Old Time Grizzly Guns

H4831 said:
Mig25, whoever told you all that stuff knew absolutely nothing about old time hunting, or else he was just "pulling your leg."
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He was actually "pulling" George Landreth's "leg", who won the Weatherby Award and pioneered hunting in Mongolia, there's an excellent write up by Landreth in the book "Big Game Hunting Around the World" of his opening hunting in Mongolia.

I've other correspondence with Roy Wade, Co owner of the Nosler Bullet Company who told him the only thing Nosler succeeded at was losing money.

While he considered Landreth and Wade friends, I don't think he actually knew Roy Weatherby, but I have correspondence from Roy Weatherby saying "I've sent 4 boxes of 139 grain loads to such and such train station under your name".

My Grandfather wrote several seemingly rare books that I am trying to find. He has an entry in the B&C 1939 Records of Big Game, which is very early. I'd consider the stories authoritative, but of course I wasn't there.
 
MiG25 said:
He was actually "pulling" George Landreth's "leg", who won the Weatherby Award and pioneered hunting in Mongolia, there's an excellent write up by Landreth in the book "Big Game Hunting Around the World" of his opening hunting in Mongolia.

I've other correspondence with Roy Wade, Co owner of the Nosler Bullet Company who told him the only thing Nosler succeeded at was losing money.

While he considered Landreth and Wade friends, I don't think he actually knew Roy Weatherby, but I have correspondence from Roy Weatherby saying "I've sent 4 boxes of 139 grain loads to such and such train station under your name".

My Grandfather wrote several seemingly rare books that I am trying to find. He has an entry in the B&C 1939 Records of Big Game, which is very early. I'd consider the stories authoritative, but of course I wasn't there.
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If that was the case, wouldn't the company have gone belly up long ago?
 
I've posted this photo previously. In '55, we moved to downtown Barkerville from downtown Edmonton and lived there for five months. One of our neighbours were Mr. & Mrs. Wendle. Long story short, Mrs. Betty Wendle was well known for her forte of Grizzly hunting and using a 99 Savage in 22 Savage High Power. How's that as a calibre choice for Grizz??

 
Suther said:
Tell that to the mule deer in BC's interior...

Also, technically a few is at least 3. You may wish to rephrase that to a couple thousand FPS...



Totally agree with the 30-30 statement. As for the 45-70, I think that depends on whether you show up with a box of Remington factory ammo, designed to be safe in a 100+year old trapdoor springfield, or you bring a box of buffalo bore 400+ grain ammo. As long as you know the trajectory of the round, the 45-70 is plenty capable within reasonable ranges with the right ammo. (And yes I know millions of buffalo have been slayed with loads similar to the Rem factory ammo, but there is big difference between slaughtering buffalo in the 1800s and safely and humanely hunting grizzly in 2016.)
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I will have too give you that .. the old 45-70 and the ammo available today is a different story .. I do not own a 45-70 // but did buy a 300 win mag and a 338 win mag when i was planning a bear hunt .. as I believe the 300 has more legs than the 338 .. but the 338 has more punch up close .. I never considered a 45-70 as I was led too believe the guide was set up for 200 yard shots over bait .. and you had too prove your gun was shooting ""ON"" and that you were capable of making a 200 yard shot off a rest .. And that you could handle the recoil .... this also give him time too take over if you made a bad shot and the bear was charging .. and you were ####ting your pants LOL ,, at that time the guide was using a 12 gauge loaded with seven loads of slugs .. Apparently as a guide he was not restricted too a plug
 
Johnn Peterson said:
I've posted this photo previously. In '55, we moved to downtown Barkerville from downtown Edmonton and lived there for five months. One of our neighbours were Mr. & Mrs. Wendle. Long story short, Mrs. Betty Wendle was well known for her forte of Grizzly hunting and using a 99 Savage in 22 Savage High Power. How's that as a calibre choice for Grizz??

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Gof fkn dammit. I spent the last hour looking for that picture and come back and see this! Arrrrg! Found it on a uk hunting forum, was thinking Kamloops, not Barkerville! But proves the point quite well.
 
Rod said:
I don't doubt there was more than a few fast and loose yarns, around the camp fires, from these ol'boys from back in the day and as time went along so did the yarns. . Sometimes a bit of a contest to who could spin the biggest yarn. . I remember as a young boy and a huge fan of Davy Crocket, him trying to "Grin Down a Bear", but the stumble bum major came along and broke Davy's concentrating and he had to use a knife to wrestle that critter to table meat.

Aside from all the yarns, this is what my Grandfather and Great Grandfather used as big medicine for fair to middl'n size critters.

1889, Winchester Model 1886 in 45-90



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I remember reading a story, IIRC written by Carl Rungius (the artist) he says the 45-90 was powerful enough to kill an elephant and heavy enough to kill a packhorse and that when he got a 30-30 he couldn't get rid of it fast enough.
 
MiG25 said:
This was a long time ago.
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Yes, but simple economics hasn't changed in centuries. If you have a company that only loses money, its done for. Unless you have some super-rich person bankrolling the failing company, it would only take a few years before any company that lost money went out of business.
 
Suther said:
Yes, but simple economics hasn't changed in centuries. If you have a company that only loses money, its done for. Unless you have some super-rich person bankrolling the failing company, it would only take a few years before any company that lost money went out of business.
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I think it obvious that Nosler's fortunes have improved the last 50+ years.
 
Johnn Peterson said:
I've posted this photo previously. In '55, we moved to downtown Barkerville from downtown Edmonton and lived there for five months. One of our neighbours were Mr. & Mrs. Wendle. Long story short, Mrs. Betty Wendle was well known for her forte of Grizzly hunting and using a 99 Savage in 22 Savage High Power. How's that as a calibre choice for Grizz??

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I know a guy who killed a grizzly circa 1990 with a 22-250, and another who killed one with a 22 WMR circa 1970.
 
Suther said:
Mind if I ask for some clarification? Are you trying to say its all about penetration and caliber to create the biggest hole possible, or that a higher velocity round tends to create a larger temporary cavity which in turn causes a bigger hole with more bleeding? Both arguments have some merit, Im just not sure which side you are arguing for in that statement?
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WRT to Energy transfer....I think he is trying to say the recoil you feel from the gun is the same amount of energy that is transferred to the animal you shoot....well a bit less since the bullet is slowing down the minute it leaves the barrel. Some Newtonian laws of physics or some####...
 
MiG25 said:
I know a guy who killed a grizzly circa 1990 with a 22-250, and another who killed one with a 22 WMR circa 1970.
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Glad I read your post... I have a nice little WMR that I can bring along on the next grizzly hunt.
 
Suther said:
Tell that to the mule deer in BC's interior...

Also, technically a few is at least 3. You may wish to rephrase that to a couple thousand FPS...



Totally agree with the 30-30 statement. As for the 45-70, I think that depends on whether you show up with a box of Remington factory ammo, designed to be safe in a 100+year old trapdoor springfield, or you bring a box of buffalo bore 400+ grain ammo. As long as you know the trajectory of the round, the 45-70 is plenty capable within reasonable ranges with the right ammo. (And yes I know millions of buffalo have been slayed with loads similar to the Rem factory ammo, but there is big difference between slaughtering buffalo in the 1800s and safely and humanely hunting grizzly in 2016.)
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Im no expert on bc deer, but I can tell you that tge alberta variety will fall to a 45 colt round going about 1000 fps.
Let's not forget that killing game animals with rifles isn't exactly difficult or rocket science.
 
Hitzy said:
WRT to Energy transfer....I think he is trying to say the recoil you feel from the gun is the same amount of energy that is transferred to the animal you shoot....well a bit less since the bullet is slowing down the minute it leaves the barrel. Some Newtonian laws of physics or some####...
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Suther said:
Mind if I ask for some clarification? Are you trying to say its all about penetration and caliber to create the biggest hole possible, or that a higher velocity round tends to create a larger temporary cavity which in turn causes a bigger hole with more bleeding? Both arguments have some merit, Im just not sure which side you are arguing for in that statement?
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What I am saying is that is that it is the bullet that kills, not energy transfer. Put a bullet, even a small one in the right place and the hard work of gutting skinning etc. starts.
Energy is a guide and I think overplayed as it looks neat on paper. Use the right bullet and that right cartridge and put that bullet in the right place. In other words, let air in and blood out!
 
Clayton Mack hunted grizzlies and guided grizzly hunters on the north coast of BC with a 30-30. These coastal grizzlies can get quite monstrous. This was in the 1960's and 70's IIRC. Lots of bigger guns available at the time. He wrote about this in his books Bella Coola Man and Grizzlies and White Guys.

I've hunted where Mack did, and a 30-30 would be low on my list.
 
I hold the old 30-30 in hi regards but for Grizly no way it would be my first Choice
The preferred calbers for wildlife Monitors is 45-70 ,30-06, 308 and 12 gage in northern BC for good reason
 
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