blaxsun
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
I agree entirely. I just think a lot of people have become complacent with the (previous) LGR affording an unparalleled degree of buyer protection, and that's going to be a rather abrupt realization for some...
Why would a EE seller ask for "scan of PAL and drivers to complete sale"
- Thread starter RemingtonMarlin
- Start date
I agree entirely. I just think a lot of people have become complacent with the (previous) LGR affording an unparalleled degree of buyer protection, and that's going to be a rather abrupt realization for some...
The LGR did provide security, but that wasnt its purpose, its purpose was for the antis, to know where all the guns were so they could confiscate them. I doubt any of us would have has such a problem with the LGR if it had been used as nothing more then added security.
Now that the LGR is gone, its up to us as gun owners to do our best and make sure we know who we are selling too. Which isnt 100 percent guaranteed, we will just have to do our best.
Now that the LGR is gone, its up to us as gun owners to do our best and make sure we know who we are selling too. Which isnt 100 percent guaranteed, we will just have to do our best.
blaxsun
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
No question. I was just pointing out that one of the unintended side effects was that firearms transactions became relatively painless and secure - and people are going to have to adjust to the new reality of once again vetting buyers.
blaxsun
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
You guys realize that most criminals just steal guns or buy stolen guns, right?
The only criminals are the ones charging new retail for their used firearms on the EE...
you misunderstood what i said. i said that the cfc should confirm the address, not give it out, just like how the cfc confirm pal numbers, names and dobs. they should add the address, or postal code to that confirmation list. they would never give it out i know that, but they should confirm that the address that u are asking about(that u got from the buyer) is linked to that pal.
Option 1 - supply the information requested to the seller, who packs up and ships your gun.
Option 2 - give your information to the seller, who calls the CFC, idenitifies himself, identifies you, and then ships your gun. CFC doesn't know what you bought, but they know that seller X has sold a firearm to buyer Y. Think that information is ever going to be deleted?
Do you want only the seller to have your information, or do you want the seller and the CFC to have it?
Option 2 - give your information to the seller, who calls the CFC, idenitifies himself, identifies you, and then ships your gun. CFC doesn't know what you bought, but they know that seller X has sold a firearm to buyer Y. Think that information is ever going to be deleted?
Do you want only the seller to have your information, or do you want the seller and the CFC to have it?
Now the seller has a scanned copy of your PAL & DL that anyone who gains access to his email or computer can use to buy guns. I believe banks are required by law to destroy any images of a persons ID. I wonder if it applies to individuals? I would not provide an image - only my name, PAL number & shipping address. Seller can call CFC & verify if they wish.
So if I have a buyers PAL#...DOB...Full Name...and validated this with the lovely people at CFC...Whats to stop me from using this info to purchase my next firearm? Seems like the same info that you would get if you had a scan of a PAL. If I can see someones PAL and everything is valid I don't need CFC.
There could be the possibility of someone having their licence revoked but still be in possession of their card.
Does the government seize a persons drivers licence if it is suspended or revoked? (seriously asking because I don't know.)
But still, you asked for and examined the pal. you were resonably sure the person had a valid licence. you would have done all the law requires you to do.
They buyer is the one who would be breaking the law.
What if the person you are dealing with sent you a scan of another person's PAL?
What if the person used someone else's PAL# and knew the DOB?
What if the guy was being held hostage by the Taliban and they were threatening to behead him if he didn't turn over his PAL to Al Queda?
What if someone forged a PAL, DL with photoshop and bought your gun illegally?
What if the person at the CFC is a drug addict and approves everyone because she is in the pay of the Hell's Angels?
What if you only do in person sales and someone robs you?
What if crickets had machine guns? Would the birds f**k with them?
What if gun owners stopped worrying about every "what if" and didn't act like they are scared sh1tless of life without the long gun registry?
What if the person used someone else's PAL# and knew the DOB?
What if the guy was being held hostage by the Taliban and they were threatening to behead him if he didn't turn over his PAL to Al Queda?
What if someone forged a PAL, DL with photoshop and bought your gun illegally?
What if the person at the CFC is a drug addict and approves everyone because she is in the pay of the Hell's Angels?
What if you only do in person sales and someone robs you?
What if crickets had machine guns? Would the birds f**k with them?
What if gun owners stopped worrying about every "what if" and didn't act like they are scared sh1tless of life without the long gun registry?
20 rounds at the range wont hurt the gun, not even a bit
In fact, it becomes NEWER now.
In fact, it becomes NEWER now
.The only criminals are the ones charging new retail for their used firearms on the EE...
As far as I know if you were stopped and given a DUI the police take your license on the spot and isn't returned until the suspension period is over or you are allowed to re-apply for a license. As far as a firearms license I don't know if they actualy confiscate it or not or just invalidate it at the CFC. There must be some police officers out there that are CGN members that can enlighten us.
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Having just got off the phone with the "CFC" I was told if you can see a individuals license and it is valid and not expired that is all you need. You can phone them with the buyers PAL# and validate they are ok. If an individual has had their license revoked then that means the Law Dogs have been to their premises and not only took his license but also all his firearms and probably ammo and everything related or unrelated to this person. The only time there may be a problem is if the persons license is under review in which case the guy would still have it but can't use it. Thats where phoning CFC would put the whoa on the transaction. I have no trouble with a visual scan of a license. The validation date is the key info. If it isn't valid it isn't OK. Just cover part of the license number if it bothers you and carry on. If some one wants to use your scan to buy a gun from some one else then there really is nothing stopping him,but then he can use the same info you gave him to confirm with the CFC right? Giving a scan off your PAL or just the written info makes no difference for a crook. If you think something is IFFY then back away. Enjoy the victory we have accomplished here. We have to set aside the post-registry paranoia and buy-sell...buy-sell...buy-sell...
blaxsun
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Sssshhh... some of us like our chains.
Some verification protocol will have to be put in place. C-19 is too vague on that aspect and will result in unintended consequences. I've been acquiring firearms from before the FAC days. There was no Internet, no Skype, no faxes. The technology has changed and the rules have changed. Those who think that that gives them permission to sell and buy without due diligence have got their heads buried in the sand. It wouldn't surprise me if we went to the US system where mail orders have to go through an FFL dealer.
blaxsun
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Sure, let's add dealers or brokers as intermediaries... or better yet, let's scrap C-19 and go back to the chains just so we can have our "due diligence"... Or maybe we'll just put the onus on the person breaking the law (ie: the unlicensed buyer or seller).
Don't give *them* any ideas. For myself, I'm just going back to local, face to face deals. Come to think of it, the only gun deals I ever done on the EE were for restricted firearms. No changes there.
