Turkey Hunting a**hole Shot My Dog !!! ? Updated May 8 By 88 Man

It does not state what type of land, be it private or public. It states that it can't be done in an area where there is wildlife in the closed season, period! Don't read more into it than there is, those are how the laws are stated. I wouldn't want to take your argument to a CO. They don't need search warrants in Ontario. Only a good SUSPICION that game laws are being broken. SCARY but true. Welcome to Ontario, Yours to discover! :dancingbanana:

-Jason
 
thebuckhunter said:
I assume that 88man didn't have a permit and there are some form of game mammal or bird in the area. If I'm wrong, let me know but it seems that whomever shot the dog and whomever owned the dog were both at fault.

You might want to read 88 man's update that he posted this morning in his original post. Remember what they say about the word "assume."

88 man said:
This is updated on fact not fiction on tues may 8 !!!!!!!!!
I did talk to the land owner last night and he told me I WAS the ONLY one with permision to be on his property and that he had allready kicked 3 turkey hunters off his property since the season opened and one of the idiots tried to tell him HE WAS THE OWNER !.

#1- I WILL say my hounds will NOT CHASE turkeys as they live will both chickens and turkeys in their pens TOGETHER so they mean nothing to them period.Boney can testafy to that !
#2-The collar that was on the dog had a pellet in the ridio sending unit and the antena was cut off so the signal would only go at the most a 100 yds compaired to about 12 miles,ask anyone who has radio collars and they'll tell you this themselves.
#3- Even if my wife and I take our house dogs for a walk in the woods I put my tracking collars on them so I know where they are if they don't want to come back.
#3- The land owner heard the shot and knew it was on HIS PROPERY.I am 3/4 deaf so I would not hear a shot if it was more than about 200yrds away and I didn't have my hearing aids in and don't have them in when I take the hounds out,too costly to loose.This is why I couldn't tell how far the shot was but have the land owner to back me it was on his property.
#4- I have been feeding the coyotes there for yrs and there's 3 dens on the property.
#4- I HAVE a license to run my hounds in the summer for fox or coyotes during the day.This licence is FREE of charge at the local MNR office,I don't do anything ellegal and make sure I know what I'm doing is proper !
#5- These 2 beagles I took out was the first time they have ever been out of the pen ( other than loose around the house ).Anyone that knows anything about hounds knows that any young dog (6 mon old ) out of their pen for the first time ( even their 10th time ) WILL NOT RUN ANYTHING let alone go very far from their owner.All they want to do is play and explore and don't know what a deer,rabbit,fox or coyote scent is so wont chase anything ( see #1 ).
#6- I know for the reason given in #5 that there's no way possible these 2 beagles were doing anything wrong other than being beagles PERIOD ! This comes from about 25 yrs of raising hounds as other hound men will tell you as well !

I hope this clears things up that neither me or my hounds were doing anything wrong from start to shotgun wounded animal finish.The guy that did this was and is 100% in the wrong.I hope he has enough brains to keep his mouth shut.My hounds are treated like gold !.They are NOT JUST HOUNDS,
they ARE FAMILY and HUNTING BUDDIES.You f**k with my hounds,you f**k with me !
Would you shoot your hunting buddies !!!!!
Yours truly
88 man
 
It states that it can't be done in an area where there is wildlife in the closed season, period!

I don't believe that would apply to private land. I'm not sure the act can regulate that.

But - i'm more familiar with bc's laws than ontario. You might be right. Seems kinda silly tho - saying a guy can't let his dogs lose in his own backyard because there was a deer in it yesterday.
 
So what about the guys that let their dogs go on one concession road, then drive over to the next concession to try and cut them off. Chasing coyotes or foxes, etc.

I'm kinda pissed, cuz they are running their dogs right across my property as well as other private property that they don't have permission to hunt on.
 
Tresspassing is tresspassing, regardless of how they do it in my opinion. I could never shoot a dog unless it was rabbid or suffering. I'm not choosing sides on this issue. My land is my land and tresspass is tresspass. I stay off others' land and expect they do the same. I used to breed yellow labs but I'm not a fan of hunting with hounds for the simple reason that they MAY tresspass and ruin another person's hunt. Just my $0.02. If it's legal, by all means go for it, but control your dogs to stay off of property that you DO NOT have permission to hunt. Respect of other people and their property goes a long way.

-Jason
 
88 man said:
The animals these dogs were chasing must have been sick or something.After over 25 yrs raising hounds and hunting with them I have yet to see a wild animal with there tongue hanging out unless it was on a pole and I'm sure every hound man will tell you that as well.Wild animals are in the best of shape for running,this is what they do, naturally.So IMHO they must have been old or ready to kick the bucket anyways if this is the way it was.If a wild animal has had enough of being chased they will go to water where
88

I have seen more than one wild animal with its tounge hanging out from being chased by dogs. As I said before, zero sympathy.
 
Waterfowler said:
So what about the guys that let their dogs go on one concession road, then drive over to the next concession to try and cut them off. Chasing coyotes or foxes, etc.

I'm kinda pissed, cuz they are running their dogs right across my property as well as other private property that they don't have permission to hunt on.
CO's, according to the OFAH, will start enforcing trespass against dogs/owners this fall. The property owner has to catch the dog, photo the tag and call the MNR. Stay tuned.
 
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Started reading this and had to skip to the end - has the MNR been called and are they going to investigate? I'd certainly be looking hard at anyone who filled their turkey tag on the day of the shooting...
 
Brambles said:
Basically the points that I thought were interesting too, and one further one.

He had collars on his dogs, which I think is great, more people should have them. However is implies that he already knows his dogs have a habit of running away. And a later post says that it took some time to find her, which also sounds like the dog never did come back, he had to go and track her down.

Just some interesting points, you gonna call me names for them:rolleyes:

Having radio collars on hunting dogs isn't "evidence" that the dog misbehaves or isn't well trained!:rolleyes: Believe it or not, hounds, especially smaller examples like Beagles, can quite easily run into a rabbit slip, fox/coyote snare or some sort of lynx/fox/coyote set using a leg hold trap. Even in the offseason, not every rabbit hunter is conscientious enough to remove their rabbit snares at the end of hunting season. During hunting/trapping season, I usually take care to run my dogs in areas that aren't frequented that much by trappers. Being a trapper myself, helps in identifying those areas. Most Beagles will simple sit down and wait for their owner to come get them if they get a leg/shoulder caught in a snare. Its worse if they get caught by the muzzle, as their ability to vocalize is comprimised. . Its unusal to see them being caught by the neck, but it has happened. Thankfully, their collar saved them in that case. Its one reason why I always carry my Gerber multi-tool with me while hunting. If the dogs get into a fox/coyte snare, there isn't much you can do unless they're really close. By the time you get to them, the dogs will be dead. Popping them out of a leg hold trap is simple. Having a radio collar on them can mean the difference between a live or a dead dog.

Also, you have to realize that snowshoe hare, cotton tail rabbits can lead a pack of Beagles on a looping run that can take the dogs well over 1km away from the hunter before turning back toward him. That's a lot of territory to cover, especially in thick cover like what bunnies love. Finding a snared Beagle in multiple square kms of thick cover can be almost next to impossible. A good, large Beagle Bell works very well, but a radio collar is better, as you can track the dog directly to where he/she is. Many beagles won't yelp, bark, cry or struggle, once caught in a snare.:eek: Instead they often will sit quietly, or lie down if they can and wait for their owner to come get them. In cases like this, the sond of a Beagle bell can be a life saver. Same goes for a radio collar.

In any event, I think you may be confusing radio collars with training collars that deliver a shock to an animal via remote control. BTW, Aussie Cattle Dogs aren't in the same class as hunting dogs. The're working dogs and comparing the two is like comparing apples and oranges.

Since these were young dogs who weren't broken, I'm 99% sure that the beagles in question weren't harrassing any wildlife, other than running around, sniffing all the strange & wonderful smells to be found in the wild, albeit PRIVATE LAND. Given the circumstances I'm pretty confident that some tresspassing Asshat, saw a blur of movement and triggered a shot without identifying what he shot at. These are the same idiots that end up shooting fellow hunters each year.
 
Fall Guy said:
CO's, according to the OFAH, will start enforcing trespass against dogs/owners this fall. The property owner has to catch the dog, photo the tag and call the MNR. Stay tuned.

This has got to be one of the most stupid things that I have ever read.



There is a common agreement in the area where I hunt.If a dog comes to your camp/property and hangs around you tie it up.We report to other camps and the local store we have a dog.Someone will come get it.We do this for others and expect them to do the same for us.
Most people put a phone# or camp name on the tag.They either get a call or the dog delivered right to your camp.
No matter how good a houndsman you may think you are,if you do it for any length of time you will loose track of a dog FACT.

The only complainers we have here are from the city imports who have bought up property,and are obivious to this unwritten rule.In most of these cases I think the dogs have more sence than these morons.I suspect these to be LIBERALS.
 
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captonion said:
This has got to be one of the most stupid things that I have ever read.



There is a common agreement in the area where I hunt.If a dog comes to your camp/property and hangs around you tie it up.We report to other camps and the local store we have a dog.Someone will come get it.We do this for others and expect them to do the same for us.
Most people put a phone# or camp name on the tag.They either get a call or the dog delivered right to your camp.
No matter how good a houndsman you may think you are,if you do it for any length of time you will loose track of a dog FACT.

The only complainers we have here are from the city imports who have bought up property,and are obivious to this unwritten rule.In most of these cases I think the dogs have more sence than these morons.I suspect these to be LIBERALS.

OR NDPrs :D
reminds me of the time some NDP southerners moved into the country & walked thru their 100acres beating pots in hunting season to scare the dogs :rolleyes: Thanks :rockOn: But that's another story :p

I agree with Onion, I will however acknowledge there is a diff between S Ont & the rest of us, & they may have diff problems with private property & hunting.
While a big hound may run a deer close to exhaustion, it must be because there's no water present!
A beagle like mine standing 12 or so inches to the top of it's back is neither fast enough nor in any kind of way likely to ever run down a deer! The deer I have watched ahead of the dog quite often stops & watchs it over it's shoulder :)
 
If a man can run down a deer, a dog easily can. Deer are sprinters and do not have the stamina to outrun a constant steady "trailer". There is a famous hunter family in Vermont that use this tactic of trailing and walking down large bucks successfully every year.
 
There is another very good reason why some run tracking collars. Not all people are as honest as we would like to believe, stealing a good hunting dog anytime but especially in hunting season, sadly happens more than we like. Next camp to us use collars & have tracked a dog right to a shed behind the house after the owner proclaims to know nothing about any dog! :mad:

There's a bunch of low life's up Paugh Lk Rd that hunt close to us that are notorious dog stealers among other things, I hate Cut Worms!!
 
Woodsman said:
If a man can run down a deer, a dog easily can. Deer are sprinters and do not have the stamina to outrun a constant steady "trailer". There is a famous hunter family in Vermont that use this tactic of trailing and walking down large bucks successfully every year.

How can a man run down a deer :rolleyes:
How do you keep it in sight to know where it's headed :confused:
That's about the most ridiculious statement I ever heard :p
I see in your last line it's changed to "walking down large bucks"

I think you mean you can follow a deer & get a shot, most hunters have done this especially if you jump one & take note of it fleeing direction or have a little snow!
But to say a man can run down a deer is just plain ludicrus :onCrack:
 
to Quote captonion
"There is a common agreement in the area where I hunt.If a dog comes to your camp/property and hangs around you tie it up.We report to other camps and the local store we have a dog.Someone will come get it.We do this for others and expect them to do the same for us.
Most people put a phone# or camp name on the tag.They either get a call or the dog delivered right to your camp.
No matter how good a houndsman you may think you are,if you do it for any length of time you will loose track of a dog FACT.

The only complainers we have here are from the city imports who have bought up property,and are obivious to this unwritten rule.In most of these cases I think the dogs have more sence than these morons.I suspect these to be LIBERALS."

Do you have no respect for others' property? Tresspassing is tresspassing. If the "city dwellers" don't want hounds on their property, will you not respect their wishes? Who's the asshat here? The unwritten rule? If someone doesn't want you or your dogs on their property, then you are tresspassing, that is what you are doing. PERIOD! Maybe I should put no tresspassing signs around my property written in dog, as in your opinion, dogs are smarter than most city hunters.

-Jason
 
thebuckhunter said:
to Quote captonion
"There is a common agreement in the area where I hunt.If a dog comes to your camp/property and hangs around you tie it up.We report to other camps and the local store we have a dog.Someone will come get it.We do this for others and expect them to do the same for us.
Most people put a phone# or camp name on the tag.They either get a call or the dog delivered right to your camp.
No matter how good a houndsman you may think you are,if you do it for any length of time you will loose track of a dog FACT.

The only complainers we have here are from the city imports who have bought up property,and are obivious to this unwritten rule.In most of these cases I think the dogs have more sence than these morons.I suspect these to be LIBERALS."

Do you have no respect for others' property? Tresspassing is tresspassing. If the "city dwellers" don't want hounds on their property, will you not respect their wishes? Who's the asshat here? The unwritten rule? If someone doesn't want you or your dogs on their property, then you are tresspassing, that is what you are doing. PERIOD! Maybe I should put no tresspassing signs around my property written in dog, as in your opinion, dogs are smarter than most city hunters.

-Jason


I gotta agree with this. I don't want guys running their dogs across my property. Plain and simple. I have no problem with dogs or with hunting. But I bought my property to have my own private area to hunt, watch, etc, etc.

The dude here is going to get one more warning this year, if he starts again. Maybe even a registered letter. But if he continues, .........................
 
Waterfowler said:
I gotta agree with this. I don't want guys running their dogs across my property. Plain and simple. I have no problem with dogs or with hunting. But I bought my property to have my own private area to hunt, watch, etc, etc.
Me too and there's a huge difference between someone whose dog gets away from him and someone who deliberately runs their dogs on property that doesn't belong to them.

So who's worse here? The transplanted city dweller who wants to use his property as he sees fit or the long time rural resident who doesn't respect people's right to not have to put up with tresspassers whether they are four-legged or two?
 
Do you have no respect for others' property? Tresspassing is tresspassing. If the "city dwellers" don't want hounds on their property, will you not respect their wishes? Who's the asshat here? The unwritten rule? If someone doesn't want you or your dogs on their property, then you are tresspassing, that is what you are doing. PERIOD! Maybe I should put no tresspassing signs around my property written in dog, as in your opinion, dogs are smarter than most city hunters.

-Jason[/QUOTE]

BEFORE you run around calling people asshats, you should make an attempt to understand & comprehend what he's talking about :rolleyes:

As I pointed out above " I will however acknowledge there is a diff between S Ont & the rest of us,"
No-one has advocated runnin any dogs on any NO TRESSPASSING property.
We hunt & run our dogs on crown & "Private Property" & yes there is a BIG difference between Private Property & No Tresspassing. Most of the hunt camps up here sit on Private Property but that doesn't mean No Tresspassing!
Besides no-one up here would intentionally run our dogs into some-one elses hunt. When a dog does follow a deer onto another hunt territory, No biggy as also pointed out above by Captonion
"There is a common agreement in the area where I hunt.If a dog comes to your camp/property and hangs around you tie it up.We report to other camps and the local store we have a dog. Someone will come get it. We do this for others and expect them to do the same for us."
 
No we dont run the dogs on NO TRESPASSING property on purpose.Dogs do sometimes chase a deer the wrong way,get by the watchers and go a little too far and on to these areas.Big friggin whoop.
Should have looked into this before you bought the property,and brought your big city NDP/LIBERAL ways and bi-laws here to torment the many generation residents already here.WE THANK YOU

Then there are the ones who hunt thier own little piece of propery and benifit from all the hunters around them using dogs but cry foul when a dog runs on the property.If they say that the hound hunters around them dont push deer into thier area they are Liars.

I know of a hunter(relative) who was covicted of shooting two dogs on his propety some time ago during hunting season.I dont think he has guns to this day.Rightfuly so.

And you thebuckhunter are very entertaining in a village idiot kind of way.
Nice to know you can speak/write in dog though.
 
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