The NEW KING is taking off!
- Thread starter Gatehouse
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troutseeker
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Prince George, BC
With the .375 Ruger you only need one round per animal, no need for ultra capacity mags.
Or longish barrels to achieve any sort of acceptable velocity...
Ruger hunters store their firearms unloaded so it's hard to keep all the ammo you'd need in a season in the mag box...
58 to go!
Or longish barrels to achieve any sort of acceptable velocity...Ruger hunters store their firearms unloaded so it's hard to keep all the ammo you'd need in a season in the mag box...
58 to go!
Ardent
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
With the .375 Ruger you only need one round per animal, no need for ultra capacity mags.
Ruger hunters store their firearms unloaded so it's hard to keep all the ammo you'd need in a season in the mag box...
58 to go!
When this guy's looking at you from 25 yards, you might have different perceptions on magazine capacity! The record for hits before a Cape Buffalo went down with my PH was 17 rounds, many of them to the vitals, and many of those were .458 Win Mags. If their adrenaline gets up, and you don't hit brain or spinal cord, well the more rounds the better! As for "any sort of acceptable velocity" I purposely chose a load that limited my 300gr TSXs to 2,500fps, a somewhat mild load, did just swell.
troutseeker
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Prince George, BC
My that is a hornery looking beast. 17 rounds, wow! Do they make banana clips for African rifles?
56 to go.
56 to go.
Thanks for the advice. My main all-purpose do-everything rifle is a braked 300RUM. Double ear protection on the range. Zero hunting. I've experienced one ringing of the ears with it. The muzzle was close to an old wooden grain bin I used for cover to sneak closer to a good buck. At the shot the some of the sound wave reflected back. WOW!
Had tinitus for close to an hour. Buck dropped, I almost dropped, 'nuff said.I'm thinking of investing in a set of Game Ears to allow me safer muzzle brake use in the field. And besides, I can hear a 375 calling my name.......
You need more than 4 rounds of .375 to kill something?
No but I do enjoy pounding the bullets.
Ardent
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
You need more than 4 rounds of .375 to kill something?
Yes. In Africa, frequently. #1 gun you see in the hands of PH's in Africa is a BRNO 602, 7 rounds of .375 H&H on tap (6 down, 1 up), or 6 rounds of .458 Lott (5 down, 1 up). My PH has a dislike for any gun that won't hold 4 magnums or better in the mag box, "why not just get a double then?".
Ardent
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Not at all, just much tougher animals. The ribs on buffalo are overlapping, and up to a couple inches thick, basically an armour plate. It acts just like a small tree in front of your shot; the bullet may not punch through those ribs and go where you planned it to in the vitals, being deflected off to another less critical place in the animal. The ungulates there also have a lot more time on the oxygen in their system, and a double lung hit doesn't do what it does at home. Plus, the buffalo has a far tougher nervous system than anything we're used to over here, due to years of evolution surviving attacks by predators, REAL predators, and rebounding from the damage. There's a good video on youtube, called "Battle at Kruger", that shows just how tough a Cape Buffalo is. A Cape Buffalo calf, quite young, gets hauled down and dragged away by a pride of lions beside a river. The lions knaw and maul the crap out of this calf, get chased down by the buffalo herd, and in ensuing minutes the lions and calf get edged closer and closer to the water. Then, a massive Nile crocodile lunges out and seizes the calf, and a pride of lions and a nile crocodile play tug of war with the calf for a good while. Ultimately, the croc lets go, and the herd fights the lion pride away, and the calf GETS UP and walks back to the herd!
The other issue is, you're typically where the buffalo best like to be, in thick bush and thorns, called jess. The stuff is brutal for deflecting shots, especially if a buffalo starts running through it and you're forced to shoot at it. A lot of North American hunters get the wrong idea about African hunting, including myself before I went over. I thought it was hype, over-excitement, sure they're bigger but they're just ungulates etc etc... now I understand. Those animals are FAR tough than what we have, and a lot less afraid of you. The shooting's closer, faster, and harder. Mag capacity means something real over there, and it's not because of poor shooting. The vitals on African game, even despite nastier bone arrangements like overlapping ribs, are much harder to get at, being higher and more behind the mass of muscle and bone in the shoulder than we're used to. Those bones are much bigger, and heavier too, and the hide an inch thick of pure leather.
Here's Giraffe hide, no fat in the if you heat it up, it just gets tougher. Cape Buffalo skin's even heavier, and messes up even good bullets on entry. My first 300gr TSX into the buffalo actually broke up, lost all four petals, keeping just a short shank of core, first time I've seen a TSX come apart like that.
Here's an Impala I heart shot, maybe a 130lb animal, or a hair more, small. Note the higher and more forward behind the mass of the shoulder location of the heart compared to NA game. Hit it through the heart with a 270gr TSX out of my .375 H&H, completely destroying the heart, and blowing the opposite leg/shoulder into a flapping appendage. A 130lb animal, that just took a 270gr TSX through the heart, STILL ran into the jess with no blood pressure, and three legs, after a springing leap at the shot. I actually was wondering if I'd missed, but a second later could see the blood on the ground from the rise I was on a hundred yards back. There's a will to live over there that will perplex North American hunters, I guarantee it... This is to say nothing of the Wildebeest I double lunged with through and through 270gr SP, sprinted and kept going like nothing happened, and kept going, and going...
The other issue is, you're typically where the buffalo best like to be, in thick bush and thorns, called jess. The stuff is brutal for deflecting shots, especially if a buffalo starts running through it and you're forced to shoot at it. A lot of North American hunters get the wrong idea about African hunting, including myself before I went over. I thought it was hype, over-excitement, sure they're bigger but they're just ungulates etc etc... now I understand. Those animals are FAR tough than what we have, and a lot less afraid of you. The shooting's closer, faster, and harder. Mag capacity means something real over there, and it's not because of poor shooting. The vitals on African game, even despite nastier bone arrangements like overlapping ribs, are much harder to get at, being higher and more behind the mass of muscle and bone in the shoulder than we're used to. Those bones are much bigger, and heavier too, and the hide an inch thick of pure leather.
Here's Giraffe hide, no fat in the if you heat it up, it just gets tougher. Cape Buffalo skin's even heavier, and messes up even good bullets on entry. My first 300gr TSX into the buffalo actually broke up, lost all four petals, keeping just a short shank of core, first time I've seen a TSX come apart like that.
Here's an Impala I heart shot, maybe a 130lb animal, or a hair more, small. Note the higher and more forward behind the mass of the shoulder location of the heart compared to NA game. Hit it through the heart with a 270gr TSX out of my .375 H&H, completely destroying the heart, and blowing the opposite leg/shoulder into a flapping appendage. A 130lb animal, that just took a 270gr TSX through the heart, STILL ran into the jess with no blood pressure, and three legs, after a springing leap at the shot. I actually was wondering if I'd missed, but a second later could see the blood on the ground from the rise I was on a hundred yards back. There's a will to live over there that will perplex North American hunters, I guarantee it... This is to say nothing of the Wildebeest I double lunged with through and through 270gr SP, sprinted and kept going like nothing happened, and kept going, and going...
I've been interested in African hunting for some time, just haven't got there yet. So much hunting to do in BC, it eats up most of my time.
However, I've looked into it quite a bit and I have conversed with many African hunters via intraweb for years. On buffalo, I know about the thick hide, overlapping ribs and how the circulatory system can keep going even after there has been a tremendous drop in blood pressure, and I've always heard about how "tough" African animals are.
I've also heard quite a few fairly experienced African hunters (Finn Aagard was one of them) mention that African animals die like any other animal if you put holes in the correct places.
I also mentioned Saeed from AR's buffalo hunting experience, and I've probably seen him kill about 40-50 buffalo on video. Almost all of them fell to 1-3 shots, many times it was one shot and a finisher.
Also, many rifles get used in hunting in Africa, and only a few of them have a 6 round capacity! The Brno 602 is popular among PH's because it's an affordable and available quality CRF rifle.
Your impala example is a very interesting example of African animals dying like any other with correct shot placement, and I will show you why:
last year I shot this blacktail deer at about 20 feet with almost the exact same load as you (.375 Ruger, 270gr TSX bullet) and with virtually identical shot placement. ( You can see the entrance hole on it's shoulder) and in similar conditions to what you describe (very thick cover)
This deer is a little bit bigger than your impala, but not much.....And after I shot him, he swapped ends and hightailed it into thick cover and I had to go find him- Just like your impala!
Anyways, I won't be too worried about hunting in Africa with only a measly 4 rounds in my rifle. And I bet you weren't too worried about the magazine capacity of your RSM, either
However, I've looked into it quite a bit and I have conversed with many African hunters via intraweb for years. On buffalo, I know about the thick hide, overlapping ribs and how the circulatory system can keep going even after there has been a tremendous drop in blood pressure, and I've always heard about how "tough" African animals are.
I've also heard quite a few fairly experienced African hunters (Finn Aagard was one of them) mention that African animals die like any other animal if you put holes in the correct places.
I also mentioned Saeed from AR's buffalo hunting experience, and I've probably seen him kill about 40-50 buffalo on video. Almost all of them fell to 1-3 shots, many times it was one shot and a finisher.
Also, many rifles get used in hunting in Africa, and only a few of them have a 6 round capacity! The Brno 602 is popular among PH's because it's an affordable and available quality CRF rifle.
Your impala example is a very interesting example of African animals dying like any other with correct shot placement, and I will show you why:
last year I shot this blacktail deer at about 20 feet with almost the exact same load as you (.375 Ruger, 270gr TSX bullet) and with virtually identical shot placement. ( You can see the entrance hole on it's shoulder) and in similar conditions to what you describe (very thick cover)
This deer is a little bit bigger than your impala, but not much.....And after I shot him, he swapped ends and hightailed it into thick cover and I had to go find him- Just like your impala!
Anyways, I won't be too worried about hunting in Africa with only a measly 4 rounds in my rifle. And I bet you weren't too worried about the magazine capacity of your RSM, either
Ardent
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
Nice buck Gate, and I have to concede, my Buff dropped to the first shot, falling to his knees/side against a tree, albeit with a destroyed 300gr TSX. I simply trust my PH's shooting skill with regards to good/bad shooting and his 17 round buffalo (does a lot of culling, watched him drop an Impala at a true 350 yards with his -06 like it was routine), and his nightmare buffalo experiences where they just don't die resonated with me. You're quite right, my 4 rounds down had me satisfied, though I would have liked a 5th (just sold my 602 .375 as well, though it's still in my possession, and this talk risks me getting misty eyed!). I'm also forced to admit, I'd carry a .375 Ruger happily in Africa and feel perfectly prepared, as I mentioned. It's a fine cartridge, better than the vast majority of new whiz bangs. Attacks on the .375 H&H however just sting like attacks on family... If I ever build a .375 on a Mauser, I have to say, it would be a .375 Ruger. More likely I'll build a .404 Jeffery though, but it's one of those guns that's hard to justify owning... African hunting's not going to become a hobby of mine, it was an experience, that I may repeat one day, but my hunting won't be planned around it now the trip's over. So, with that sentiment, the .375 Ruger looks quite a swell cartridge to me.
If I ever build a .375 on a Mauser, I have to say, it would be a .375 Ruger. More likely I'll build a .404 Jeffery though, but it's one of those guns that's hard to justify owning... African hunting's not going to become a hobby of mine, it was an experience, that I may repeat one day, but my hunting won't be planned around it now the trip's over. So, with that sentiment, the .375 Ruger looks quite a swell cartridge to me.troutseeker
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Prince George, BC
I wanted to add dancing banana's to the reference to banana clips, just did not push my luck...
I wonder what Mauser one would use to build a .375 Ruger on? I may do just that, or simply go buy an Alaskan.
42 to go.
I wonder what Mauser one would use to build a .375 Ruger on? I may do just that, or simply go buy an Alaskan.
42 to go.
Johnn Peterson
CGN Ultra frequent flyer
- Location
- Chemainus B.C.
Not at all, just much tougher animals. The ribs on buffalo are overlapping, and up to a couple inches thick, basically an armour plate. It acts just like a small tree in front of your shot; the bullet may not punch through those ribs and go where you planned it to in the vitals, being deflected off to another less critical place in the animal. The ungulates there also have a lot more time on the oxygen in their system, and a double lung hit doesn't do what it does at home. Plus, the buffalo has a far tougher nervous system than anything we're used to over here, due to years of evolution surviving attacks by predators, REAL predators, and rebounding from the damage. There's a good video on youtube, called "Battle at Kruger", that shows just how tough a Cape Buffalo is. A Cape Buffalo calf, quite young, gets hauled down and dragged away by a pride of lions beside a river. The lions knaw and maul the crap out of this calf, get chased down by the buffalo herd, and in ensuing minutes the lions and calf get edged closer and closer to the water. Then, a massive Nile crocodile lunges out and seizes the calf, and a pride of lions and a nile crocodile play tug of war with the calf for a good while. Ultimately, the croc lets go, and the herd fights the lion pride away, and the calf GETS UP and walks back to the herd!
The other issue is, you're typically where the buffalo best like to be, in thick bush and thorns, called jess. The stuff is brutal for deflecting shots, especially if a buffalo starts running through it and you're forced to shoot at it. A lot of North American hunters get the wrong idea about African hunting, including myself before I went over. I thought it was hype, over-excitement, sure they're bigger but they're just ungulates etc etc... now I understand. Those animals are FAR tough than what we have, and a lot less afraid of you. The shooting's closer, faster, and harder. Mag capacity means something real over there, and it's not because of poor shooting. The vitals on African game, even despite nastier bone arrangements like overlapping ribs, are much harder to get at, being higher and more behind the mass of muscle and bone in the shoulder than we're used to. Those bones are much bigger, and heavier too, and the hide an inch thick of pure leather.
Here's Giraffe hide, no fat in the if you heat it up, it just gets tougher. Cape Buffalo skin's even heavier, and messes up even good bullets on entry. My first 300gr TSX into the buffalo actually broke up, lost all four petals, keeping just a short shank of core, first time I've seen a TSX come apart like that.
Here's an Impala I heart shot, maybe a 130lb animal, or a hair more, small. Note the higher and more forward behind the mass of the shoulder location of the heart compared to NA game. Hit it through the heart with a 270gr TSX out of my .375 H&H, completely destroying the heart, and blowing the opposite leg/shoulder into a flapping appendage. A 130lb animal, that just took a 270gr TSX through the heart, STILL ran into the jess with no blood pressure, and three legs, after a springing leap at the shot. I actually was wondering if I'd missed, but a second later could see the blood on the ground from the rise I was on a hundred yards back. There's a will to live over there that will perplex North American hunters, I guarantee it... This is to say nothing of the Wildebeest I double lunged with through and through 270gr SP, sprinted and kept going like nothing happened, and kept going, and going...
Sounds like 'some' trip and quite the experience. Last year our Daughter and Son In Law spent a month hunting in Africa. All indications are they had a great hunt and a most memorable experience. Much of their trip details including pictures were posted in the Hunting forum under the thread, 1st Trip To Africa....Dialup bewarned, posted by graylake, 08-26-2009.
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