I'm not going to buy it used, people can't be trusted... If I can't find one new, well then that just makes my decision to move onto an sg even easier.
 
Wrong Way said:
But if you only LIKE shooting at a range, WTF is the difference?

Newsflash: Not everyone hunts, nor does everyone like shooting in the bush. Sheesh....
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Yes. But the AVERAGE person doesn't want to spend the money on the with limited uses...hence why the range is not full of tier 1 ARs. People have 1,000s of ARs...most of them do not have a single one worth $3,000+ before they personalize it.

Get what you want, I do not care...but not everyone needs the best of the best range toy.
 
I know a lot of people jsut want an AR to just have one in the collection. That's my goal. I don't care what it's made up from as long as it fires reliably and is fairly accurate. All I need is an upper now, so if anyone of you feel the need to upgrade to a superior upper, please throw me your scraps! I will gladly take them and jump into the AR world.
 
Tyockell18 said:
Restricted firearms are pointless, especially when they cost $1000+.
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Hot rods are pointless. Why dump a tonne of money on something you can only drive once in awhile and not get dirty. All you can do is show it off. My damn jeep costs a tiny fraction of that and I drive it relentlessly.

Oh ya... wait ...some people are into hot rods. They are sweet pieces of engineering. A thing of beauty. But not everyone is going to buy one. Just like restricteds.

Me... I like my hot rod that I can take to the range... give it a good run... show it off and even compete on a monthly basis with it.

So no... the market isn't collapsing. It's just changing like everything else.
 
Mr Freeze said:
Hot rods are pointless. Why dump a tonne of money on something you can only drive once in awhile and not get dirty. All you can do is show it off. My damn jeep costs a tiny fraction of that and I drive it relentlessly.

Oh ya... wait ...some people are into hot rods. They are sweet pieces of engineering. A thing of beauty. But not everyone is going to buy one. Just like restricteds.

Me... I like my hot rod that I can take to the range... give it a good run... show it off and even compete on a monthly basis with it.

So no... the market isn't collapsing. It's just changing like everything else.
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yep...I drive my hot rod to the range to shoot my AR's

Laugh2
 
cr5 said:
Just wondering why I've read people reference the ACR with non restricted rifles saying they would rather buy those than an AR?
Last I checked the ACR was restricted and unless you were willing to shell out an extra $800-$1000 to buy a barrel from Questar then have a gunsmith install it and then have it reclassified.

There are a lot of posts in this thread I have problems with and without singling anyone out I'll just say:
-To those that don't want a restricted firearm because of the hassles involved, you are part of the problem, there really isn't that much hassle buying, transporting, using, storing. It's pretty simple and owning restricted firearms shows the government that we the people enjoy using these firearms and we the law abiding are not a threat to public safety.
-Only buying non restricted options because there is no paper trail to you so just in case they ban them you won't have to turn them in is saying that you are ok with making yourself a criminal rather than just standing up for yourself and the firearms community and fighting for you rights to own those firearms.
-I'm not going to bash anyone who buys a norc AR because at least they own an AR. I think the quality is low and would personally rather own better quality buy that's not my decision to make for others.
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I guess if I'm part of the problem I should just not renew my membership with the NFA and CSSA... It appears to me that some of you feel as though my only wanting to own non-restricted firearms makes me a lesser member of the firearms community.

I personally don't have any interest in the AR at all, I shoot one at work on a regular basis and see nothing special about them. Combine that with the extra foolishness involved with owning and transporting a restricted firearm and I choose not to bother. That said I see no reason why anyone else shouldn't enjoy one or ten if they so choose, just don't imply or state that I'm not as worthy or committed as you because I choose to spend my money on non-restricted rifles.
 
cr5 said:
There are a lot of posts in this thread I have problems with and without singling anyone out I'll just say:
-To those that don't want a restricted firearm because of the hassles involved, you are part of the problem, there really isn't that much hassle buying, transporting, using, storing. It's pretty simple and owning restricted firearms shows the government that we the people enjoy using these firearms and we the law abiding are not a threat to public safety.
-Only buying non restricted options because there is no paper trail to you so just in case they ban them you won't have to turn them in is saying that you are ok with making yourself a criminal rather than just standing up for yourself and the firearms community and fighting for you rights to own those firearms.
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I'm going to derail this thread for a sec just to respond to these points. Then it's back to our original programing. :) Though you're not singling anyone out cr5, you addressed some things i said with the 2 comments above so i shall reply. While all opinions have merrit, things are looked at differently by different people. A few insights into my perspective for you and the rest who don't think the way i do, follow. :)

1. I'm ok with being part of the problem. I really am......:D Naw, i'm just ####in' with ya. But not being an owner of a restricted rifle doesn't mean you're not doing your part in trying to take the stigma away from the bad, scary black rifle. I own black and red rifles and I use them in areas where people shoot/hunt around my parts. The closest range is an hour and a half drive from me and has, as far as i know, only a few hundred members tops. There are probably 10K gun owners in this area of a total population of about 60k. So the VAST majority shoot camo duck guns and wood stocked 30-06s. That's ok. But very few of them get introduced to black rifles since very few are range members. Which is bad for all of us. I try to win the PR war (which is argueably the most important part of winning this fight. The LGR is the best example of this) one guy at a time so i take my guns to the places where people actually go shooting around here. And it ain't to the range.

2. You're already a criminal. So am I and everyone else on this site. Owning any firearm in Canada is illegal. I repeat, ANY firearm. You have no legal right to own a firearm in Canada and i doubt any of us ever will. You have a little plastic card in your wallet that says LEOs can't charge you for breaking that law because the government said that you can break it for a term of no more than 5 years before you must pay and renew it. Just stating this makes me a sad panda...:(

3. Civil disobeidiance is something that's already practiced by millions of firearms owners in Canada. This is a form of standing up for yourself, albeit quietly. For some it's the best form. Others, not so much. Standing on a soapbox and screaming to the tops of our lungs is something some of us should do, i agree and it sometimes gets results. Those who have the gift of gab should be the ones on those boxes. Those who don't have it shouldn't be the ones doing the preaching. They make us all look bad. We've seen this time and time again in the news. Again, it's all about the PR war. The gov't will do what's popular with the people to gain votes. Scream as loud as you like but you'll be drown out if yours is not the popular opinion. It's simply politics. This war has many fronts. If you want to pad the license numbers, which our ultimate goal, then people all over Canada have to see that we're not the bad guys the media makes us out to be. I choose not to have restricted guns at the present because my goal is to open eyes of so called fudds. Hell, they already own guns so this should be a piece cake right? ;) :D

Lastly, IMHO freedoms in this country and the U.S. are being slowly erroded whether we like it or not no matter who's in power and there may come a day when the soap or jury box isn't enough to stop this and the box of last resort may be needed. If that day comes, any registered firearms will long have been confiscated. Lots of non-restricted guns will have been turned in by trusting citizens like in the c-68 days and it'll be to late for those who are unprepared for it. It's a sad statement, i know, and not one i enjoy making. But myself and family will be prepared. Having firearms is just a part of it. It's something i believe any prudent person would want to do. Man, do i sound like a doomsday prepper nut or what? :D

Anyway, is that AR sold yet?
 
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WeatherdoG said:
I guess if I'm part of the problem I should just not renew my membership with the NFA and CSSA..
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IMHO Buying a membership to the NFA or CSSA and tossing them a few bucks doesn't mean your actually participating in any solution to the problems plagueing our hobby. It just means your buying a clear conscience or an excuse as you have used it in these circumstances.

Participating first hand through ones direct efforts and actions means you are supporting the hobby.
 
mildcustom2 said:
IMHO Buying a membership to the NFA or CSSA and tossing them a few bucks doesn't mean your actually participating in any solution to the problems plagueing our hobby. It just means your buying a clear conscience or an excuse as you have used it in these circumstances.

Participating first hand through ones direct efforts and actions means you are supporting the hobby.
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So... Let me get this straight...

By owning a restricted firearm of some sort I'm fighting the good fight, but by being a member of two organizations that use my membership dues to actively engage the government to improve our silly laws I'm just a poser?

Just to clarify as well, some of us in the firearms community have jobs that preclude us from becoming politically engaged.
 
WeatherdoG said:
So... Let me get this straight...

By owning a restricted firearm of some sort I'm fighting the good fight, but by being a member of two organizations that use my membership dues to actively engage the government to improve our silly laws I'm just a poser?

Just to clarify as well, some of us in the firearms community have jobs that preclude us from becoming politically engaged.
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Did I even mention the word AR in my post?

My point is that many buy memberships thinking they are doing all they need to as far as contributing to the hobby. It's more than just joining a group and sending them a few bucks. I personally educate and take new people shooting to introduce them to the hobby. Participate in clean ups of people's waste left behind in the bush when shooting. I participate in local events and support local events through volunteer work.

This is how I choose to contribute in a productive way other than just taking a few minutes to join an organization. And I'm not saying you don't do anything but using your memberships that take minutes to do as an example or excuse that your doing your part is not a strong point. I would use others in addition to your memberships if I was trying to show that you support the hobby.

Owning a restricted class firearm doesn't hurt though. ;)
 
For many new shooters, the SKS is still the gun of choice. Semi-automatic, uber-reliable, easy to maintain, ammo's dirt cheap, they get semi-auto that they can also take deer/boar hunting. Those that want a black rifle can get a new one in the $1000 ballpark, so there's no chance that they'll want someone else's frankengun. The high end AR's are being outsold by NR alternatives that those people can also take into the bush and shoot and that they can just leave in the trunk as they swing over to Wally's on their way back from the range. Then there's the ridiculous EE pricing. "Save on tax/shipping" just doesn't cut it for me on a used gun. The only accessory I'd consider to be "extra value" would be mags.
 
The only items that I would consider buying from EE that you only save tax and shipping are a brand new item that you were planning on buying from a retail store anyways, or something like a mint Vortex or Leupold scope as the warranty is so amazing that you can get a new item at any time if it messes up. I don't think the AR market has dropped at all, but people are more inclined to buy not upgraded/custom built rifles. It's similar to a car, if you are planning on buying a used civic would you want one that someone already upgraded and probably has a lot of custom features you aren't interested in or a bone stock one you can do the way you want? Usually the custom built rifles cost more too as the person who built it usually spent a lot on expensive upgrades and they want their money back. Many people probably like the idea of buying a new rifle from a reputable dealer and having a warranty if something goes wrong, unlike built rifles where if something is faulty or breaks comes out of your pocket. As others have said with all the options in non restricted many people would rather be able to take it into the bush shooting and not deal with CFO transfers and ATT's.
 
Dorian Gray said:
I'm going to derail this thread for a sec just to respond to these points. Then it's back to our original programing. :) Though you're not singling anyone out cr5, you addressed some things i said with the 2 comments above so i shall reply. While all opinions have merrit, things are looked at differently by different people. A few insights into my perspective for you and the rest who don't think the way i do, follow. :)

1. I'm ok with being part of the problem. I really am......:D Naw, i'm just ####in' with ya. But not being an owner of a restricted rifle doesn't mean you're not doing your part in trying to take the stigma away from the bad, scary black rifle. I own black and red rifles and I use them in areas where people shoot/hunt around my parts. The closest range is an hour and a half drive from me and has, as far as i know, only a few hundred members tops. There are probably 10K gun owners in this area of a total population of about 60k. So the VAST majority shoot camo duck guns and wood stocked 30-06s. That's ok. But very few of them get introduced to black rifles since very few are range members. Which is bad for all of us. I try to win the PR war (which is argueably the most important part of winning this fight. The LGR is the best example of this) one guy at a time so i take my guns to the places where people actually go shooting around here. And it ain't to the range.

2. You're already a criminal. So am I and everyone else on this site. Owning any firearm in Canada is illegal. I repeat, ANY firearm. You have no legal right to own a firearm in Canada and i doubt any of us ever will. You have a little plastic card in your wallet that says LEOs can't charge you for breaking that law because the government said that you can break it for a term of no more than 5 years before you must pay and renew it. Just stating this makes me a sad panda...:(

3. Civil disobeidiance is something that's already practiced by millions of firearms owners in Canada. This is a form of standing up for yourself, albeit quietly. For some it's the best form. Others, not so much. Standing on a soapbox and screaming to the tops of our lungs is something some of us should do, i agree and it sometimes gets results. Those who have the gift of gab should be the ones on those boxes. Those who don't have it shouldn't be the ones doing the preaching. They make us all look bad. We've seen this time and time again in the news. Again, it's all about the PR war. The gov't will do what's popular with the people to gain votes. Scream as loud as you like but you'll be drown out if yours is not the popular opinion. It's simply politics. This war has many fronts. If you want to pad the license numbers, which our ultimate goal, then people all over Canada have to see that we're not the bad guys the media makes us out to be. I choose not to have restricted guns at the present because my goal is to open eyes of so called fudds. Hell, they already own guns so this should be a piece cake right? ;) :D

Lastly, IMHO freedoms in this country and the U.S. are being slowly erroded whether we like it or not no matter who's in power and there may come a day when the soap or jury box isn't enough to stop this and the box of last resort may be needed. If that day comes, any registered firearms will long have been confiscated. Lots of non-restricted guns will have been turned in by trusting citizens like in the c-68 days and it'll be to late for those who are unprepared for it. It's a sad statement, i know, and not one i enjoy making. But myself and family will be prepared. Having firearms is just a part of it. It's something i believe any prudent person would want to do. Man, do i sound like a doomsday prepper nut or what? :D

Anyway, is that AR sold yet?
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Some good points there. I still think everyone should own something restricted, doesn't have to be an AR.
How is it that we don't own any firearms? I paid good money for my rifles and pistols. I realize that if the laws or classifications change that they could be confiscated but unless the government wants a civil war I would hope they would compensate us for them (with our tax money).

No, still not sold. Probably gonna keep it and just save up for the ACR I want.
3 AR's is fine with me, I had 4 at one time last year so the little lady shouldn't complain too much :)
 
cr5 said:
No, still not sold. Probably gonna keep it and just save up for the ACR I want. 3 AR's is fine with me, I had 4 at one time last year so the little lady shouldn't complain too much :)
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Or if it's just going to sit there you're better off selling it and just take the hit. Firearms as an investment is generally a losing proposition. I don't look at it as taking a loss; I look at it as having rented it.
 
And I'll still buy one once the 10.4" barrels arrive with them...which the wife will hate! :ninja: (especially since I just snuck another AR into the house)
 
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