Colt Canada rifles to the public?
- Thread starter TimberWolf_3063
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The core elements of them are top of the line quality. They do crap out when it comes to accessories like the tac latch, tri-ad and the fore grips.
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Read Rebel Rouser's post. Keep in mind that buying from Canada is likely cheaper than buying from the US as our dollar is worth less than the US compared to the British pound. Regardless, a Milspec AR is a Milspec AR. All Diemaco rifles are simply AR FOW.
Again, read above and it will make more sense.
The core elements of a DD, BCM, Noveske, Larue, KAC, or Colt USA rifle are no different. Hell, some here think an FN stamped AR is worth more than a stock Colt!
TDC
Point is certain US made Colts go for 1 grand in the US.
Therefore Canadian made Colts sold in Canada = ...
I cant explain it anymore than that.
angryeyebrows
CGN frequent flyer
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- Oscar Mike
Lol at this guy! Are you on the payroll?....
Foundries provide forgings to many users....final machining to a spec is what matters....the raw forging is a small part of the whole package. Bushmaster shares similar forge codes...they are not the same gun when you look at QC coming out of Ilion lately.
Boltgun
I love this whole "milspec" bull#### that has been argued over for the better part of the last decade in the firearms community. This is coming from a Colt guy with Colt AR's.
If you do the research for the most part milspec is like an ISO standards but for military hardware. Made to solve problems like imperial lug nuts not fitting with metric lug nut removers.
Milspec for AR's comes down to the TDP that Colt SMFG holds which outlines the dimensional standards and everything else including the testing procedures that rifles have to go through. Unless you have an M16 stamped "Property of U.S. Government" you don't have a "milspec" gun. Even if you have a gun, maybe even a Colt which was manufactured to the same dimensional standards as the M16 minus the fun button it probably didn't go through U.S. DOD testing.
A quality AR is a quality AR. You got some of the "Operator" guys on Youtube who shoot the living piss out of their gear, as much as I hate to admit it Nuntfancy is one of those guys and hes documented that you can abuse the living crap out of a Bushmaster and it's still ticking right along side of the "milspec" stuff.
If you do the research for the most part milspec is like an ISO standards but for military hardware. Made to solve problems like imperial lug nuts not fitting with metric lug nut removers.
Milspec for AR's comes down to the TDP that Colt SMFG holds which outlines the dimensional standards and everything else including the testing procedures that rifles have to go through. Unless you have an M16 stamped "Property of U.S. Government" you don't have a "milspec" gun. Even if you have a gun, maybe even a Colt which was manufactured to the same dimensional standards as the M16 minus the fun button it probably didn't go through U.S. DOD testing.
A quality AR is a quality AR. You got some of the "Operator" guys on Youtube who shoot the living piss out of their gear, as much as I hate to admit it Nuntfancy is one of those guys and hes documented that you can abuse the living crap out of a Bushmaster and it's still ticking right along side of the "milspec" stuff.
- Location
- Richmond, BC
I think a lot of folks just like the idea of having Colt, or Colt Canda roll marks, or something related to Colt but made in Canada, and since they often go for a lot less down in the States for the same item here, a lot of people are hoping that because these are not imported, but local brew, it will equalize the price. We hope, we've been informed that they are pipe dreams....time will tell I guess.
Actually I didn't say milspec, but since you mention it, I will throw this out there. Most people on this board buy guns for recreation....most don't care if a firearm is built to a certain level or not - other than getting good value for their dollar. Yes the milspec term is grossly over used....however it is hard to argue that any firearm built to a higher QC specification (dimensions, nuts, bolts, raw materials, finishes etc) will, as a whole, be a better performing firearm over a longer period of time as a whole FOW. No we cannot by genuine milspec guns....only the Gov't can...regardless of which gov't. However buying a firearm that has more milspec components is desirable in many cases because of the QC that traditionally goes into them...in other words as close to milspec as possible. Bushmaster was making excellent rifles when they were not part of Remington.....I had one and didn't one issue with it. and yes, you will get problems with Colts as well as DD's. however, the FOW as a whole when made by a MFGR like Colt or DD is generally going to be of higher quality than say Norinco.
Boltgun
- Location
- Richmond, BC
I think that many people will agree that Norcs are generally not pleasant to look at compared to their North American counterparts, however what’s the general consensus on their performance, specifically, their AR line of firearms? Obviously there are no formal statistics performed over the long term, but from what I’ve seen over the years, they generally perform fine and see no more failures than any other manufacture. So when you say higher quality than Norinco, are you talking strictly cosmetics, or performance as well?
MD
that's an honest question...I do not own one but I have worked on them. I have seen them run well and then I have seen them run like crap...when I looked at the ones that ran like crap I would often connect it to the typical issues....bad extractor springs, buffers, broken small parts like safety levers. I will leave over all reliability to the actual owners to answer.
Another aspect of a firearms construction is what happens to it in the event of a failure - a kaboom....good materials will actually minimize shrapnel....I dont get the feeling that a norinco will help that.
Like I have always said.....manufacturers that are known for high quality firearms made to a spec - as close to milspec, milspec or exceeding milspec - will have parts and guns that have problems....what they do to rectify the problem and how often the problems occur are clues to their process of manufacturing.
and remember also, sometimes milspec isn't the best...and you always have to have context on whose milspec we are talking about, Canada's? USA? etc. In addition to that, there are many aspects to milspec.....finish, metallurgy, testing and tolerances, dimensions, certifications, etc. For example, steel finishes - usually a manganese phosphate surface treatment...I personally think that isn't the best finish...its the start to one but a surface coating after mang-phos like KG/cerakote, whatever is a better way to go.
Boltgun
that's an honest question...I do not own one but I have worked on them. I have seen them run well and then I have seen them run like crap...when I looked at the ones that ran like crap I would often connect it to the typical issues....bad extractor springs, buffers, broken small parts like safety levers. I will leave over all reliability to the actual owners to answer.
Another aspect of a firearms construction is what happens to it in the event of a failure - a kaboom....good materials will actually minimize shrapnel....I dont get the feeling that a norinco will help that.
Like I have always said.....manufacturers that are known for high quality firearms made to a spec - as close to milspec, milspec or exceeding milspec - will have parts and guns that have problems....what they do to rectify the problem and how often the problems occur are clues to their process of manufacturing.
and remember also, sometimes milspec isn't the best...and you always have to have context on whose milspec we are talking about, Canada's? USA? etc. In addition to that, there are many aspects to milspec.....finish, metallurgy, testing and tolerances, dimensions, certifications, etc. For example, steel finishes - usually a manganese phosphate surface treatment...I personally think that isn't the best finish...its the start to one but a surface coating after mang-phos like KG/cerakote, whatever is a better way to go.
Boltgun
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I still believe Colt has some inside info and ar15s will be non restricted or as others have said restricted firearms will be able to be shot outside of ranges.
Maybe I am crazy but I hope not. The timing between these two events is interesting.
Maybe I am crazy but I hope not. The timing between these two events is interesting.
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Runningfool
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- SW Ontario
I don't think the timing is anything more than coincidence. Colt Canada has been working on this for some time and for that matter, this isn't the first time Colt Canada has wanted to release something like this - it's just the first time it has gotten this far.
- Location
- Richmond, BC
Good information, thanks. I’ve got a Norc AR myself and though I haven’t put it through any torture test or anything it hasn’t failed in any way, shape or form. The finish is not great, but not as bad as previous years when the paint used to flake off. These new ones appear to have anodized receivers and parkerized barrels (but I’m no expert and I could be wrong). When I got the Norc, I didn’t have much money and my job at the time didn’t pay nearly as well. 4 years later, I’ve got a job that pays a bit better, so I am in the market for a Colt, but I’m just waiting for the Colt Canada pricing to come out. If it’s outrageously expensive, I’ll go back to my original choice and hope that irunguns has a few left
Got another question, does Norinco manufacture firearms for the Chinese military? Would the ones for civvie release be put through the same QC as the ones supplying their infantry units? As we all know, a firearm can be ugly as sin, but still be fine in terms of performance and reliability. I know toasters or any other commercial product that’s made in China doesn’t have the best QC, but I’d think their standards for military equipment might be a little higher on the food chain.
Not all of the stuff they make is low quality, look at the success of their M305's.... That said there have been a lot of courses and parts that have improved those guns. If you are shooting paper or CQB matches they work. If you would trust your life on the firearm that's a different story.
As far as I know, Norinco makes a large amount of materiel for the Chinese military. Do they apply the same QC to their commercial lines? I don't know....what I do know is that if their military is using the ammo that is available over here, then the have to be hurting! Lol
As far as I know, Norinco makes a large amount of materiel for the Chinese military. Do they apply the same QC to their commercial lines? I don't know....what I do know is that if their military is using the ammo that is available over here, then the have to be hurting! Lol
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