The Templar Thread, 5.56 by Crusader Arms / Spectre LTD

Arrived on Thursday!

2 observations so far:
- the tightness of the upper to lower making it hard to disassemble
- position of the charging handle in the upward locked position (bolt held open by lever only) may interfere with optic mount, depending on placement

Zork13 said:
I did yeah. Shouod be arriving monday
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Ryanscholar said:
Arrived on Thursday!

2 observations so far:
- the tightness of the upper to lower making it hard to disassemble
- position of the charging handle in the upward locked position (bolt held open by lever only) may interfere with optic mount, depending on placement
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At least for me the tightness between upper and lower and disassembly fixes itself after a few times taking it apart. I still need to use a rubber mallet to get the takedown pins back in.
 
nelsonm64 said:
very nice. can’t wait to see more of these out in the wild!
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saw one at NAS Customer Appreciation Day last week..they were supposed to get more this week...also the Crusader team is at TRIGGRCON this weekend so they will have thousands of rounds through their guns and plenty of vids

i-SgLqkZb-X2.jpg
 
45C said:
I think we’re struggling with ideas on how to keep it under 9 lbs.
So voila, use a handguard with lots of holes.. everyone likes holes .. right?
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You are correct, they were a way to decrease weight and improve ventilation while maintaining a full length handguard, according to one of the Crusader interviews at TACCOM (which one escapes my memory).
 
So you basically come up with a lower receiver from scratch but decide to go for non-ambi controls. What gives? I'm never going to buy it for that reason alone.

For over 2k I'd expect you to figure out a right-side bolt release.
 
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If I am not mistaken, the "new" Templar is really just a repackaged WS-MCR, right down to the steel reinforcement in the aluminum Upper Receiver for the Cam Track. For those who are familiar with both platforms, is this an accurate assessment? Or are the changes and improvements greater than the sum of their parts to create an entirely new and more capable platform?
 
If I am not mistaken, the "new" Templar is really just a repackaged WS-MCR, right down to the steel reinforcement in the aluminum Upper Receiver for the Cam Track. For those who are familiar with both platforms, is this an accurate assessment? Or are the changes and improvements greater than the sum of their parts to create an entirely new and more capable platform?
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They can't possibly be as bad as the MCR.

The MCR looked like a high-school machine shop project gone bad.
I've honestly never seen a more crudely built firearm in my entire life.

The Templar looks to be a MASSIVE step up from it.
 
Bartok5 said:
If I am not mistaken, the "new" Templar is really just a repackaged WS-MCR, right down to the steel reinforcement in the aluminum Upper Receiver for the Cam Track. For those who are familiar with both platforms, is this an accurate assessment? Or are the changes and improvements greater than the sum of their parts to create an entirely new and more capable platform?
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Yes, I believe you are mistaken ….I think it would be like saying the R18 is a glorified version of the WK180 Gen2
Even without addressing the Templar superior piston, which is the backbone of the new offering, the Aesthetics, the lower, the modern Ambi forward charging handle, packaged in a monolithic upper with the proprietary quick bolt catch/release are just a few of what I see as obvious differences that set it apart from the WS-MCR. Not to mention while many other 180 style products have come to market with similar style footprints, the Templar offers something unique that has not yet been seen in a 180 offering at a price point that has them in a unique market position.
 
Morc said:
At least for me the tightness between upper and lower and disassembly fixes itself after a few times taking it apart. I still need to use a rubber mallet to get the takedown pins back in.
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I can't get it to field strip...? I can get the rear pin pushed, but nothing moves afterwards. Upper and lower seem stuck. Is there a trick to it?
 
Ryanscholar said:
I can't get it to field strip...? I can get the rear pin pushed, but nothing moves afterwards. Upper and lower seem stuck. Is there a trick to it?
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Push the return spring plate in (it's below the pic rail at the back of the receiver) and you should be able to separate the upper and lower (in much the same way that you would open up a Gen 1 wk that doesn't have a rear pin)
 
clev said:
Yes, I believe you are mistaken ….I think it would be like saying the R18 is a glorified version of the WK180 Gen2
Even without addressing the Templar superior piston, which is the backbone of the new offering, the Aesthetics, the lower, the modern Ambi forward charging handle, packaged in a monolithic upper with the proprietary quick bolt catch/release are just a few of what I see as obvious differences that set it apart from the WS-MCR. Not to mention while many other 180 style products have come to market with similar style footprints, the Templar offers something unique that has not yet been seen in a 180 offering at a price point that has them in a unique market position.
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Fair enough. There are enough improvements to make the Templar is own aesthetic "design" insofar as looks are considered. As far as the mechanical design is concerned however, the Templar operating system remains an enhanced AR180 design with the same steel reinforcing plate that made the MCR a unique offering. As does the SAI R18, albeit without the steel plate which specificaly connects the Templar back to the WS-MCR. Indeed, I would say that the R18 descends more directly from the original AR180, based on its 3-piece gas Piston system at the heart of the rifle's operating mechanism.

I don't consider a beefier 1-piece Piston or a backwards Bolt Catch to be fundamental operating system changes. IMHO they are simply enhancements to the basic AR180 design, the operating system of which is essentially unchanged in the Templar. This is why I consider the Templar to be a direct evolution of the WS-MCR. Just as the R18 is a direct descendant (in my view) of the original AR 180. ¹"Repackaged" was probably the wrong initial descriptor on my part, however, as the Templar is arguably more of an evolution than just a "new look" for the existing WS-MCR design.
 
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clev said:
Yes, I believe you are mistaken ….I think it would be like saying the R18 is a glorified version of the WK180 Gen2
Even without addressing the Templar superior piston, which is the backbone of the new offering, the Aesthetics, the lower, the modern Ambi forward charging handle, packaged in a monolithic upper with the proprietary quick bolt catch/release are just a few of what I see as obvious differences that set it apart from the WS-MCR. Not to mention while many other 180 style products have come to market with similar style footprints, the Templar offers something unique that has not yet been seen in a 180 offering at a price point that has them in a unique market position.
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Can someone please explain Crusader's relationship with Spectre Ltd and Wolverine Supplies.

To me it comes across that Wolverine owned the MCR design, Spectre made it then Wolverine sold the rights to it, then suddenly crusader appears and what looks like variations of the MCR design start being made.

I've no issue with any of that but the history of the company is very much an unknown to me (and perhaps others).
 
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