Parker hale m82-m87-C3-C3A1 Rifles

[redman]

For my project I happily found a Parker Hale bipod.

Not that hard to find; as a matter of fact, they're still in production. Where'd you get yours?

Actually I think the sling is should go on the handguard stop only, not the bi-pod.

Right on; I don't think there's any attachment point on the bipod that I can tell . Looks like you're going for the C3 look; why not get the steel/neoprene handstop?

 

[tps50701]

Well it seems that everything comes to those who wait.

For my project I happily found a Parker Hale bipod.

And I'm told an unissued C 3 Sling.

Make my day!

Actually I think the sling is should go on the handguard stop only, not the bi-pod.

The sling is on backwards!

The wide end goes on the front - my previous posts explained that it bunched up in the bipod loop.

Use an FNC1A1 sling if you want the most current sling used.

Cheers, Carl

 

[billybob]

sling

del

 

[rgg_7]

Rob.....you've got the sling on backwards as Carl stated. The wide section attaches to the front loop and the narrow to the rear swivel. These were military issue; standard for the C3. These were a PIA and most were discarded for the more versitile C1 or C2 sling. Both the C1 and C2 were very good for positional shooting and carry....easier to adjust. Carl has a couple pictures posted in the thread. Ron

 

[billybob]

sling

Tdel

 

[rgg_7]

Rob...the front swivel on the C3 is wider....I just measured mine at 1.9650" clear on the inside of the swivel loop. The C3A1 handstop swivel is much narrower. I don't have a spare however I can email a picture of what you should be looking for.

The C3 was never designed for the bipod set up although the rail will accept a number of screwed in swivels. The bipod you have with the handstop is correct for the C3A1 and ties in nicely with your stock, removable mag, bolt handle etc.

If you need more info pls PM

Ron

 

[rgg_7]

C3A1 Question - Does anybody know what was used in the Mcmillan fibreglass stock for a front hanstop/bipod rail? Was told it was the Anschutz style aluminum rail however it's not clearly described in the CFC manuals. Just says "McMillam fibreglass stock...sliding rail". I know the beech wooden stocks have the 9 hole steel rail as I have one of these. Any info or picture of the rail installation would be appreciated. Ron

 

[tps50701]

C3A1 Question - Does anybody know what was used in the Mcmillan fibreglass stock for a front hanstop/bipod rail? Was told it was the Anschutz style aluminum rail however it's not clearly described in the CFC manuals. Just says "McMillam fibreglass stock...sliding rail". I know the beech wooden stocks have the 9 hole steel rail as I have one of these. Any info or picture of the rail installation would be appreciated. Ron

Ron,

They used the same rail as the walnut stocks.

This is confirmed with my failing memory - LOL and my handy dandy CFTO's - just to give you 100% accuracy!

It was secured with 2 machine screws and the embedded screw sockets in the A2 stock, unlike the wood stocks which used 2 wood screws to secure the rail.

Hope this helps.

Carl

 

[redman]

Carl,

So they'd remove the rail from the factory M87 stocks and put them on the A2? Or were the rails made and/or installed by McMillan?

 

[rgg_7]

I'm real curious about the rail question. I looked at a M87. Rail was Anschutz style like the M85. I've gone through all the manuals that I have. Shows the beech stock and the 9 hole rail that most of us are familar with. The manuals refer to the McMillan as a replacement stock and don't give a whole lot of detail. Could there be a couple variations? Any military guys on the board that have shot one of these lately?

 

[Savage]

McMillan supplied the stocks with out the rails .The 9 hole rail was used in the C3A1 stocks

 

[redman]

So the groove in the A2 to accomodate the rail + installation was done by CF weapons techs then?

 

[tps50701]

So the groove in the A2 to accomodate the rail + installation was done by CF weapons techs then?

The stock was a special order item from McMillan, to Canadian specifications - which included the relief cut for the PH rails.

All the stock replacements were carried out by Diemaco - mid life upgrade.

The current CFTO's clearly show the PH accessory rail - never had an Anschutz/Freeland style rail.

Cheers, Carl

 

[tps50701]

I'm real curious about the rail question. I looked at a M87. Rail was Anschutz style like the M85. I've gone through all the manuals that I have. Shows the beech stock and the 9 hole rail that most of us are familar with. The manuals refer to the McMillan as a replacement stock and don't give a whole lot of detail. Could there be a couple variations? Any military guys on the board that have shot one of these lately?

Ron,

Check your email - sent you something to clear up your confusion!

Cheers, Carl

 

[redman]

Hey Carl,

Did the CF ever use the M87's "as-is", i.e. sans the A2 stock, maybe just with the Unertl + PH bipod? Or were the stocks + action bedding applied from the get-go as a C3A1 "package"?

 

[tps50701]

Hey Carl,

Did the CF ever use the M87's "as-is", i.e. sans the A2 stock, maybe just with the Unertl + PH bipod? Or were the stocks + action bedding applied from the get-go as a C3A1 "package"?

The M87 was never used as is. The barrels that came on M87's were too small a profile and did not meet the specifications of the Canadian army.

The initial C3A1's did employ the walnut stocks we used on the C3. We changed the stocks around 00-01, just prior to OP Anaconda(Afghanistan).

Diemaco performed all the stock changes, as they are 3rd line maint for all smallarms in the Canadian inventory.

The C3A1's when we first got them had major problems with the bedding in the desert heat of the 1st gulf war in 91 - bedding cracked - which is why we switched to the Devcon epoxy. The reticle's in the Unertl's also went "Boing" - fell apart and crumpled under recoil.

John Unertl was an idiot for how he built ours - the mil dots were actually painted on the crosshairs by hand, and they couldn't be used to accurately range with.

I happen to love the wood stocks myself - I've seen some grain patterns that were outta this world beautiful. Almost too nice to put on a combat rifle.

It only made sense to convert them to the Mcmillan A2's, due to the fact that these rifles are used in extreme conditions around the world.

Man I miss working on these rifles - kinda wish I was still in sometimes.

Cheers, Carl

 

[rgg_7]

Carl. Thanks for the info. Sent you an email. Never hear the story on the barrel.
I though Parker Hale barrels were used? Do you know the barrel markings?

Any ex-Diemaco employees on line that could comment on the restocking and barrel swaps?

Ron

 

[tps50701]

Carl. Thanks for the info. Sent you an email. Never hear the story on the barrel.
I though Parker Hale barrels were used? Do you know the barrel markings?

Any ex-Diemaco on line that could comment on the restocking and barrel swaps?

Ron

They were PH barrels - the original profile of the C3. I was commenting to the fact that the original M87 barrels were too small of a profile(exactly same barrel that was used on the M85 sniper rifle).

The barrel markings were the standard PH fair - nothing really out of the ordinary. The McLennan replacement barrels have no markings at all.

I've never heard of any C3A1's that were ever rebarreled. Like I stated a while back - we had procedures in place at 2nd line maint to set back the primary torque shoulder and to recut the chamber to get more life out of the throats. With the introduction of the C14 Timberwolf, all the C3A1's will more than likely be going bye bye in the next 3-5 years.

Not cost effective to maintain an aging smallarm that you can't get parts for.

Cheers, Carl

 

[carbonrod]

The C3A1's when we first got them had major problems with the bedding in the desert heat of the 1st gulf war in 91 - bedding cracked - which is why we switched to the Devcon epoxy. The reticle's in the Unertl's also went "Boing" - fell apart and crumpled under recoil.

Any idea what the bedding compound was that cracked, and how old it was?

 

[redman]

Carl, thanks for that historical tidbit. This thread is pure gold.

The M87 was never used as is. The barrels that came on M87's were too small a profile and did not meet the specifications of the Canadian army.

The initial C3A1's did employ the walnut stocks we used on the C3. We changed the stocks around 00-01, just prior to OP Anaconda(Afghanistan).

They were PH barrels - the original profile of the C3.

So, let me see if I have the formula right. A C3A1 was constructed as follows:
- Get a Parker Hale M87
- Remove the barrel and replace it with a new Parker Hale barrel matching the C3/M82 profile.
- Remove the stock and replace it with the C3/M82 stock
- Slap on the USMC Unertl 10x scope and Unertl mount/rings (which was custom made for the M87, right?)
- Install the Parker Hale handstop and bipod

Later:
- Replace stock again with a McMillan A2 having a cheekpiece and a Parker Hale accessory rail (from the M82 or M87?)