Mystic Precision
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Summerland, BC
Yep, the 'debate' stops. I give in and give up. NO more rebuttals, as nothing is likely to be accomplished and it is creating bad blood amoung us.
So back to the rifle and shooting,
Started H4350 and CCI primers testing. Worked up to 46gr and had a pretty good load at 44.5gr (will retest for accuracy and velocity). I have room in the case so will keep going up a bit more. Pressure signs are starting so expect to max out around 47gr. If accuracy returns to the H4831SC levels, I know velocity will be 2950fps or more but brass is going to take a beating. At the location I test, we are on a mound so I can't chrony at the same time I shoot on paper. A royal pain actually.
What I did find was that the H4350 groups stayed pretty consistent through a wider range of powder. No bugholes but no big groups either. All stayed in the 3/8" to 1/2" range at 200yds. Interesting....
With more testing, I want to confirm that this is the case and if the velocity is significantly higher, will give me another tool to approach conditions during a match.
My thinking is this. We never know what conditions we will be facing. You can go from cold in the morning to sweltering by 1pm. Although hodgdon powders are pretty stable, using a powder that has a wider 'sweet spot' reduces the chase of fliers due to temp change. BR loads tend to be very hot so if you get a temp related pressure spike, that shot is going bye bye.
Since we can't load at the range easily, adjusting for conditions isn't plausible.
Also, if the H4350 load goes faster, even if the mechanical accuracy is a bit worse, being able to dodge the wind should improve my practical accuracy (still a novice at reading conditions) and scores. The 1/4 MOA type accuracy is still adequate to shoot possibles.
On calm/consistent days or when temps are steady, the H4831SC load will give me an accuracy edge which will be needed because everyone else will be shooting great scores and you can't drop a point.
Looking forward to see if the above theory will hold water on the range. Downside is that you have to bring ALOT more ammo to the shoot.
For testing, don't get hung up on large volumes of shots per given load. With high ambient temps, barrels heat/movement is going to cause a huge source of error (unless you are going to shoot the rig in the same heat, then test as you will compete or play).
I prefer to shoot low numbers of rds but repeat over a number of days. What I am looking for is consistency and repeatability. I want a load that will do as expected on any given day, not when I am having a great outing. Also, for those days that I am not doing so great, I don't want to discount a good load because I can't hit the broadside of a barn.
For any of the stats people in the audience, I think they will find that 2 to 3 rds over two to three groups per session over 5 or more sessions has as much validity (I believe more) then a several 5rds groups shot on one outing. Given the short lifespan you already have, I want to test over the least number of rds as possible. Best accuracy of any match barrel will be in the first 1000rds. I prefer to use that accuracy during the match or practise.
Besides, to shoot 5 or 10+ shots into a tiny group, as you would in competition, the first two or three better snug right up.
I test the mechanical accuracy of the rifle/load NOT my ability to shoot. I will test on days where wind is as calm as possible. I make sure that I am 'shooting' as consistently as possible so the results are reliable.
Once I have a consistent load, I start practising. Now I shoot under any condition, good or bad, at the distance I will compete in with the number of shots required in my tasks. This lets me know how the load/rifle and barrel hold up under sustained strings of fire and what it takes to drive it successfully.
In F class, that is a min of 17rds with a max of 25rds over 15 to 22min. Sometimes the most accurate load isn't the best load under certain conditions.
That also applies to cleaning. In a match, I may not get the time to clean due to helping out with scoring or whatever. That means my barrel has to keep me in the V ring over the max number of shots fired that day. This barrel is still shooting very well and I haven't cleaned it in 50rds. I will keep shooting for at least another 50rds just to be sure.
If you keep track of how fast your barrel looses accuracy between cleanings, you will also get a good indication of barrel wear. Having to clean with increasing regularity is a sure sign your barrel is nearing the end of its useful life.
Right now, I am delayed simply due to a lack of bullets. I only had the one box of Lapuas and have run out. Why I started testing MK's, etc.
If the bullets show up in time for Kamloops, the next set of testing will be at 300m to simulate the event.
Jerry
So back to the rifle and shooting,
Started H4350 and CCI primers testing. Worked up to 46gr and had a pretty good load at 44.5gr (will retest for accuracy and velocity). I have room in the case so will keep going up a bit more. Pressure signs are starting so expect to max out around 47gr. If accuracy returns to the H4831SC levels, I know velocity will be 2950fps or more but brass is going to take a beating. At the location I test, we are on a mound so I can't chrony at the same time I shoot on paper. A royal pain actually.
What I did find was that the H4350 groups stayed pretty consistent through a wider range of powder. No bugholes but no big groups either. All stayed in the 3/8" to 1/2" range at 200yds. Interesting....
With more testing, I want to confirm that this is the case and if the velocity is significantly higher, will give me another tool to approach conditions during a match.
My thinking is this. We never know what conditions we will be facing. You can go from cold in the morning to sweltering by 1pm. Although hodgdon powders are pretty stable, using a powder that has a wider 'sweet spot' reduces the chase of fliers due to temp change. BR loads tend to be very hot so if you get a temp related pressure spike, that shot is going bye bye.
Since we can't load at the range easily, adjusting for conditions isn't plausible.
Also, if the H4350 load goes faster, even if the mechanical accuracy is a bit worse, being able to dodge the wind should improve my practical accuracy (still a novice at reading conditions) and scores. The 1/4 MOA type accuracy is still adequate to shoot possibles.
On calm/consistent days or when temps are steady, the H4831SC load will give me an accuracy edge which will be needed because everyone else will be shooting great scores and you can't drop a point.
Looking forward to see if the above theory will hold water on the range. Downside is that you have to bring ALOT more ammo to the shoot.
For testing, don't get hung up on large volumes of shots per given load. With high ambient temps, barrels heat/movement is going to cause a huge source of error (unless you are going to shoot the rig in the same heat, then test as you will compete or play).
I prefer to shoot low numbers of rds but repeat over a number of days. What I am looking for is consistency and repeatability. I want a load that will do as expected on any given day, not when I am having a great outing. Also, for those days that I am not doing so great, I don't want to discount a good load because I can't hit the broadside of a barn.
For any of the stats people in the audience, I think they will find that 2 to 3 rds over two to three groups per session over 5 or more sessions has as much validity (I believe more) then a several 5rds groups shot on one outing. Given the short lifespan you already have, I want to test over the least number of rds as possible. Best accuracy of any match barrel will be in the first 1000rds. I prefer to use that accuracy during the match or practise.
Besides, to shoot 5 or 10+ shots into a tiny group, as you would in competition, the first two or three better snug right up.
I test the mechanical accuracy of the rifle/load NOT my ability to shoot. I will test on days where wind is as calm as possible. I make sure that I am 'shooting' as consistently as possible so the results are reliable.
Once I have a consistent load, I start practising. Now I shoot under any condition, good or bad, at the distance I will compete in with the number of shots required in my tasks. This lets me know how the load/rifle and barrel hold up under sustained strings of fire and what it takes to drive it successfully.
In F class, that is a min of 17rds with a max of 25rds over 15 to 22min. Sometimes the most accurate load isn't the best load under certain conditions.
That also applies to cleaning. In a match, I may not get the time to clean due to helping out with scoring or whatever. That means my barrel has to keep me in the V ring over the max number of shots fired that day. This barrel is still shooting very well and I haven't cleaned it in 50rds. I will keep shooting for at least another 50rds just to be sure.
If you keep track of how fast your barrel looses accuracy between cleanings, you will also get a good indication of barrel wear. Having to clean with increasing regularity is a sure sign your barrel is nearing the end of its useful life.
Right now, I am delayed simply due to a lack of bullets. I only had the one box of Lapuas and have run out. Why I started testing MK's, etc.
If the bullets show up in time for Kamloops, the next set of testing will be at 300m to simulate the event.
Jerry
